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  • FIRST POST
    • lindylootoo
    • By lindylootoo 8th Aug 18, 11:42 AM
    • 36Posts
    • 6Thanks
    lindylootoo
    Making Tax Digital
    • #1
    • 8th Aug 18, 11:42 AM
    Making Tax Digital 8th Aug 18 at 11:42 AM
    I'm given to understand that MTD becomes compulsory by April 2019 - can anyone confirm that?

    Isn't there a cutoff for small business? Many VAT registered companies are still too small for accounting software and many who have moved to accounting software do not want to be dictated to by software suppliers to upgrade (and increase fees) just to have software which sends VAT returns automatically? For very many years I have used my Government Gateway for this........it suits my purpose very well and I really don't want the issues to transferring to newer, fancier, bells and whistles, , software.

    TIA
Page 5
    • Pennywise
    • By Pennywise 21st May 19, 2:05 PM
    • 12,082 Posts
    • 23,863 Thanks
    Pennywise
    Why is the computer not connected to the internet?, you will need an internet connection to make a return or end up getting an accountant or someone you trust to do it for you. There are several packages that allow you to make a return. What export facility does your account package have?

    If you want to make a manual return you can use my software (you will need to have a pc with an internet connection)

    Regards
    Kevin
    Originally posted by kevin grey
    Or he could apply to HMRC for an exemption
    • johnhemming
    • By johnhemming 25th May 19, 4:02 PM
    • 22 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    johnhemming
    HMRC are giving out quite a few exemptions, but they are not accepting all of the applications.
    • sasparillo
    • By sasparillo 26th May 19, 6:24 PM
    • 303 Posts
    • 37 Thanks
    sasparillo
    Paper tax return still available
    You can still ask HMRC for a paper tax return.
    • AbbieCadabra
    • By AbbieCadabra 26th Jun 19, 11:43 AM
    • 1,597 Posts
    • 960 Thanks
    AbbieCadabra
    Search for "Free" on the HMRC recognised software list and you should come across Portico - see vat.portico.openanswers.co.uk
    Originally posted by gilbertthecat
    just for info in case it does turn out to be an issue.

    We've been on DD payments for a while on VAT. For our current quarterly return I've signed up for MTD (took 2 days for it to be confirmed ok by HMRC) & filed using the free portico software as above without any problems.

    Our return has been received ok by HMRC but it isn't overly clear that the DD is still active & portico is only bridging software so it doesn't refer to it when the return is filed, & I wouldn't expect it to.

    Our HMRC online account is a little ambiguous & looks like there's an active DD for vat, but then again, possibly not according to another screen!

    I've finally managed to get thru to VAT (tel:0300 2003700 call queues are very lengthy) & they've advised that the DD is active & 'should' transfer across to the MTD system next week. But if a payment hasn't been taken by 12th July, call them again to query.

    I asked if I could make a bacs payment instead now & then just check the DD again for the next quarter, but this was advised against as it could mean a duplicate payment by DD. HMRC have assured me that there won't be any late payment penalty if the DD doesn't work as they're treating everything as a 'soft landing' & there are lots of known issues with MTD...

    As expected, it's all going swimmingly well then
    • Slinky
    • By Slinky 27th Jun 19, 6:32 PM
    • 6,251 Posts
    • 29,585 Thanks
    Slinky
    I logged into check earlier and it looks as though there is the usual request for a VAT return for me for the next quarter. I haven't registered for MTD and have stopped trading recently, so with any luck I'll be able to submit one last return, pay what's due and forget about MTD.
    • johnhemming
    • By johnhemming 29th Jun 19, 3:51 PM
    • 22 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    johnhemming
    Our return has been received ok by HMRC but it isn't overly clear that the DD is still active & portico is only bridging software so it doesn't refer to it when the return is filed, & I wouldn't expect it to.
    Originally posted by AbbieCadabra
    The APIs do not handle DDs directly, but the return receipt when you submit a return should tell you whether a DD is registered or not.

    You can also use the other APIs to look up HMRC's data base to find out what they are expecting.
    • johnhemming
    • By johnhemming 29th Jun 19, 3:52 PM
    • 22 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    johnhemming
    I logged into check earlier and it looks as though there is the usual request for a VAT return for me for the next quarter. I haven't registered for MTD and have stopped trading recently, so with any luck I'll be able to submit one last return, pay what's due and forget about MTD.
    Originally posted by Slinky
    I am not aware of anyone being fined as yet for not using MTD, but this quarter about to end is the first mandatory quarter (there have been mandatory months).

