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  • FIRST POST
    • molokoid
    • By molokoid 29th Jun 08, 5:46 PM
    • 22Posts
    • 14Thanks
    molokoid
    Bulk LPG - Cheapest suppliers / supply route?
    • #1
    • 29th Jun 08, 5:46 PM
    Bulk LPG - Cheapest suppliers / supply route? 29th Jun 08 at 5:46 PM
    Hi all,

    Moved into a house in Jan that has a bulk LPG tank, which was previously supplied (and the tank is owned by) Calor. The contract they were really keen for me to sign was quite a restrictive lock in one and after speaking and a bit of negotiating they dropped the standing charge and discounted the pence per litre by 12%. This only made me sceptical that they had a lot of fat in the price anyway and there seems to be limited information available on the net about bulk lpg supply (lots of websites that will find you the cheapest supply for a fee!). Seems to be crying out for a MSE article if there are enough bulk lpg owners out there.

    Anyway, i read that there is some sort of regulation coming into the market which allows me to choose the supplier i wish and in turn they buy the tank off the previous owners. This seems to be a more market competitive way of doing it, but i can't find out when this is due to happen.

    Are there any bulk lpg owners out there that can give me some advice?

    TIA
Page 158
    • Cottage Economy
    • By Cottage Economy 10th Aug 18, 1:33 PM
    • 979 Posts
    • 4,069 Thanks
    Cottage Economy
    Did you mean to post this under "Cheaper Oil for Fuel" rather than the "Bulk LPG" topic that this thread is about?
    Originally posted by Mister G
    Yes, indeed I did! Not even sure what I was doing on this thread...I thought I was on the other one.
    'Save 12k in 2018' 4500/6,000 (75%)


    "...success in personal finance isn't about mastering the technicalities. It is about mastering yourself."
    • Ozzysmate
    • By Ozzysmate 10th Aug 18, 5:37 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 53 Thanks
    Ozzysmate
    Hi all,
    Anyway, i read that there is some sort of regulation coming into the market which allows me to choose the supplier i wish and in turn they buy the tank off the previous owners. This seems to be a more market competitive way of doing it, but i can't find out when this is due to happen.

    Are there any bulk lpg owners out there that can give me some advice?

    TIA
    Originally posted by molokoid
    Best advice is read through this thread. It's all been discussed at length.
    • Skools_Out
    • By Skools_Out 10th Aug 18, 5:45 PM
    • 244 Posts
    • 86 Thanks
    Skools_Out
    Best advice is read through this thread. It's all been discussed at length.
    Originally posted by Ozzysmate
    Ah, but all this iunformation wasn't here when the post you quoted was fisrt posted 10 years ago

    Still, after 10 years of posts, it's good to hear that MSEers have now answered the question.

    Indeed, as the OP has not visited this site for the last 9 months, presumably the OP now has the answer ... or given up all hope.

    Still, thank you for your invaluable post to this thread...especially as you, yourself, have returned to MSE after 2 years absence, just to post again in this thread, that you previously have posted in

    Anyone know when we go back to skool? It's a long, long summer, innit?
    Last edited by Skools_Out; 10-08-2018 at 5:48 PM.
    • Ozzysmate
    • By Ozzysmate 10th Aug 18, 5:52 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 53 Thanks
    Ozzysmate
    Ah, but all this iunformation wasn't here when the post you quoted was fisrt posted 10 years ago

    Still, after 10 years of posts, it's good to hear that MSEers have now answered the question.

    Indeed, as the OP has not visited this site for the last 9 months, presumably the OP now has the answer ... or given up all hope.

    Still, thank you for your invaluable post to this thread...especially as you, yourself, have returned to MSE after 2 years absence, just to post again in this thread, that you previously have posted in

    Anyone know when we go back to skool? It's a long, long summer, innit?
    Originally posted by Skools_Out
    Oh Dear

    There I was reading through the last few posts and the top one was what started it all. Unfortunately I didn't notice the posting date and this is the only forum I use that has this format.

