PIP mobility criteria - moving around

aguy187 · 18 September 2019 at 8:31AM

Hi, can I ask if anyone knows how the descriptors in this category are combined?

Brief history, I have a long standing issue in one leg, nerve damage from an accident that means I've walked with a limp my whole life. As of a few years ago I got arthritis in the ankle which altered the angle of my foot and now I have to wear boots made by Specialist Mobility from a foot cast. Then I got a collapsed arch in my other foot and now have to also wear a special boot for that. I'm not on any kind of benefit and I've been trying to get a blue badge without success.

I've been advised that typically it's required to be on PIP mobility to qualify for a blue badge, so I had a look at the criteria.

So I look at descriptor C - 'Can stand and then move unaided more than 20 metres but no more than 50 metres. 8 points' - that's me, I can stumble around the house without my special boots or crutches. Outside, 20 metres would be pushing it, I couldn't make 50. The pain can last for days if I try and wear ordinary footwear.

But then I see descriptor A - 'Can stand and then move more than 200 metres, either aided or unaided. 0 points' - I wouldn't normally put myself in that position, but with my boots, and certainly with my crutches or using the shopping trolley as a Zimmer frame, I can walk 200+ metres.

So do I score 0 or 8?

Spoonie_Turtle · 18 September 2019 at 1:31PM

The main point to consider for PIP descriptors is reliably: safely, to an acceptable standard, repeatedly and in reasonable time. https://pipinfo.net/issues/reliably
https://pipinfo.net/activities/moving-around

If you can do 200m once at a snail's pace and couldn't move for the next few hours, that doesn't count

you'd probably have to tell them if you do it in daily life (e.g. shopping once a week) but also explain the aftermath and why you can't do it repeatedly or in a reasonable time frame. Somewhere in the advice/guidance linked on the pipinfo page is what defines reasonable time period for walking.

poppy12345 · 18 September 2019 at 5:50PM

Also bare in mind that the moving around part of mobility it's outside on flat level ground that counts, not inside.

When applying for PIP you'll be assessed for both daily living and mobility so do take a look at the daily living descriptors too and see if any of those apply to you.

The best guide to read to have more understanding is this one.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

aguy187 · 19 September 2019 at 9:31AM

Thanks, I think then that I score a resounding zero points as I could reasonably do 200+ metres on crutches, at a normal pace, several times a day, so the PIP route isn't going to work. It's frustrating that my GP, orthopaedic consultant and the guys at specialist mobility all feel I should have a blue badge, but I can't work through the bureaucracy to get one.

Spoonie_Turtle · 19 September 2019 at 1:37PM

Have you looked up your council criteria for qualifying? Some will assess applications on a case-by-case basis even if you don't automatically qualify e.g. through being awarded PIP. I think if you can do 200m+ several times a day though (and able to do this most days of the week?) you probably won't qualify. Worth investigating just in case, though

poppy12345 · 19 September 2019 at 3:24PM

aguy187 wrote: »

Thanks, I think then that I score a resounding zero points as I could reasonably do 200+ metres on crutches, at a normal pace, several times a day, so the PIP route isn't going to work. It's frustrating that my GP, orthopaedic consultant and the guys at specialist mobility all feel I should have a blue badge, but I can't work through the bureaucracy to get one.

Based on that you won't qualify for a blue badge either, unfortunately.

getzls · 19 September 2019 at 4:21PM

I need to rest say every 15 to 20 metres, even if only for 30 seconds.
They said I could go for more than 20 which I rarely can.
I appealed it and got my full Mobility.

poppy12345 · 19 September 2019 at 5:06PM

getzls wrote: »

I need to rest say every 15 to 20 metres, even if only for 30 seconds.
They said I could go for more than 20 which I rarely can.
I appealed it and got my full Mobility.

That's totally different to the OP who stated that they can reasonably walk 200 metres with crutches, several times a day.

gingertomantiques · 19 September 2019 at 9:42PM

Hi
The answer is what you can do on your worst day. Not your best, or making a superhuman effort
You have already stated you qualify for the full 8 points unaided.
The fact that you could cover the distance aided is not the point. its how you cover the distance. You can not cover the distance without pain or distress or without making extraordinary effort.
You have a disability, its what you can do without causing you ill effects, you have stated it causes you suffering.
Most people fail the pip because of this. there are no tricks, when they say how did you get here & you tell them . They know the bus stop is 100metres away or the car park is 50metres. so when you tell them you cant walk 20 metres >?>?>?>?>?.
Its not about being dishonest with them but being honest with yourself, Yes you can , but is it within reasonable expectations
I understand pride comes into this, it takes guts to ask for help. the blue badge is to make your life easier & enable you.
Please apply you are a genuine case ,
Good luck

Spoonie_Turtle · 20 September 2019 at 2:13AM

gingertomantiques wrote: »

Hi
The answer is what you can do on your worst day. Not your best, or making a superhuman effort
You have already stated you qualify for the full 8 points unaided.
The fact that you could cover the distance aided is not the point. its how you cover the distance. You can not cover the distance without pain or distress or without making extraordinary effort.
You have a disability, its what you can do without causing you ill effects, you have stated it causes you suffering.
Most people fail the pip because of this. there are no tricks, when they say how did you get here & you tell them . They know the bus stop is 100metres away or the car park is 50metres. so when you tell them you cant walk 20 metres >?>?>?>?>?.
Its not about being dishonest with them but being honest with yourself, Yes you can , but is it within reasonable expectations
I understand pride comes into this, it takes guts to ask for help. the blue badge is to make your life easier & enable you.
Please apply you are a genuine case ,
Good luck

No, not on your worst day. It's about what applies for the majority of the time, i.e. more than 50% of the days / more than 50% of the time throughout the day. You're right, it's not about your best day or your most effort, but you can't just put down your worst day because that's not actually how PIP works.

OP it is worth finding it about this in more depth, thinking about how long it takes you, in what manner you are able to move those distances, what the aftereffects are and really what applies for most of the time. If you had to do those distances every day to get to work, to do shopping a few times a week, etc., what would you be able to manage without making yourself ill?

I suggest looking up 'PIP moving around' plus each of the qualifiers individually (safely / acceptable standard / timely / repeatedly). You could also try to find official guidance for council blue badge assessments - each council does vary but if you can't find it for your own council, finding what a different council has issued will give you an idea of what considerations there might be for your case. If your experts are telling you that you should qualify, there is a reason.

If you can do 200m+ several times a day or whenever you need to, you may yet qualify on the basis of how long it takes you. But there may be other factors that apply for you as well that we haven't initially picked up on. I wish I could find the Blue Badge assessment guidance I found because it was really interesting and might have helped you clarify in your own mind whether you might possibly qualify or not. I'll certainly post a link if I do find it again.

poppy12345 · 20 September 2019 at 7:11AM

gingertomantiques wrote: »

Hi
The answer is what you can do on your worst day.

Sorry but that's the worst advice ever! It's most definitely not about your worst day.

The OP has already stated they can walk 200 metres several times a day. Just because they use an aid, this doesn't mean they will automatically score 8 points, it doesn't work that way.

I suggest the OP has a read of this guide then they will have a better understanding of the PIP descriptors and what they mean.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

PIP mobility criteria - moving around

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