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Claim Form - UK Car Park Management
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Magnum0121
Posts: 36 Forumite
Hello,
A couple of weeks ago on the day I was meant to be going on holiday I received a letter before claim from Gladstones. Obviously there was no time to respond as I was catching a flight, so had to respond when I got back. I sent a robust response to the LBC but it was too late, the 14 days was up and they didn't mess around with the claim form!
I've frantically read the newbies thread again and it says "small claim? Start a new thread please"
I've registered with MCOL so I now have until the end of he month to sort this out but I'd rather nip it in the bud.
The parking charge in question was for "breaching the terms of parking" on the land of a residential site.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you
A couple of weeks ago on the day I was meant to be going on holiday I received a letter before claim from Gladstones. Obviously there was no time to respond as I was catching a flight, so had to respond when I got back. I sent a robust response to the LBC but it was too late, the 14 days was up and they didn't mess around with the claim form!
I've frantically read the newbies thread again and it says "small claim? Start a new thread please"
I've registered with MCOL so I now have until the end of he month to sort this out but I'd rather nip it in the bud.
The parking charge in question was for "breaching the terms of parking" on the land of a residential site.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you
0
Comments
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Once it's got this far, "nipping in the bud" is limited to paying up
Assuming you don't intend that, then this is the start of a longish process
You need to concentrate on #2 in the newbies faq thread for advice and links to defences
Construct yours and put it up for comment0 -
Magnum0121 wrote: »Hello,
A couple of weeks ago on the day I was meant to be going on holiday I received a letter before claim from Gladstones. Obviously there was no time to respond as I was catching a flight, so had to respond when I got back. I sent a robust response to the LBC but it was too late, the 14 days was up and they didn't mess around with the claim form!
I've frantically read the newbies thread again and it says "small claim? Start a new thread please"
I've registered with MCOL so I now have until the end of he month to sort this out but I'd rather nip it in the bud.
The parking charge in question was for "breaching the terms of parking" on the land of a residential site.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you
Please tell us the history of why you got a parking ticket.
Gladstones are incompetent solicitors and they no doubt
rushed this through to beat the 1st October new claim
procedures
The more you can tell us, the better the help you will get0 -
The car was parked on private land managed by CPM, parked outside of a bay with no permit. Not causing an obstruction or using someone else's bay.
The charge was issued to the car when I was in the process of moving out from the owned flat into a house. The flat is still owned by me but I have tenants renting it.
There are no visitors bays or anywhere to temporarily park whilst attempting to unload belongings or shopping.
There is no offer of free parking on the site, just "no parking outside of marked bays, no parking without a permit" etc.0 -
Magnum0121 wrote: »The car was parked on private land managed by CPM, parked outside of a bay with no permit. Not causing an obstruction or using someone else's bay.
The charge was issued to the car when I was in the process of moving out from the owned flat into a house. The flat is still owned by me but I have tenants renting it.
There are no visitors bays or anywhere to temporarily park whilst attempting to unload belongings or shopping.
There is no offer of free parking on the site, just "no parking outside of marked bays, no parking without a permit" etc.
As it's still your flat, what does your lease say about parking0 -
Hello, could I please have some feedback on my claim form defence?
The alleged contravention is for parking without a permit in a residents area, outside of a bay. The amount claimed is £250 in total for an original single charge of £60.
I've already registered with MCOL.
Thank you in advance for any help.
Here are my defence points:
1.a. The amount claimed is unreasonable as it is significantly higher than the original charge of £60.
1.b.The amount claimed is unreasonable as the parking company have suffered no loss or damages.
2.a. There is no breach of contract as there is no offer of free parking. Jolson v Homeguard (2016) it was established that ParkingEye v Beavis (2015) does not apply to residential parking.
2.b. If the wording of the signage forbids parking then there is no offer to park and therefore no contract. In PCM-UK v Bull et al (2016) residents were parking on access roads. The signage forbade parking therefore no contract was in place. A trespass had occurred, but that meant only the land owner could claim, not the parking company.
2.c. In UKPC v Masterson (2016) it was also found that the signage was forbidding, so the matter was one of trespass. The parking company did not have standing to claim.
2.d. In Horizon Parking v Mr J it was also found that the signage was forbidding, so the matter was one of trespass. The parking company did not have standing to claim.
3.a. I was not the driver of the the vehicle at the time of the alleged contravention. The parking company are not relying on POFA 2012 therefore I am under no obligation to name the driver.
3.b. Excel v Mr B - Sheffield (2016) the Judge made it clear that without proof of driver, and without invoking keeper liability, there was no claim against the keeper.0 -
Magnum0121 wrote: »Here are my defence points:
1.a. The amount claimed is unreasonable as it is significantly higher than the original charge of £60.
1.b.The amount claimed is unreasonable as the parking company have suffered no loss or damages.
In bold in the newbies sticky thread:
Irrelevant Defences and How To Avoid Them - what NOT to argue (DO NOT ARGUE ''NO LOSS' OR 'EXTORTIONATE CHARGE'):
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5555458
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This is a residential car parking case and you are the owner of a flat in that estate.
As mentioned you are missing a massive trick if you do not check your lease and find out what it say about parking. If will likely say you have rights to park and easements. Check your lease and find out what it says.
I would also be on to the Management Company who would have contracted this PPC and ask them why they don't get it cancelled for you. If they fob you off go to the freeholder (the people you pay your Ground Rent too).
If you can let us know the location (we can then check signage on Google Street Maps), the Managing Agent and the Freeholder we can advise - this should have all been done previously, but its never too late to do this alongside building your defence.0 -
Thanks, I do need to find the lease asap. I've had a quick look but couldn't find it. I'll have another look tonight.
I know that the parking management company was changed from UKPC to CPM, so I'm hoping that the lease states that UKPC are managing the parking, then possibly CPM wouldn't have any authority to manage the parking?
I will remove the first point from my defence about unreasonable charges. Whilst I'm at it I may remove the "I wasn't the driver" point as the link posted above states that it could be irrelevant to my case.
Are my points in section 2 of my defence relevant? "No contract" feels like my strongest point along with the cases mentioned0 -
I can't get a street view actually down the road as it is private. But on the entrance to the road there is a sign up saying "private road. Residents parking only". Followed by the usual no parking signs with hard to read conditions and phone numbers dotted around.0
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Unless the PPC was there from the very beginning before anyone moved into the flats then I doubt your lease will say anything about parking controls and UKPC or UK CPM. These PPCs are brought in by Management Agents after the event to try to "help" residents and "control" the car park. They use outdated methods (like paper permits) deliberately to facilitate issuing tickets (some do the "you need to renew your permit every year wheeze").I know that the parking management company was changed from UKPC to CPM, so I'm hoping that the lease states that UKPC are managing the parking, then possibly CPM wouldn't have any authority to manage the parking?
It will be your Management Agent (the people you pay service charge to) who almost certainly contracted the PPC. Have you even spoken to them about this? They should be able to provide you with the contract they signed with the PPC. I would also complain to them that you are being taken to court by their agent ... especially if you are using the facilities in accordance with your lease.
Also your lease is paramount, you will absolutely need this.0
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