Planning Permission - Which Certificate

Notloba · 28 January 2020 at 1:47PM

Hi,

I am currently selling my house and my neighbour has decided that now would be a good time to question a planning application that was submitted 3 years ago which was completed and signed off 2+ years ago.

She is claiming that the incorrect ownership certificate was submitted.The planning was to replace an existing single storey extension with a 2-storey extension that ran parallel to her existing extension.

The internal wall of our existing single storey extension on the neighbour's side was a red brick wall running alongside the stone party wall. This was deemed structurally sound with adequate foundations, so our building control advised that we built the second storey on to this, which we did.

However, our neighbour is claiming that because we built on a party wall, we should have submitted an Ownership Certificate Form B rather than A. So I have 2 questions;

1) If all the work was done on my side of the boundary line, even though it was a party wall, which certificate was required.
2) If the wrong certificate was submitted, how can this be remedied, bearing in mind I'm currently midway through a sale?

Thanks in advance for any help.

davidmcn · 28 January 2020 at 1:51PM

If she wanted to challenge the grant of the planning permission then she had (I think) 3 months from the date it was issued to do so via judicial review. Not sure what she thinks she can do about it now. I take it that otherwise the development itself was carried out in accordance with the approved drawings?

thearchitect · 28 January 2020 at 2:07PM

Scotland or England? Different systems.

Also is it planning or warrant/regs approval she is challenging (or both)?

Notloba · 28 January 2020 at 2:10PM

The development was done as much as per drawings as it could be. The finished extension is where it was stated on the drawings externally. There was no mention of building on a party wall when we submitted them. Basically, the new single brick wall running along the stone party wall was discovered during demolition. It isn't tied to the stone wall and is wholly on my side of the boundary. It could have been demolished and replaced with a block wall and then it would be to the drawings. It doesn't change how it looks or where it is for our neighbour, just the construction process.

England sorry

Doozergirl · 28 January 2020 at 2:13PM

It's irrelevant. Nothing she can do.

Ownership has very little to do with planning permission anyway. They like to know that you have permission from the landowner, but that fact that you've built it and she lives next door does indicate that she definitely knew about it at the time.

You cannot remove planning permission once granted, so I have no idea what she's playing at.

Ditto anything affecting the party wall. Should have been dealt with at the time.

eddddy · 28 January 2020 at 2:37PM

What outcome is your neighbour looking for?

For example,

Does she want you to apologise?
Does she want you to knock down the extension?
Does she want you to pay her some money?
Is she just trying to wreck your sale out of spite?

It might be worth understanding her motives, so that you can decide the best way to move forward.

Maybe bear in mind that you'll almost certainly have to answer these questions for your buyer:

Have there been any disputes or complaints regarding this property or a property nearby? If Yes, please give details.

Is the seller aware of anything which might lead to a dispute about the property or a property nearby? If Yes, please give details.

So you want to conclude this 'discussion' with your neighbour in a friendly way, without it turning into a complaint or dispute.

Notloba · 28 January 2020 at 3:02PM

Unfortunately, there is already a dispute. She is also claiming that the box gutter has leaked and caused damp in her property (which I have provided evidence is from her poorly maintained roof and not the box gutter). However, to move the sale on and to reassure our buyers, we have agreed to have the box gutter redone by an agreed roofer and it will be guaranteed for 10 years. Buyers are aware of this and are happy.

However, she hasn't said what she wants out of the planning/party wall aspect - we'd offer to do what she asks to keep our sale but I don't think she know what she wants herself. It's extremely frustrating.

She got a solicitor to word an "angry letter" rather than simply discussing it with myself and a surveyor to look at the roof (which we had offered to redo anyway) and is also demanding that I reimburse these incurred costs.

Bizarrely enough, I've even offered to reimburse everything and redo the box gutter and simply asked that she confirm that if I do all that she will agree to sign an agreement to say she is happy with the extension so that I can give this to my buyers and they won't have any issues in the future with it. But she's refusing to sign it. Really am at a loss with how to deal with her now.

thearchitect · 28 January 2020 at 3:06PM

thearchitect wrote: »

Scotland or England? Different systems.

Also is it planning or warrant/regs approval she is challenging (or both)?

Apologies if I missed it but a response on these would be helpful.

Notloba · 28 January 2020 at 3:11PM

thearchitect wrote: »

Apologies if I missed it but a response on these would be helpful.

Sorry, I replied with England above but that was before you added the other question

Initially, it was Building Regs approval she was unhappy with as I never explicitly stated it would be built partly on a party wall. But now she's challenging planning as she's claiming I should have filled in the Ownership Certificate B as I was working on a party wall, despite it all being on my side of the boundary line.

thearchitect · 28 January 2020 at 3:18PM

There are two issues then, which are entirely seperate.

Firstly, your neighbour is - as I understand - seeking to challenge the validty of one or both of the permissions/consents on the basis that she was not properly notified as owner of part of the affected fabric.

As others have pointed out, that is a procedural issue which (as far as I am aware) would require challenge in court. Whether that is successful or not is a matter where you would require legal advice, but I would imagine that she would have to show it would have had a material effect on the determination of the applications.

The second, which you have not raised, is that she may aver that you have infringed on her property and therefore - setting to one side consent - have no right to have constructed your new work at all. This is, in my view, more serious. You cannot simply build upon someone else's property. The courts take a dimmer view of such things in my experience.

In the case of a party wall, and in England, that is complex and hence the reason that (amongst other things) party wall surveyors exist. Their advice can be important.

Have you spoken to the architect who prepared the extension drawings? Does he, or she, have a view on whether the new work impinges upon your neighbour's property?

Notloba · 28 January 2020 at 4:15PM

thearchitect wrote: »

There are two issues then, which are entirely seperate.
Firstly, your neighbour is - as I understand - seeking to challenge the validty of one or both of the permissions/consents on the basis that she was not properly notified as owner of part of the affected fabric.

As others have pointed out, that is a procedural issue which (as far as I am aware) would require challenge in court. Whether that is successful or not is a matter where you would require legal advice, but I would imagine that she would have to show it would have had a material effect on the determination of the applications.

The second, which you have not raised, is that she may aver that you have infringed on her property and therefore - setting to one side consent - have no right to have constructed your new work at all. This is, in my view, more serious. You cannot simply build upon someone else's property. The courts take a dimmer view of such things in my experience.

In the case of a party wall, and in England, that is complex and hence the reason that (amongst other things) party wall surveyors exist. Their advice can be important.

Have you spoken to the architect who prepared the extension drawings? Does he, or she, have a view on whether the new work impinges upon your neighbour's property?

Thanks thearchitect, I don't think the planning would have been looked at any differently. The final build is as per the drawings, which they approved and I would like to think would have approved even if she was notified.

In regards to the infringing, none of the work completed was over the line of junction/property line, however it was on a party wall. Does this make a difference?

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Planning Permission - Which Certificate

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