    Nevertheless. I screwed up
    • JerryW
    • By JerryW 14th Aug 18, 10:52 AM
    • 94 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    JerryW
    .... Does anybody know if there is a governing body that I should complain to. It may be relevant to the pricing, my postcode is KY in Fife, also my quotes were through LPG Compare, very helpful people.
    Originally posted by Iainip
    Ian, see post #3083 on p155 of this forum .. do have a go and see how you get on. I also recommend Resolver as a good tool for complaining .. companies seem to take notice of it. Good luck!
    • JerryW
    • By JerryW 14th Aug 18, 10:59 AM
    • 94 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    JerryW
    So, I am out of contract as of yesterday. Woldlink have given me an offer of 32.9p/l fixed for 12 months and then 3p cap per 6 month period in the second year. Plus 66pa rental.
    I have spoken to Rose Gas (very nice lady but only 38p/l) Calor Gas (only for old times sake; an abrupt young man, with a take it or leave it attitude. 36.9p/l) Avanti (but the Woldlink offer is using them and they knew all about it so nothing different. LPG Save, not answering their phone; message left.. I was going to contact Extra Fuel but their website is showing a price of 51.29p so there didn't seem much point.

    This seems to be rather a seller's market at the moment. Nobody wanted to talk about free gas at all. Before I accept the avanti quote, which is starting to look quite competitive, does anyone have any other ideas or suggestions? I am in mid-Kent.
    • LittleVermin
    • By LittleVermin 14th Aug 18, 10:38 PM
    • 686 Posts
    • 678 Thanks
    LittleVermin
    Extrafuel price
    So, I am out of contract as of yesterday. Woldlink have given me an offer of 32.9p/l fixed for 12 months and then 3p cap per 6 month period in the second year. Plus 66pa rental.
    I have spoken to Rose Gas (very nice lady but only 38p/l) Calor Gas (only for old times sake; an abrupt young man, with a take it or leave it attitude. 36.9p/l) Avanti (but the Woldlink offer is using them and they knew all about it so nothing different. LPG Save, not answering their phone; message left.. I was going to contact Extra Fuel but their website is showing a price of 51.29p so there didn't seem much point.
    <snip>, does anyone have any other ideas or suggestions? I am in mid-Kent.
    Originally posted by JerryW
    Why Extrafuel post those crazy prices I do not know! Yes, they may be competitive compared to some of the rip-off prices from the majors .... but I suggest giving them a ring. I'm with Extrafuel and I'm paying 33ppl, on a 2yr contract, fixed in February for year 1 (that's the 33ppl, then max 3.5 in any 6 months). I have been with them since 2010 - no complaints! Flogas delivers but I deal with Extrafuel (humans - with names!).

    The only reason I can think why they now post those high prices is because in the past they - and other independents - have complained that ANY quotes they give will ALWAYS be undercut by the majors who know they can jack up prices in year 2 ...or if that somehow fails then the 'loss-making' price will be vastly compensated for by all the people - usually loyal customers - paying vast prices. Whatever happens the majors still keep their volumes and keep the indies small ...which is why the CC [Competition Commission] ruling way back hasn't worked. And now of course the indies are being bought up by Flogas, Avanti,...without any action by the CMA [Competition & Markets Authority]. As (many!) others have said the whole thing stinks. Mercaptan anyone? (that's the smelly chemical they add to odourless LPG, I believe).

    Good luck!
    • LittleVermin
    • By LittleVermin 14th Aug 18, 11:01 PM
    • 686 Posts
    • 678 Thanks
    LittleVermin
    FLOGAS rip-off ...and maybe what to do about it.
    Hi I'm new to the forum, and not very familiar with how forums work so if there's mistakes please let me know. In reply to Sugarloaf I've also had a severe price hike for year 2 of my contract. I've just had a conversation with Flogas my supplier. The bottom line is my gas price was 0.3809ppl in April, and they applied an increase of 15.4p making it 53.49ppl, which was due to me coming out of 1st fixed year of contract, they have now applied a 7.5p increase making it 60.99ppl, a 60% increase on my original price in April. They have no interest in being helpful with the price, this despite the fact that I quoted 2 offers 36.9ppl from Calor and 34ppl from Avanti, the Calor offer capped at 2.5p in year 2. I then asked about a contract termination penalty, to get out of the contract, and was told that there was no option to do that. I have been with them in the various company changes for 30 years, but I won't be staying with them. Does anybody know if there is a governing body that I should complain to. It may be relevant to the pricing, my postcode is KY in Fife, also my quotes were through LPG Compare, very helpful people.
    Originally posted by Iainip
    Summary:

    FLOGAS year 1: 38.09ppl
    ............year 2: 53.49 for ?3months, then 60.99

    and you've been a loyal customer for 30 years!

