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  • FIRST POST
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 8:57 AM
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    rose28454
    Who is liable for this crash
    • #1
    • 23rd Sep 08, 8:57 AM
    Who is liable for this crash 23rd Sep 08 at 8:57 AM
    My DD was driving to work this morning and was passing a crossroads and the vehicle on the left junction was pulled partly out into the road so my daughter pulled over the line a bit to get round him ( she was going straight on) and suddenly a car on the right junction pulled out and hit her side on and badly damaged her door. She said he only seemed to have damage to his number plate and so they swapped details and she came home. He has now rung and asked for the registration number ( that he forgot to take). She told him she had a large excess (500.00- she is only 22) and so would rather not go through her insurers and he said his excess is 325.00. The problem is that she is crap with money and never opens her post and when we looked for her policy details she found a letter to say her policy had been cancelled 2 weeks ago due to non payment of the last months premium. I am going over to see him shortly so I am wondering what to do. He wants her insurance details which obviously she does not have. What shoe she do? Obviously she should be insured but he is liable as he hit her car.
    I despair of her as she is crap with money ( spend it all on clothes!) and I am on my own ( recently seperated) and struggling with money and debt issues and there always seems to be some financial scrape for me to get her out of. Should we tell him she is not insured or just refuse to give him the details. I think he may then try to wriggle out of paying. Also should we report the accident to the police bearing in mind she is not insured??
Page 3
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 9:49 PM
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    rose28454
    You don't have too although your opening yourself upto claims of failing to stop, provide details and perverting the course of justice

    At the end of the day go and listen to what he says and be quiet

    The first mention of him disputing liability or involving insurance companies, get the cheque book out and pay exactly what he wants
    Originally posted by LinasPilibaitisisbatman
    I am not able to get out mine or my DD,s chequebook as neither of us have any money. I was looking at Direct Line.s website ( his insurers ) and the spiel is as follows:-
    Our uninsured driver promise

    If you make a claim for an accident that is not your fault and the driver of the car that hits you is not insured, you will not lose your no claims discount or have to pay any excess.

    Conditions
    • We will need:
      the vehicle registration number and the make and model of the car; and
    • the driver's details, if possible.
    It also helps us to confirm who is at fault if you can get the names and addresses of any independent witnesses, if available.
    When you claim, you may have to pay your excess. Also, if when your renewal is due investigations are still ongoing, you may lose your no-claim discount temporarily. However, once we confirm that the accident was the fault of the uninsured driver, we will repay your excess, restore your no claims discount and refund any extra premium you have paid.
    In Northern Ireland cover not available to under 22’s.
    This promise is for comprehensive policyholders only.

    The only problem is with this that it was not DD'S fault or should she just say it was her fault so he can claim from Direct Line and can pay her own damage costs?
  • tinkerbell84
    Can your daughter get to work by public transport?

    If Directline cover the costs, you can bet your bottom dollar that your daughter is going to be prosecuted for driving with no insurance.
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 23rd Sep 08, 10:07 PM
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    Mojisola
    If you make a claim for an accident that is not your fault and the driver of the car that hits you is not insured, you will not lose your no claims discount or have to pay any excess.
    Originally posted by rose28454
    I think this applies to a person insured by Direct Line who is hit by an uninsured driver.
  • tinkerbell84
    I think this applies to a person insured by Direct Line who is hit by an uninsured driver.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    yes......... :confused:
  • uktyler
    I
    The only problem is with this that it was not DD'S fault or should she just say it was her fault so he can claim from Direct Line and can pay her own damage costs?
    Originally posted by rose28454
    The uninsured drivers clause is for when you get hit by uninsured drivers.

    Your daughter had defaulted on payments, wherefore had no insurance, your insurer could very easily tell you to sort it out yourself.

    Even if the accident was the other drivers fault one call to the police will put your daughter in a very difficult position.

    Has the other driver admitted responsibility?

    If he wants the insurance companies to sort it out your daughter is in trouble.

    If his insurance company pay up they will come after your daughter to pay them, so thats damage repairs, car hire, legal fees and police involvement.
    Last edited by uktyler; 23-09-2008 at 10:12 PM.
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 10:17 PM
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    rose28454
    I think this applies to a person insured by Direct Line who is hit by an uninsured driver.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    Yes I understand that. I am only thinking of a way to help get the best resolution to this. I am going to wait and see what his insurers say when they write to my DD. I am just a mother doing what any mother would do for her child. Please do not condemn me for it!
  • uktyler
    Yes I understand that. I am only thinking of a way to help get the best resolution to this. I am going to wait and see what his insurers say when they write to my DD. I am just a mother doing what any mother would do for her child. Please do not condemn me for it!
    Originally posted by rose28454
    We don't condemn you, however your daughter has been foolish, and now it looks like she is going to pay for it.

