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  • FIRST POST
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 23rd Oct 19, 12:15 PM
    • 971Posts
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    TREVORCOLMAN
    Virgin money merge with yorkshire bank
    • #1
    • 23rd Oct 19, 12:15 PM
    Virgin money merge with yorkshire bank 23rd Oct 19 at 12:15 PM
    in July VM emailed me to say:

    If you have deposits (e.g. a savings or current account) with Virgin Money, then the following information is important to you.

    The FSCS protects individuals who have savings held in a UK bank account up to £85,000 per individual. This means that you can have up to £85,000 protected in your account(s) with Virgin Money and up to another £85,000 protected in accounts with Clydesdale.

    When the two businesses come together as one bank, you’ll only get protection on your total combined savings with Virgin Money and Clydesdale, up to £85,000 (or £170,000 for joint accounts).

    Now Yorkshire Bank are saying it is 85k with each.

    Who is correct?
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
Page 1
    • eskbanker
    • By eskbanker 23rd Oct 19, 1:09 PM
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    eskbanker
    • #2
    • 23rd Oct 19, 1:09 PM
    • #2
    • 23rd Oct 19, 1:09 PM
    Where (and perhaps when) do Yorkshire say it's £85K with each?

    https://secure.ybonline.co.uk/personal/savings/compensation-scheme/ states £85K across the group:
    Your eligible deposits with Clydesdale Bank PLC are protected up to a total of £85,000 by the Financial Services Compensation Scheme, the UK’s deposit guarantee scheme.

    This limit is applied to the total of any deposits you have with the following: Clydesdale Bank, Yorkshire Bank, B and Virgin Money. Any total deposits you hold above the limit between these brands are unlikely to be covered.
    https://uk.virginmoney.com/virginmerging/savings/ (FAQ 26) also confirms:
    Now that the two businesses have come together as one bank, you only get protection on your total combined savings in Virgin Money, Clydesdale Bank, Yorkshire Bank and B branded accounts, up to £85,000 (or £170,000 for joint accounts)
    • Heng Leng
    • By Heng Leng 23rd Oct 19, 1:19 PM
    • 4,891 Posts
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    Heng Leng
    • #3
    • 23rd Oct 19, 1:19 PM
    • #3
    • 23rd Oct 19, 1:19 PM
    The transfer was approved by The Court of Session (aka The Court of Sessions on Sky News / Scottish Appeal Court on BBC News) on the 26th September and took effect from the 21st October.

    It was Virgin Money PLC to Clydesdale Bank PLC
    Yorkshire Bank is just a brand name of Clydesdale Bank PLC.
    Last edited by Heng Leng; 23-10-2019 at 1:24 PM.
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 24th Oct 19, 8:38 AM
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    TREVORCOLMAN
    • #4
    • 24th Oct 19, 8:38 AM
    • #4
    • 24th Oct 19, 8:38 AM
    Where (and perhaps when) do Yorkshire say it's £85K with each?

    https://secure.ybonline.co.uk/personal/savings/compensation-scheme/ states £85K across the group:

    https://uk.virginmoney.com/virginmerging/savings/ (FAQ 26) also confirms:
    Originally posted by eskbanker
    Customer Services told me over phone it was 2 x 85K. I therefore asked for it in writing which they said they would do. Then they contacted me and said they had got it wrong it is only 1 x 85k.

    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
    • eskbanker
    • By eskbanker 24th Oct 19, 10:22 AM
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    eskbanker
    • #5
    • 24th Oct 19, 10:22 AM
    • #5
    • 24th Oct 19, 10:22 AM
    Customer Services told me over phone it was 2 x 85K. I therefore asked for it in writing which they said they would do. Then they contacted me and said they had got it wrong it is only 1 x 85k.
    Originally posted by TREVORCOLMAN
    Without wishing to denigrate bank call centre employees unduly, it's usually best to rely on definitive information published on their websites and elsewhere - it really didn't take long to find the info posted above.

    Is this all hypothetical or do you really have more than £85K in cash deposits within the new bank (which is unlikely to be a good idea even without any FSCS considerations)?
    • sal_III
    • By sal_III 24th Oct 19, 10:27 AM
    • 1,500 Posts
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    sal_III
    • #6
    • 24th Oct 19, 10:27 AM
    • #6
    • 24th Oct 19, 10:27 AM
    I think the wording is to blame, but essentially it means that:

    you can currently have up to £85,000 protected in your account(s) with Virgin Money and up to another £85,000 protected in accounts with Clydesdale.
    Which will no longer be the case when the two businesses come together as one bank. Which how it normally works for bank groups.