    Please contact the Utilities ADR (see my post 1083 - as Jerry mentioned) and let us know how you get on. No-one has reported back so far .....and that maybe because Flogas gets (successful) complainants to sign non-disclosure agreements! You couldn't make this xxxx up! You could also contact the complaints pages of a national newspaper (the DT and Guardian have both run stories about bulk LPG rip-offs). Or to R4's "You and yours" ...as a follow up (though the original story was about leaving customers with no gas...and having useless information procedures).
    • JerryW
    • By JerryW 15th Aug 18, 11:00 AM
    • 94 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    JerryW
    .... I'm with Extrafuel and I'm paying 33ppl, on a 2yr contract, fixed in February for year 1 (that's the 33ppl, then max 3.5 in any 6 months). I have been with them since 2010 - no complaints! Flogas delivers but I deal with Extrafuel (humans - with names!). ...
    Good luck!
    Originally posted by LittleVermin
    Thank you .. I will ring them and report back. What is your experience of year 2 price rises with them, LV?
    • JerryW
    • By JerryW 15th Aug 18, 1:16 PM
    • 94 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    JerryW
    .. spoke to Extra Fuel, they are offering 36p/l first year, 3 1/2p each 6m thereafter, 75pa tank rental, and 100 credit. The person I spoke to was not interested in negotiation and when I mentioned Avanti told me to be careful because (he claimed) their 3p/6 month rises ramped up throughout the whole 2yr period so after 12 months the price could go up 9p.

    I don't know if that is true - but I do know that these contracts are a nightmare and seem to do nothing to limit the increases that can be applied, as posts above demonstrate. Really the dice here are so loaded against the consumer, aren't they? Somebody else I spoke to said that Flogas and Calor Gas had actually broken thousands and thousands of contracts - as many as 50,000 was mentioned - by applying bigger rises than the contracts allowed for. That leaves the poor punter free to point out the breach and claim the right to move elsewhere, but of course few do, and they rely on that. Unethical, or what? Does Martin Lewis ever see this thread I wonder? I will try to bring it to his attention, I am getting quite steamed up now!
    • NorfolkG
    • By NorfolkG 21st Aug 18, 2:16 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    NorfolkG
    We went out of contract with Calor back in February but as we didn't need any gas, thought I'd wait for the good weather and hopefully a better price. At that time they offered me 35p fixed for 1 year, no idea what the second year would hold! I phoned today armed with info from this excellent forum. At first they offered 34.5ppl fixed only until 31st March, and they were not interested in discussing anything else without a proper quote to beat! Annoyed.
    • Iainip
    • By Iainip 26th Aug 18, 1:53 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Iainip
    Flogas
    Thanks to all who have replied and commented on my earlier post. I have started going down the road suggested by Little Vermin using ADR. They require that I have written to Flogas first, currently awaiting a response from Flogas in writing. Will keep you all informed of progress.
    • JerryW
    • By JerryW 28th Aug 18, 10:38 AM
    • 94 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    JerryW
    Spoke to Extrafuel who offered me 36p/l + 100 credit + 75pa tank rental + 3.5p max rise per 6 months.
    So nothing has matched the Avanti offer of 32.9p/l fixed for 12 m + max 3p rise per 6 months thereafter and I have sent off the forms today.
    A very nice man came to view the tank and leave the forms, and he confirmed that the 3p rise only applies once the fixed period is over so the max rise in the 6 months following the fix is 3p not 9p as Extra Fuel claimed.
    Fingers crossed that Avanti remain good people to deal with! I shall miss Woldlink, whose customer service was second-to-none.
    • Deastons
    • By Deastons 3rd Sep 18, 4:46 PM
    • 375 Posts
    • 212 Thanks
    Deastons
    Does anyone use Flogas?

    We're currently with Calor. I've filled-in Flogas' online form twice, but no-one has called. I called them and was told someone would be in touch "within 48hrs" to do a site visit. Two weeks later I called again and was told they'd definitely call me that day. That was over a week ago.