    I take it the other driver is denying responsibility for the crash?

    Does he know your daughter was uninsured?

    Was there further damage to his car other than number paint/scuffed paint?
  • exup
    If you are at a give way - then you MUST give way to ALL traffic on the main road ahead. regardless of which side of the road they are driving.

    Such as in the case of passing a parked vehicle near a junction - forcing you to cross to the other side of the road. A driver wanting to emerge and turn left into your path MUST give way - but so often they forget and think they only have to give way to the right (and in some cases only lokk right before pulling out).

    So normally it would be the fault of the driver who failed to give way.

    The highway code suggests caution when overtaking near a junction for the above reason, and says you shouldnt do it. but then again - the highway code is not law - it is just a guide (it can be used in a court of law to prove a point of the road traffic act - but its the RTA which is the law not the highway code).

    However any insurance claim and claims court may take the view that an uninsured drive should not be on the road, and had they been complying with the law then the accident would not have happened at all. Same as with a drunk driver being involved in an accident - all bets are off, and the book is thrown at the offending driver.

    Fortunately no one was seriously hurt - because the brown stuff would have really hit the fan..

    (What do I think of uninsured drivers - well - speaking as an ex motorcycle instructor who made dame sure that all my vehicles were roadworthy and iinsured, and now working for the ambulance service - what I really think isn't printable).
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 10:42 PM
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    rose28454
    We don't condemn you, however your daughter has been foolish, and now it looks like she is going to pay for it.

    I take it the other driver is denying responsibility for the crash?

    Does he know your daughter was uninsured?

    Was there further damage to his car other than number paint/scuffed paint?
    Originally posted by uktyler
    He would not discuss the accident when we went to his house this morning. No he does not know she was not insured yet and when we looked at his car there was just a brokennumber plate and a scratched bumper. He rang tonight and said hid bumper needed some brackets aswell and even though he has an excess of 325 he would be going through the insurance. My daugters ar door is stoved in and the paintwork is cracked and I am would say her damage is worse. Not sure how to proceed now?
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 10:46 PM
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    rose28454
    I think that we will call our own insurers for advice tommorow or is that a bad idea??
  • uktyler
    I think that we will call our own insurers for advice tommorow or is that a bad idea??
    Originally posted by rose28454
    They are going to find out, whether or not they will do anything to help you is a different matter.

    Legitimately they can make you sort it out yourselves.

    If the other drivers car needs a new bumper, or the old one sprayed then it will be off the road for a few days, he will want a replacement.

    Can you offer him cash to repair his own car, maybe sell your daughters car to pay for it?

    It will be a cheaper option, even if you don't pay for the repairs to his car, just in fines and increased insurance premiums, plus if the police find out it may mean your daughter will not be driving for a while.
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 11:03 PM
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    rose28454
    My question about her insurers was whether it would affect her policy with them if she told them of the accident. My DD needs her car for work as she starts very early and cant catch a bus or train. She is an online University Student and works part time as she gets very little funding. I think maybe we will call him tommorow and ask him to get 2 quotes for the repairs. Then talk to him about the non insured aspect and see what he says. Hopefully he will maybe have some sympathy for her. Then if we end up having to pay I will ask my Dad to lend her the money to pay for the repairs to his and her cars. So is it best to keep her insurers out of it altogether.
  • tinkerbell84


    I think you need to work out what you're going to do if she gets prosecuted for driving without insurance. It's usually a £500-£1000 fine plus 6 points on her licence - and often a ban too - which will price her completely out of the insurance market.

    As soon as you admit she was uninsured she risks prosecution.
    • Poppy9
    • By Poppy9 23rd Sep 08, 11:18 PM
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    Poppy9
    My question about her insurers was whether it would affect her policy with them if she told them of the accident. My DD needs her car for work as she starts very early and cant catch a bus or train. She is an online University Student and works part time as she gets very little funding. I think maybe we will call him tommorow and ask him to get 2 quotes for the repairs. Then talk to him about the non insured aspect and see what he says. Hopefully he will maybe have some sympathy for her. Then if we end up having to pay I will ask my Dad to lend her the money to pay for the repairs to his and her cars. So is it best to keep her insurers out of it altogether.
    Originally posted by rose28454
    If she doesn't tell them and the other party's insurers do then they may cancel her policy, with no refund of any premiums paid, because she didn't disclose it.
    ~Laugh and the world laughs with you, weep and you weep alone.~
    • Ian W
    • By Ian W 23rd Sep 08, 11:21 PM
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    Ian W
    My question about her insurers was whether it would affect her policy with them if she told them of the accident.
    Originally posted by rose28454
    Erm, can I quickly reprise what I understand of the last 3 pages.
    1. Your daughter wasn't insured because she let the policy lapse due to an oversight.
    2. You've now contacted the insurer and they've re-started the policy, though obviously not back dated it.
    3. When you restarted the policy YOU DIDN'T INFORM THEM OF THE ACCIDENT?