    I am also unaware of any penalties for late submissions as yet.
    • Barney Rubble 0403
    • By Barney Rubble 0403 29th Jun 19, 6:28 PM
    • 104 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    Barney Rubble 0403
    Picking up on the DD side of things. I managed to get our first MTD VAT return in just on time - hell of a time getting Sage and server software updated. No problems with the return, allreceived on HMRC system.

    Received an email to say the existing DD would be replaced with a me one quoting a new reference number. I can see this logged on our banking system but the DD was never taken. The Gateway has us logged as overdue.

    Rang them on Friday and they could offer no explanation. It doesn't look lile it was ever requested rather than being rejected. Had to pay it manually.

    Looks like there are others out there with,th the same problem so it looks like a bug in the system.
    • johnhemming
    • By johnhemming 29th Jun 19, 7:38 PM
    • 22 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    johnhemming
    Received an email to say the existing DD would be replaced with a me one quoting a new reference number. I can see this logged on our banking system but the DD was never taken. The Gateway has us logged as overdue.
    Originally posted by Barney Rubble 0403
    Can you tell me the date on which you applied to join MTD and when your previous period ended?

    I have raised an issue with HMRC about similar situations. One potential cause is that a DD is reset in between a submission being made and the dd being due to be taken. I think this can happen if people join in between the two points.
    • Barney Rubble 0403
    • By Barney Rubble 0403 29th Jun 19, 8:10 PM
    • 104 Posts
    • 64 Thanks
    Barney Rubble 0403
    @johnhemming - the VAT return was febt to Apr and the return was sent a few days before the due date. June 4/5th - something like that. I didn't get to register for MTD until late May due to ongoing compatibility issues.

    From memory I believe their DD email was dated May 23rd. So all relatively last minute.
    • johnhemming
    • By johnhemming 30th Jun 19, 9:14 AM
    • 22 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    johnhemming
    @Barney Rubble
    They have always had problems with things changing before the due dates. At one stage they needed 3 working weeks plus 48 hours before the filing date (in that case 4/5 June) before the DD would get lost. They were supposed to reject applications that were too late, but didn't always do that.

    I think the probable cause of your DD being lost was that you changed across just a bit too close to the DD being taken.

    My recommendation to people has been to wait a week until after the previous DD is taken and then to apply to join MTD. A lot of my clients don't actually use DDs for HMRC, but generally this has worked. What I don't know, however, is whether your DD will now work or not
    • AbbieCadabra
    • By AbbieCadabra 8th Jul 19, 11:03 AM
    • 1,597 Posts
    • 960 Thanks
    AbbieCadabra
    our DD transferred across ok as I've had an email today from HMRC advising that the payment is due to be taken soon.

    I think it's been more luck than judgment on my part that it's worked ok as I probably just caught it 'right' for registering for MTD, filing a return & time required for DD to transfer, but a refreshing change when something works!
    • zebedyboy
    • By zebedyboy 8th Jul 19, 8:26 PM
    • 9 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    zebedyboy
    Being a small company of just 2, and only just exceeding the threshold, we are looking for a free or low cost bridging software for next VAT return submission in September for May, Jun, Jul. Does anyone recommend PORTICA or 100PcVatFreeBridge (Comsci) both free, or CMH bridge at 7.50 plus VAT per return. Or can you recommend any other low cost solutions to suit? My records are held in Excel 2010. I have not yet registered for MTD filing. Thank you.
    • Slinky
    • By Slinky 9th Jul 19, 3:38 PM
    • 6,251 Posts
    • 29,585 Thanks
    Slinky
    I am not aware of anyone being fined as yet for not using MTD, but this quarter about to end is the first mandatory quarter (there have been mandatory months).

