Fraud repayment

kmb500 wrote: »

sorry if wrong forum but couldn't see the right one.

I recently had my card stolen while on holiday and the thief used my PIN to charge my card until it ran out of money. I called my bank as soon as I realised and they started an investigation, a few days later they gave me a full refund. They've now sent me a fraud form that I need to complete and I noticed a bit that says if they don't believe me they can take all the money back?

I am getting paranoid that I will do something wrong and the bank will take my money away, what right do they have / do I have ?

Relax. They are investigating, and so long as the information you've given is true and accurate, you should be fine.

To explain further: Usually, banks give you a "temporary" refund on fraud pending investigation - this sounds like what has happened here. What will happen is they will look into the reported fraud and will decide whether to let that "temporary" credit become permanent, or whether they actually don't think it was fraud at all - in which case they can indeed take the funds back. They will do things like correspond with the merchants where transactions are made to get information about goods that were sold, who bought them, when and where. They'll also consider things like whether the original card was used, whether the PIN was entered incorrectly before it went through or whether it was accepted on the first try, how the thief might have got both the card and PIN and whether the transactions were out of the ordinary for you and your account activity.

They cannot just refund fraud permanently based on your say so, particularly for large amounts where the PIN on the card was used - ultimately, they need to be sure that it was indeed fraud, and they do have the right to take the temporary credit back if they don't believe that it was fraud - but they will give their reasons for doing so. If the bank do take the refund back and you disagree with their decision and the reasoning behind it, you can complain to them and then to the Financial Ombudsman Service. You should in any event send back the fraud declaration they've sent you as soon as is practicable as if you don't do so they may well think you are no longer pursuing the claim and take back the temporary credit no matter what.

On your specific case, have the bank asked how the thief got your PIN and your actual legitimate card? As this may be what their investigation turns on.

kmb500 wrote: »

Thanks.
Yeah I understand they have to complete their investigation especially as its a 5 figure sum of money and I will send the form back to them. But if it's up to them to decide whether I'm telling the truth or not, then well what reason do they have to believe me? Saves them all this money! I dont trust the bank as far as I could throw them.

People do have their cards defrauded and banks do pay out, they pay out an absurd amount; but naturally they can't just believe you. That's why the FOS exists, as a balance on this to independently look at cases in all the circumstances.

We don't know the transaction pattern here, but typically fraudsters who obtain a card will whack it for a huge sum of money on easily re-saleable goods, which is what this sounds like. Getting to five figures is astonishing, and the bank will want to be certain that all's above board before repaying that.

When I spoke to the bank that day, they asked several questions and I explained I had used my card and PIN in a couple bars, my wallet was nicked without me noticing, and I would guess they were able to use my PIN as they were probably watching in the bar. Next thing I know I check my bank account and all the money has gone.

Reasonable. Their next question will be, when did you notice the card being missing and did you call the bank straight away when you found this? If not, why not?

I'm not getting at you, this is the line of enquiry they'll go down. Again - be factual, give them correct information, just relax and tell the truth and everything will be fine in the end.

I am just so anxious, I was relieved to have my money back but now panicking it will be taken away again. I was considering moving my money into a different bank account as I simply do not trust a bank not to take it away if they have the ability to do so... or maybe can they still ask a different bank for the money back??

Am I just going crazy?

If you move your money elsewhere and they decide to take the credit back then your account will be overdrawn and will start accruing interest and charges. It's possibly the worst thing you could do, not to mention looking pretty dodgy in and of itself.

I understand why you're panicking, but you need to let the process work its way through. We can't promise they won't take the credit back, but equally we can't promise that they will either, not least since none of us know the circumstances. You will always have FOS as a point of last recourse.

Pretty irresponsible to

1/ NOT safeguard your pin AND
2/ NOT safe guard your wallet on the very same evening.
3/ NOT report it stolen until someone else managed to spent a TEN FIGURE sum (how does that even happen)

You should bear a large proportion of the responsibility for such gross negligence and that should be reflected by charging you with at least half the loss

kmb500 wrote: »

.....

When I spoke to the bank that day, they asked several questions and I explained I had used my card and PIN in a couple bars, my wallet was nicked without me noticing, and I would guess they were able to use my PIN as they were probably watching in the bar. Next thing I know I check my bank account and all the money has gone......