    For that reason you are (I was) offered to withdraw any savings without penalty and retain interests incurred thus far.

    edit: Regarding the call center reply, it really depends on when the merger takes full effect, they will always give you the current state, even if it's about to change next week. For example I was opening a Nationwide FlexPlus account and it changes dramatically next month. The person on the phone was careful to state only the current terms and made a note that the terms are changing next month, but since i'm opening the account now, i must agree to the current terms.
    Last edited by sal_III; 24-10-2019 at 10:30 AM.
    • eskbanker
    • By eskbanker 24th Oct 19, 10:32 AM
    • 11,627 Posts
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    eskbanker
    • #7
    • 24th Oct 19, 10:32 AM
    • #7
    • 24th Oct 19, 10:32 AM
    Which will no longer be the case when the two businesses come together as one bank.

    [...]

    edit: Regarding the call center reply, it really depends on when the merger takes full effect, they will always give you the current state, even if it's about to change next week.
    Originally posted by sal_III
    As per the above posts, the merger has now happened, as from last Monday!
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 29th Oct 19, 1:02 PM
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    TREVORCOLMAN
    • #8
    • 29th Oct 19, 1:02 PM
    Do not bank with yorkshire bank
    • #8
    • 29th Oct 19, 1:02 PM
    Continuing Saga.

    I applied to another provider to move one of my ISAs as I was informed by YB Exec Office that I could move one of my ISAs without penalty.

    I therefore asked the new provider to move the whole amount of one of the ISAs.

    The new provider has written to me today informing me that they have been unable to move the ISA as YB has told them I have insufficient funds.

    So I called YB YET AGAIN to be told:

    "Oh you cannot move the whole of the ISA you can only move the amount over 85k"

    wtf

    Who on earth moves part of an ISA?

    So how on earth do I that as the amount will change every day as time goes along.


    Also what happens when the interest is added each year it will again take me over the 85?

    Idiots.


    Last edited by TREVORCOLMAN; 29-10-2019 at 1:30 PM.
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 29th Oct 19, 2:04 PM
    • 971 Posts
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    TREVORCOLMAN
    • #9
    • 29th Oct 19, 2:04 PM
    Do not bank with yorkshire bank
    • #9
    • 29th Oct 19, 2:04 PM
    So I contacted YB and they cant tell me how much I am over the 85k as one of the ISAs is with VM and I should ask them how much is there. I thought they took over VM on 21 Oct?

    So how can YB stop my ISA going to new provider, saying I can only move any amount over 85k, if they dont know how much I have in total?

    After all it is under their licence?
    Last edited by TREVORCOLMAN; 29-10-2019 at 2:09 PM.
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
    • Heng Leng
    • By Heng Leng 29th Oct 19, 3:54 PM
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    Heng Leng
    So I contacted YB and they cant tell me how much I am over the 85k as one of the ISAs is with VM and I should ask them how much is there. I thought they took over VM on 21 Oct?

    So how can YB stop my ISA going to new provider, saying I can only move any amount over 85k, if they dont know how much I have in total?

    After all it is under their licence?
    Originally posted by TREVORCOLMAN
    Yorkshire Bank have no licence - CYBGs brands (now including Virgin Money) are all now Clydesdale Bank plc. However, I doubt they are fully integrated technologically as they are have only been linked legally for a short period of time.
    Last edited by Heng Leng; 29-10-2019 at 3:57 PM.
    • abz88
    • By abz88 29th Oct 19, 6:07 PM
    • 114 Posts
    • 67 Thanks
    abz88
    So I contacted YB and they cant tell me how much I am over the 85k as one of the ISAs is with VM and I should ask them how much is there. I thought they took over VM on 21 Oct?

    So how can YB stop my ISA going to new provider, saying I can only move any amount over 85k, if they dont know how much I have in total?

    After all it is under their licence?
    Originally posted by TREVORCOLMAN
    I get that its frustrating that they cannot you tell you how much over the 85k you are, but do you not know this yourself? Either through online access to them, or failing that, go into your local branch to get a statement?
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 29th Oct 19, 6:32 PM
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    TREVORCOLMAN
    Do not bank with yorkshire bank
    Eventually got the answer from CEO Office. They have given me the sum that I am over, and told me to give this figure to my new ISA provider to ask them to take from my ISA with YB. It is less than the figure I put in in April this year.

    However when I got off the phone I realised this:

    Quote from Gov.UK ref ISA:

    If you want to transfer money you’ve invested in an ISA during the current year, you must transfer all of it.

    Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhh

    Tried to call them back but they had left for the day!!!