    I am also unaware of any penalties for late submissions as yet.
    Originally posted by johnhemming

    I've finished trading in my business now so submitted my VAT return (for quarter ending July 31st) using the old portal, and have paid what I owe. I've also deregistered. Can't see what they would have to complain about.
    • AbbieCadabra
    • By AbbieCadabra 11th Jul 19, 2:59 PM
    • 1,597 Posts
    • 960 Thanks
    AbbieCadabra
    Being a small company of just 2, and only just exceeding the threshold, we are looking for a free or low cost bridging software for next VAT return submission in September for May, Jun, Jul. Does anyone recommend PORTICA or 100PcVatFreeBridge (Comsci) both free, or CMH bridge at 7.50 plus VAT per return. Or can you recommend any other low cost solutions to suit? My records are held in Excel 2010. I have not yet registered for MTD filing. Thank you.
    Originally posted by zebedyboy
    I've used the portico free bridging software for our 1st return without any issues, very straight forward to use & received by HMRC almost instantly. Just allow a few days for HMRC to process your MTD registration as it took a full 2 days to receive our confirmation when registering recently.
    • Ash Pole
    • By Ash Pole 12th Jul 19, 9:52 AM
    • 153 Posts
    • 25 Thanks
    Ash Pole
    Does anyone know if these free bridging software will cope with a partial exemption calculation? This is for a charity using Sage50.
    • Pennywise
    • By Pennywise 12th Jul 19, 10:08 AM
    • 12,082 Posts
    • 23,863 Thanks
    Pennywise
    Does anyone know if these free bridging software will cope with a partial exemption calculation? This is for a charity using Sage50.
    Originally posted by Ash Pole
    As far as I know, bridging software just picks up the VAT return box figures from your software/spreadsheet and populates them into a system that allows for electronic submission to HMRC as required - they don't actually "do" any calculations etc.

    You partial exemption calculations would still, presumably, be done as you do them now, i.e. maybe in a spreadsheet, so you'd link the Sage output to your spreadsheet, then do the partial exemption number crunching in your spreadsheet to produce the VAT return box figures, which is what you link via bridging software to HMRC MTD system.

    That's my understanding of how it will work, from what I've seen and read on forums like this and some courses I've been on. I've not yet seen any bridging software in use, so there may be some that are a little more functional than an automated "copy and paste" routine.

    Alternatively, can you not do journal adjustments within Sage to make the necessary changes to each VAT return box and then continue to use Sage to make the automatic submission to HMRC using their MTD system?

    Have you asked on the Sage forums - there'll be a lot of people in your position.
    • comsci
    • By comsci 12th Jul 19, 10:17 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    comsci
    As far as I know, bridging software just picks up the VAT return box figures from your software/spreadsheet and populates them into a system that allows for electronic submission to HMRC as required - they don't actually "do" any calculations etc.
    Originally posted by Pennywise
    That's exactly what 100PcVatFreeBridge does and probably most other bridging solutions, apart from the simple calculations for Box 3, total VAT due and Box 5 VAT Payable / Reclaimable. Just a means of submitting your return electronically in an MTD compliant fashion.
    • Ash Pole
    • By Ash Pole 12th Jul 19, 10:53 AM
    • 153 Posts
    • 25 Thanks
    Ash Pole
    As far as I know, bridging software just picks up the VAT return box figures from your software/spreadsheet and populates them into a system that allows for electronic submission to HMRC as required - they don't actually "do" any calculations etc.

    You partial exemption calculations would still, presumably, be done as you do them now, i.e. maybe in a spreadsheet, so you'd link the Sage output to your spreadsheet, then do the partial exemption number crunching in your spreadsheet to produce the VAT return box figures, which is what you link via bridging software to HMRC MTD system.

    That's my understanding of how it will work, from what I've seen and read on forums like this and some courses I've been on. I've not yet seen any bridging software in use, so there may be some that are a little more functional than an automated "copy and paste" routine.

    Alternatively, can you not do journal adjustments within Sage to make the necessary changes to each VAT return box and then continue to use Sage to make the automatic submission to HMRC using their MTD system?

    Have you asked on the Sage forums - there'll be a lot of people in your position.
    Originally posted by Pennywise
    Thanks for the reply.

    We've had a bit of a ding-dong with Sage about this. We purchased Sage50 outright a couple of years ago but Sage told us we needed to upgrade to the cloud system to do MTD at extra cost. Then we discovered this won't handle a group/partial exemption calculation anyway and we'd need additional bridging software.

    Fortunately we've got a deferral until the end of the year before having to submit using MTD.
    • johnhemming
    • By johnhemming 14th Jul 19, 7:02 PM
    • 22 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    johnhemming
    Vat returns where there are adjustments to be made generally need bridging because many cloud systems cannot take the adjustments. Domestic Reverse charge will add some extra complications to this later this year.

    There are, however, now over 400 MTD applications and a goodly number are free.
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