    If that's correct - YOUR DAUGHTER IS STILL UNINSURED as you've failed to inform the insurer of a material fact - the accident - so they can void the policy for that reason.
    All, of course, in my humble opinion.
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 23rd Sep 08, 11:33 PM
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    Mojisola
    Yes I understand that. I am only thinking of a way to help get the best resolution to this. I am going to wait and see what his insurers say when they write to my DD. I am just a mother doing what any mother would do for her child. Please do not condemn me for it!
    Originally posted by rose28454
    I read it that you thought that Direct Line would pay out to the other car because your daughter was uninsured at the time!

    I don't think anyone is condemning you - your DD is in a very difficult situation. By law, if asked, she has to give the other driver her insurance details. As she wasn't insured at the time, she can't comply with the law.

    If the other driver realises something isn't quite right, he may try to get you to pay for his repairs (and more!) because he's got the upper hand.

    The insurance company is not going to take kindly to her getting a new insurance policy with them and not telling them about the accident.

    The only good thing that may come out of all this is that your daughter might start to take more responsibility for her own life. It sounds as if yours has been hard enough recently without her complicating it further.
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 11:40 PM
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    rose28454
    I read it that you thought that Direct Line would pay out to the other car because your daughter was uninsured at the time!

    I don't think anyone is condemning you - your DD is in a very difficult situation. By law, if asked, she has to give the other driver her insurance details. As she wasn't insured at the time, she can't comply with the law.

    If the other driver realises something isn't quite right, he may try to get you to pay for his repairs (and more!) because he's got the upper hand.

    The insurance company is not going to take kindly to her getting a new insurance policy with them and not telling them about the accident.

    The only good thing that may come out of all this is that your daughter might start to take more responsibility for her own life. It sounds as if yours has been hard enough recently without her complicating it further.
    Originally posted by Mojisola
    I looked up the road traffic act and it says she has to either give him her details or say she was not insured in order to comply with the regulations. Therefore she is going to call him tommorow and tell him that she is not insured and ask him to accept her offer of payment for his repairs and ask that he not pursue it with his insurers. As far as we know he has just told them there was an accident and nothing else.
    Then we just have to hope he does not find it necessary to inform the police although I am sure somebody on here will say she deserves prosecution!
  • mrposhman
    I would be a bit worried for your daughter.

    First and foremost, I don't think not paying your insurance premium for 1 month but 2 months and ignoring your post is an oversight, sounds like burying your head in the sand to me. You need to approach this problem with your daughter as much as the impending problem with the accident.

    As for the accident, in terms of fault, if your daughter had been insured it would appear to be his fault. As it would appear he did not give way when turning right, it may have been a different conclusion based on turning left.

    However, she was uninsured and as stated in many other posts this now makes her completely liable not only for the accident but also for the criminal trial.

    Think for example, a drunk driver is driving home, another driver hits him. Who is at fault? Clearly the drunk driver is, he will face a criminal conviction, probably lose his licence and will not be able to claim off his insurance.

    The same thing is going to happen to your daughter.

    Sorry if this is not what you want to hear but you came on here for advice and generally have been given advice that you don't want.
  • uktyler
    Then we just have to hope he does not find it necessary to inform the police although I am sure somebody on here will say she deserves prosecution!
    Originally posted by rose28454
    Good luck, your daughter needs to learn to take responsibility for her actions. I'm sure she will be checking her post and making sure her insurance is paid.

    Uninsured drivers cost everyone else money, if your daughter gets away without prosecution she will be lucky, don't let her do it again.
    • rose28454
    • By rose28454 23rd Sep 08, 11:56 PM
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    rose28454


    I think you need to work out what you're going to do if she gets prosecuted for driving without insurance. It's usually a 500-1000 fine plus 6 points on her licence - and often a ban too - which will price her completely out of the insurance market.

    As soon as you admit she was uninsured she risks prosecution.
    Originally posted by tinkerbell84
    But what is the alternative to admitting it? We either have to give him insurance details or say she was not insured ( In order to comply with the Road Traffic Act). We just have to hope he will accept the money from us but it does make me mad she has got herself in this position and even though he hit her she will have to pay the costs.
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