    Are they always this useless? If they're this bad when I'm trying to become a customer, I can't imagine how they are once they've got you in a contract.
    • Brennus
    • By Brennus 4th Sep 18, 7:10 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Brennus
    2 year contract 29/3/17 started with 32ppl, just received 3rd increase letter now saying the latest price is 61.34ppl. I spoke to Flogas who were not at all interested, saying I have to see out my contract. The original contract stated the price was fixed for 9 months. The price hikes started on 5/2/18. Do not make the mistake I made by not knowing their pricing policy after the fixed period until the end of the contract. Its going to be a cold winter.
    • Mister G
    • By Mister G 4th Sep 18, 10:20 AM
    • 740 Posts
    • 437 Thanks
    Mister G
    Just ordered 1000 litres from my local independent (HBS) at 30ppl + VAT

    Looking at some of the other prices quoted recently on this forum, it looks like I'm on a pretty good deal.
    • makeni555
    • By makeni555 5th Sep 18, 9:34 PM
    • 36 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    makeni555
    Not sure if this is of any use to many members, but anyone out of contract with Flogas or thinking of moving, they will do a fixed price for the full 2 year contract - but you have to push a little harder and they go and 'get manager approval'.

    We moved from Calor in July 2017 and are on a 31p+VAT fixed contract for 2 years (+100 free gas). I know its no use to those in contract, but for anyone else - do ask for it.

    We simply said we found the caps and incremental rises to confusing and to average it out and then charge a flat rate (originally it was something like 27p for 1 year then 3p rises every few months after, but I found it easier to budget knowing there would be no price changes for 2 years
    Last edited by makeni555; 05-09-2018 at 9:35 PM. Reason: type
    • chubbs85240
    • By chubbs85240 9th Sep 18, 12:41 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 29 Thanks
    chubbs85240
    So nothing has matched the Avanti offer of 32.9p/l fixed for 12 m + max 3p rise per 6 months thereafter and I have sent off the forms today.
    Originally posted by JerryW
    Interesting, as Avanti just wrote to me to say that as they have been absorbing the increase in costs to supply LPG, they have felt it necessary to increase their prices.

    I was on 28p fixed for 1 year with max 3p increase each 6 months thereafter. Just finished the fixed period and hit with 10.3p increase!

    I assume I can get out of my contract? Also can anyone confirm if the wholesale LPG costs have gone up recently? There used to be a regular graph but I can't see it

    Thanks
    • JerryW
    • By JerryW 10th Sep 18, 11:11 AM
    • 94 Posts
    • 54 Thanks
    JerryW
    QUOTE=chubbs85240;74767560]...
    I was on 28p fixed for 1 year with max 3p increase each 6 months thereafter. Just finished the fixed period and hit with 10.3p increase!
    I assume I can get out of my contract? Also can anyone confirm if the wholesale LPG costs have gone up recently? There used to be a regular graph but I can't see it
    Thanks[/QUOTE]

    .. probably not, as your contract specifically allows such increases, see above.
    What you can do is ask Avanti to justify the increase in writing, by specific reference to the underlying indices the contract mentions. If they don't or can't, then prima facie they have broken the contract. It would be interesting then, to see if a new supplier would accept a transfer!
    • chubbs85240
    • By chubbs85240 10th Sep 18, 1:17 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 29 Thanks
    chubbs85240
    .. probably not, as your contract specifically allows such increases, see above.
    What you can do is ask Avanti to justify the increase in writing, by specific reference to the underlying indices the contract mentions. If they don't or can't, then prima facie they have broken the contract. It would be interesting then, to see if a new supplier would accept a transfer!
    Originally posted by JerryW


    Thanks Jerry.


    Thanks to this thread, I have saved a fortune over the last few years, and I have already asked Avantigas for this proof.


    When I called up, I was told to go to the Nasdaq's website and look at the cost of Brent Crude Oil. I was then told, there is no way they would just increase the cost for the sake of it


    I told them this was not sufficient and I wanted the proof that the increase to me of 33% was commensurate with the increase to AvatiGas to purchase the gas based on the T&C's that I signed up for and if not, then today would be the start of my 42 days notice period for breach of contract, as per the T&C's.


    I await the response with bated breath, however, looking at the propane spot price, it has increased significantly in the last year (but not sure this is the right index!)
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