    And so on it goes...............
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 29th Oct 19, 6:38 PM
    • 971 Posts
    • 312 Thanks
    TREVORCOLMAN
    Do not bank with yorkshire bank
    I get that its frustrating that they cannot you tell you how much over the 85k you are, but do you not know this yourself? Either through online access to them, or failing that, go into your local branch to get a statement?
    Originally posted by abz88
    My point was it was YB who stopped my transfer so how do they know I am over if they are asking ME to contact VM?
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
    • AndyPK
    • By AndyPK 29th Oct 19, 6:50 PM
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    AndyPK
    I feel your pain.

    Clydesdale don't like you moving your ISA Out. (as I recall from a few years ago)


    Usually I would do a rough calculation, to ensure that after 3 years (or whatever the fix is), I didn't have more than 85K with an organisation.

    i.e leave some margin for the interest.
    Last edited by AndyPK; 29-10-2019 at 6:52 PM.
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 29th Oct 19, 7:09 PM
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    • 312 Thanks
    TREVORCOLMAN
    Do not bank with yorkshire bank
    I Always do that too - however did not envisage two companies merging into 1.

    Decided I am going to take out the money over and above and invest it in a fixed rate bond higher than the YB ISA, as the VM ISA is paying 2%. Was happy with them!!!
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 29th Oct 19, 7:49 PM
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    TREVORCOLMAN
    Tried to move the money out - will not load the ISA to move money out - 6th email sent to CEO.
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 29th Oct 19, 9:42 PM
    • 65,313 Posts
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    Thrugelmir
    6th email sent to CEO.
    Originally posted by TREVORCOLMAN
    Will simply be rerouted by the secretarial team. The CEO isn't your personal banker.
    ““there really is no such thing as ‘the future’, singular. There are only multiple, unforeseeable futures, which will never lose their capacity to take us by surprise.””
    ― Niall Ferguson
    • eskbanker
    • By eskbanker 29th Oct 19, 11:52 PM
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    • 14,408 Thanks
    eskbanker
    Eventually got the answer from CEO Office. They have given me the sum that I am over, and told me to give this figure to my new ISA provider to ask them to take from my ISA with YB. It is less than the figure I put in in April this year.

    However when I got off the phone I realised this:

    Quote from Gov.UK ref ISA:

    If you want to transfer money you’ve invested in an ISA during the current year, you must transfer all of it.

    Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhh

    Tried to call them back but they had left for the day!!!

    And so on it goes...............
    Originally posted by TREVORCOLMAN
    YB are entitled to offer a concession to savers that waives normal withdrawal fees, in recognition of the fact that their merger will in some cases have caused savers to exceed the £85K FSCS protection limit inadvertently.

    However, they can't break the ISA scheme rules that mandate that all current year contributions (into the same type of ISA) must be kept together.

    So, if you have multiple cash ISAs and wish to transfer money from one to bring you back under the £85K aggregate limit, then it would make sense to do so with funds from a previous year, rather than 2019/20 (unless you wish to move all 2019/20 money together, if this is allowed by the terms of the YB merger concession).
    • Ergates
    • By Ergates 30th Oct 19, 10:57 AM
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    Ergates
    I understand it fully it is YB who are saying you can move part of it not me.
    Originally posted by TREVORCOLMAN
    No, they're saying you can move part of the ISA. not part of this year's subscription.

    Given the FSCS limit is £85,000 and the maximum you can subscribe into an ISA in any given year is £20,000 it would take multiple years subscriptions to go over the limit.

    The bit you would be moving would be coming from *previous year's* subscriptions. To quote the same regulations website:
    "For money you invested in previous years, you can choose to transfer all or part of your savings."

    Your bank are giving you the opportunity to move some of your previous years subscriptions to another provider without suffering an interest penalty. This offer only extends to the portion of your total savings with them that is over the £85,000 limit. You can move any other amount of your previous years subscriptions to any other provider too, but you will probably lose accrued interest, as you would if you moved it at any other time.
    If you wish to also transfer your *current year's* subscriptions, you must transfer *all* of it at once, to a single provider. If you do this you will probably suffer an interest penalty.
    Last edited by Ergates; 30-10-2019 at 11:05 AM.
    • TREVORCOLMAN
    • By TREVORCOLMAN 30th Oct 19, 11:16 AM
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    TREVORCOLMAN
    Do not bank with yorkshire bank
    It was clearly THIS years ISA we were talking about (the one with YB) that is what was discussed all the way down the line.
    I am NOT a mortgage & insurance adviser - or anything to do with finance, that was put on by the new system I dont know why?!
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