Deprivation of assets
Comments
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onwards&upwards wrote: »So here’s a scenario, you’ve lived for 4 or 5 years in an £800 a week care home paying for it yourself out of your savings, pension income and the proceeds from selling your home.
You live longer than you expected and eventually you are down to 26,000 in capital.
If you have a well off child or other relative then the council will pay their rate (let’s say £500) happily and let your well off relative pay £300 and you get to stay where you are, where you have made friends, where the staff know you, your home.
If you don’t have any family, or they can’t afford to help you, then the council are no longer willing to pay the £500 they would have been?
There is no compulsion for anyone having to pay the top up, and the sort of numbers you are talking about in this example is unlikely not to be covered by a combination of LA funding and the residence pension income.
A bigger threat to someone in this position is care home closures.0 -
onwards&upwards wrote: »If you don’t have any family, or they can’t afford to help you, then the council are no longer willing to pay the £500 they would have been?
No, the council will still pay up to their limit but that won't cover the home's bill so you will be asked to move - just as if you couldn't afford a hotel bill.
You would have to argue that the council should pay the whole bill because you are settled there or hope that the council and the home could come to some agreement about splitting the difference - if not, you will have to move to a home which charges what the council will pay.0 -
onwards&upwards wrote: »Even if top up fees are £300 a week, 26 grand will last 86 weeks which is over a year and a half. For someone who has already been in care long enough to exhaust house sale proceeds and all other savings, that may well be enough if the average stay is only 2 years as was posted above.
As I said above the council doesn't collect the top up fee, the home does. If they've been a resident for several years and remain in the home as long as it's being paid, regardless of it's source it's unlikely to cause issues. The main issues occur for new residents.
It's also not just the top up fee. At £26k you'll be paying the council around £50 extra a week towards your care. Add on little extras here and there, along with no income increasing this figure £26k won't last a year and a half, not even close.onwards&upwards wrote: »If you don’t have any family, or they can’t afford to help you, then the council are no longer willing to pay the £500 they would have been?
They'll pay the £500, just not the £300. If no one can pay that £300 then the care home will evict their tenant.0 -
As I said above the council doesn't collect the top up fee, the home does. If they've been a resident for several years and remain in the home as long as it's being paid, regardless of it's source it's unlikely to cause issues. The main issues occur for new residents.
It's also not just the top up fee. At £26k you'll be paying the council around £50 extra a week towards your care. Add on little extras here and there, along with no income increasing this figure £26k won't last a year and a half, not even close.
They'll pay the £500, just not the £300. If no one can pay that £300 then the care home will evict their tenant.
But the resident themselves isn’t allowed to pay the £300. If the resident themself has the means to pay the £300 then the council won’t pay the £500, will they?0 -
No, the council will still pay up to their limit but that won't cover the home's bill so you will be asked to move - just as if you couldn't afford a hotel bill.
You would have to argue that the council should pay the whole bill because you are settled there or hope that the council and the home could come to some agreement about splitting the difference - if not, you will have to move to a home which charges what the council will pay.
I don’t understand!
If the council will pay the £500 and the resident has enough money left to pay the top up, even for a short period, why oh why are they not allowed to?0 -
onwards&upwards wrote: »I don’t understand!
If the council will pay the £500 and the resident has enough money left to pay the top up, even for a short period, why oh why are they not allowed to?
I'm going to refer you back again to post 53.All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.
Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.0 -
onwards&upwards wrote: »I don’t understand!
If the council will pay the £500 and the resident has enough money left to pay the top up, even for a short period, why oh why are they not allowed to?
Ask your MP - it's the way the law is written.0 -
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onwards&upwards wrote: »I don’t understand!
If the council will pay the £500 and the resident has enough money left to pay the top up, even for a short period, why oh why are they not allowed to?
I do feel like we're going around in circles a bit here.
As I've already said if they're an existing resident chances are they will be allowed to pay the top up fee out of their own money, even if that officially isn't the rule. Ultimately they'll likely need to move anyway but it'll be seen as better to let them live there for a while longer than move them sooner.
The top up is more of an issue for people first entering care rather than existing residents.0
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