Being taken to court -letter from judge help please

24

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  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 37,628 Forumite
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    Mistral001 wrote: »
    You will be sworn in when giving evidence...
    That's unlikely.

    Although the rest of your post is sound.


    OP, have you seen this short video?...
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=n93eoaxhzpU
  • Fire_Fox
    Fire_Fox Posts: 26,026 Forumite
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    startingout2016 wrote: »
    looking back I wish I had.

    I had a screaming baby and 2 men in my house who refused to leave. It was very scary.

    Did you involve the police at a later stage? Did the police take a statement and investigate? That would support your assertion that you were coerced or intimidated into signing the invoice.

    What do you mean by the trader behaving so badly, the debt collector letters?

    Bear in mind that the trader is *claiming* that you behaved badly, by having work done but not paying the invoice. The trader will be *claiming* that you are using their *honest* mistake when trying to collect the debt to wriggle out of paying.

    It is not wasting time for a court to fairly assess statements, and put questions to or clarify points with all parties or their witnesses, if any.

    Judges, magistrates and the police want to be on the side of the innocent or injured party. They take a dim view of the legal process being abused, and a dim view of being lied to. You just have to do everything you can, to help them help you. :)

    From experience, judges and magistrates can be very kind to people who are nervous/ scared, and that are clearly being dragged through the court process by shysters or criminals.
    Declutterbug-in-progress.⭐️⭐️⭐️ ⭐️⭐️
  • AndyMc.....
    AndyMc..... Posts: 3,248 Forumite
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    Fire_Fox wrote: »
    Did you involve the police at a later stage? Did the police take a statement and investigate? That would support your assertion that you were coerced or intimidated into signing the invoice.

    What do you mean by the trader behaving so badly, the debt collector letters?

    Bear in mind that the trader is *claiming* that you behaved badly, by having work done but not paying the invoice. The trader will be *claiming* that you are using their *honest* mistake when trying to collect the debt to wriggle out of paying.

    It is not wasting time for a court to fairly assess statements, and put questions to or clarify points with all parties or their witnesses, if any.

    Judges, magistrates and the police want to be on the side of the innocent or injured party. They take a dim view of the legal process being abused, and a dim view of being lied to. You just have to do everything you can, to help them help you. :)

    From experience, judges and magistrates can be very kind to people who are nervous/ scared, and that are clearly being dragged through the court process by shysters or criminals.

    What’s there for the police to investigate? Sounds like a civil dispute.
  • Rusty_Shackleton
    Rusty_Shackleton Posts: 473 Forumite
    AndyMc..... wrote: »
    What’s there for the police to investigate? Sounds like a civil dispute.

    hmm, harassment, coercion?

    I'm with Fire Fox on this, immediately after the event the OP should have contacted the police to report the tradesman intimidating them into signing an invoice that they wouldn't have signed if not under duress.
  • startingout2016
    startingout2016 Posts: 210 Forumite
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    in hind sight maybe I should have contacted the police.

    At the time I was quite shaken up and didnt really know what to do.

    The next day I drafted a letter to the company to explain why I wasnt paying and they ignored it and followed up with a revised invoice with a £100 late fee added the week after.
  • Working_Mum
    Working_Mum Posts: 559 Forumite
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    My advice would be to do a factual, dated timeline starting with the contract that you employed their services on - this should state whether they can charge anything for late payment etc (I am particularly thinking about the £100 they added on as a late fee).

    This process helped calm me down when I was faced with a similar situation a few years ago.

    Read any correspondence slowly and take notes of the questions you have to answer and the timescales involved.

    Good luck
  • robatwork
    robatwork Posts: 7,089 Forumite
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    What you need to realise is, to a judge reading and hearing evidence, they will often hear the "signed under duress" excuse and generally pay it little attention. To them, and to the trader...."you would say that, wouldn't you"

    So I would focus less on
    startingout2016 wrote: »
    Last May I had a problem with a trader who forced me to sign an invoice

    and much more on
    startingout2016 wrote: »
    for work they hadnt carried out before they would leave my house.

    Get photos before and after on the area they haven't done what the invoice says, and other evidence like an invoice from whoever else actually did the work, perhaps a statement from them as well.

    Note I do believe you were coerced, but you have no proof of that.
  • startingout2016
    startingout2016 Posts: 210 Forumite
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    robatwork wrote: »
    What you need to realise is, to a judge reading and hearing evidence, they will often hear the "signed under duress" excuse and generally pay it little attention. To them, and to the trader...."you would say that, wouldn't you"

    So I would focus less on



    and much more on



    Get photos before and after on the area they haven't done what the invoice says, and other evidence like an invoice from whoever else actually did the work, perhaps a statement from them as well.

    Note I do believe you were coerced, but you have no proof of that.

    Thank you. And that is my main concern.
    I have no proof.
    Its my word against him.

    He is saying that he was there quoting for a new boiler. Obviously I didnt go with them so they did no work at all.
    They say on their website that they do free estimates so no idea why he thought he could charge for it.
    At one point he started going on about damp and bought out a damp meter and told me about a company he knew of that would damp proof my home. (My home doesnt have rising damp).

    It was all very strange.
  • stator
    stator Posts: 7,441 Forumite
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    So print out their website and take it with you.


    There's a significant chance he won't turn up to court, but you need to be prepared anyway
    Changing the world, one sarcastic comment at a time.
  • tacpot12
    tacpot12 Posts: 7,962 Forumite
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    edited 19 January 2019 at 1:21PM
    The judge is going to want to look at the contract for the work. It sounds like there wasn't a contract (even a verbal one) because there was no understanding that the 'work' would be charged for, and you had a reasonable belief that it would not be because the company offered free quotations (and presumably you asked for a quotation? You haven't stated what the work is so we're guessing at what is at issue here).

    If so, this is your defence; that there was no contract. The fact you signed an invoice saying they did the work (the quotation?) is no evidence that a contract existed. You might state that you did not intend to be legally bound by signing the invoice, because you did so under duress and only to get the men out of the house.

    I would also offer as evidence information about the time the firm spent performing the quotation (if this is the work that is at issue). To be fair, if the firm spent two or three hours measuring all the rooms, the sizes of existing radiators, surveying the insulation in the loft and asking you about insulation under the floor and in the walls, then they do really deserve to be paid something. They should have explained the circumstances under which quotations were not free - when they require a lot of work, it is reasonable to pay the firm something for the work in designing and sizing a heating system to suit your home. The judge will help work out what is fair.
    The comments I post are my personal opinion. While I try to check everything is correct before posting, I can and do make mistakes, so always try to check official information sources before relying on my posts.
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