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  • FIRST POST
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 19th Apr 18, 10:33 PM
    • 165Posts
    • 92Thanks
    Ibcus
    HX Car Park Management PCN wrong reg typed into machine
    • #1
    • 19th Apr 18, 10:33 PM
    HX Car Park Management PCN wrong reg typed into machine 19th Apr 18 at 10:33 PM
    My partner received this letter a few days ago from HX Car Park Management.
    hxxp://i63.tinypic.com/zwkpbq.jpg

    The driver paid for a parking ticket but put the reg in as 06, as they have done in older machines over the years.

    This is the ticket they paid for (they keeps them all, a work thing)
    http://i64.tinypic.com/2911b2a.jpg

    The registered keeper phoned them the other day, while I was at work, telling them the driver had a valid ticket for the time they was on the car park, they wasn't interested as the driver hadn't validated it and they seemed quite happy to see her in court.

    I drove to the car park last night to have a look at it.

    This is the main thing you see, it's very large and between two pay points.



    The only mention of inputing a full and vaild reg number is on the pay machine in small text and also on signs on walls quite a distance away.

    payment post


    Not the best picture, but there you go





    In the vast experience that I know is out there on this forum, how likely is it that she/we are going to have to jump through hoops to bring this to logical outcome?
    Last edited by Ibcus; 11-07-2018 at 12:38 AM.
Page 4
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 30th May 18, 11:41 PM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    Not sure why you think I'm posting old letters as new ones, you clearly seem to have a problem with me.



    First letter:



    Second letter:
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 30th May 18, 11:50 PM
    • 17,871 Posts
    • 21,768 Thanks
    KeithP
    Can you not see this on your latest letter?

    .
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 30th May 18, 11:53 PM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    Not sure what you mean, see what?


    Edit:


    Sorry, having ISP probelms and the image you posted didn't load.


    Of course I see the date, that is the main reason I posted the scanned image of the letter we received a few days ago.




    It annoyed me that it was dismissed as 'not a recent letter'
    Last edited by Ibcus; 31-05-2018 at 12:15 AM.
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 11th Jul 18, 12:11 AM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    Recieved this the other day.


    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 11th Jul 18, 12:14 AM
    • 76,465 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    Right, a LBC just like everyone gets, as covered in the NEWBIES thread post #2 or on any other Gladstones thread. We can't type what to do on every thread, this is in the NEWBIES thread.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 11th Jul 18, 12:29 AM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    I've read the thread (and so many more) a few times, so much to take in.


    I will read again.


    Posted the letter to update the thread.


    I will probably have questions that will annoy and frustrate you, please don't be too harsh
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 11th Jul 18, 12:58 AM
    • 76,465 Posts
    • 89,804 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Why not just read another ten Gladstones threads? Easy.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT UNLESS IN SCOTLAND OR NI
    TWO Clicks needed Look up, top of the page:
    Main site>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 18th Jul 18, 12:41 AM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    considering this to send:

    Dear Sirs,


    My reference: xoxooox


    When your client first contacted me I requested dated photos of all the signage on site and all images of the vehicle in question.
    This request was ignored, a simple ‘pay here’ was sent instead.


    This Letter Before Claim, however, contains insufficient detail of the claim and, again, fails to provide the photographic evidence which I requested in April 2018. It does not even say what the cause of action is. Nor does it contain any mention of what evidence your client intends to rely on, or enclose copies of such evidence.


    Please note: I have physical evidence that the parking fee displayed on the signage applicable to the vehicles stay was purchased on the day in question.
    This evidence has been sent to your client and ignored.


    I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:

    1. what the details of the claim are (where it is claimed the car was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated, what contractual breach (if any) is being claimed)

    2. whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
    3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
    4. a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim
    5. a copy of any alleged contract with the driver
    6. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
    7. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
    8. A detailed explanation of costs that you have added on to the original charge, what that represents and how it has been calculated.



    The alleged debt is disputed and any court proceedings will be vigorously defended.

    This Letter Before Claim on the part of your client is a clear breach of its pre-action obligations set out in the Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct, with which as solicitors you must surely be familiar with. As you (and your client) must know, the Practice Direction binds all potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time.

    Nobody, including your client, is immune from the requirements and obligations of the Practice Direction.



    I am clearly entitled to this information under paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c) of the Practice Direction. I also need it in order to comply with my own obligations under paragraph 6(b).

    If your client does not provide me with this information then I put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of
    Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) !!!8211; Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855 in asking the court to impose sanctions on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant to paragraphs 13 ,15(b) and (c) and 16.


    Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.

    Yours faithfully,



    Norman Tebbit
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 19th Jul 18, 11:59 AM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    Bump........
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 19th Jul 18, 10:25 PM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    No comments at all?
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 19th Jul 18, 10:29 PM
    • 17,871 Posts
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    KeithP
    It's a response to an LBA.

    There are sample LBA responses in the NEWBIES thread.

    Is yours any different?
    If so, why?
    .
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 19th Jul 18, 10:42 PM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    I guess my LBC is no different to any other, I took a sample response and changed it ever so slightly.


    I'll send it as it is, thanks.
    • RobinofLoxley
    • By RobinofLoxley 20th Jul 18, 12:47 AM
    • 243 Posts
    • 426 Thanks
    RobinofLoxley
    Can you not see this on your latest letter?

    Originally posted by KeithP
    I suspect this 'date of sending' is a typo by HX, which is a blunder by them.
    • RobinofLoxley
    • By RobinofLoxley 20th Jul 18, 12:53 AM
    • 243 Posts
    • 426 Thanks
    RobinofLoxley
    To the OP - I am unable to open the link you posted for an image of the original ticket that was paid for.

    How many correct digits of the VRN are on the ticket?

    I have noticed this statement by HX on their website.

    Allowing for Human Error
    In the BPA's statement, mention is made to the possibility of a parking charge notice (PCN) being issued as a result of human error, saying we do recognise that errors can occur and they can be upsetting for the motorist.
    In many cases, parking tickets are cancelled by the operator when they are given additional information, said the BPA.

    We can confirm that, with HX Car Park Management, this is absolutely the case. Not only that, but in every instance of a PCN being issued, we will actively assess the possibility of human error. To this end, if the number plate entered by the motorist displays up to two characters difference from the number plate of the vehicle in question, we will automatically dismiss the case as human error and recall the relevant parking charge.
    EDIT - Just noticed this statement from HX about human error was already mentioned in post #38 by another poster.
    Last edited by RobinofLoxley; 21-07-2018 at 2:57 PM.
  • archived user
    As was mentioned yesterday in Parliament, are you able to put in the "incorrect" VRM into the DVLA site here to see if there is another car with the "incorrect" VRM.

    https://vehicleenquiry.service.gov.uk/

    If there is no other vehicle, then the DVLA will have told HX this via an error message when the DVLA database was accessed.
    • RobinofLoxley
    • By RobinofLoxley 21st Jul 18, 2:54 PM
    • 243 Posts
    • 426 Thanks
    RobinofLoxley
    I would ask Gladstones to send you the paper copies of the Information Sheet and Reply Form that they should have included with the LBC as required as per Paragraph 3.1 (c) of the Pre Action Protocol..

    On the reply form you ask for copies of all the documents you require. I would definitely ask for an unredacted copy of the contract that HX have with the landowner that shows they the authority to take legal action. Also a full copy of the ANPR log for the day the keeper's vehicle was there.
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 2nd Aug 18, 10:53 PM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    I recently sent an email to gladstones.
    I had a search around the site to find a gladstones email address to use and came across these two:

    litigation@gladstonessolicitors.co.uk
    administration@gladstonessolicitors.co.uk

    It seems these email addresses cannot be used.

    Remote Server returned '550 5.7.133 RESOLVER.RST.SenderNotAuthenticatedForGroup; authentication required; Delivery restriction check failed because the sender was not authenticated when sending to this group'
    I would assume they are internal only, you need to be on the authorised list or they have Microsoft Exchange setup wrong.


    In short don't use them, the mail will bounce back
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 3rd Aug 18, 6:01 AM
    • 25,093 Posts
    • 40,465 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Try this one?

    enquiries@gladstonessolicitors.co.uk
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in the critiquing of court case papers, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask.
    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day;
    show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 4th Aug 18, 12:49 AM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    I should have added that enquiries@gladstonessolicitors.co.uk was the one that didn't bounce back, I sent to all 3
    • Ibcus
    • By Ibcus 4th Aug 18, 3:33 PM
    • 165 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    Ibcus
    I received the informarion sheet and reply forms from Gladstones today as requested by sending the cut off slip.

    It came with 2 FAQ sheets, one double sided.

    I know nothing about the new Pre-Action Protocol but I've seen it mentioned on here lots of times.


    It would also seem pointless in asking for pictures of signage and a copy of the conrtact, as they have no intention of giving either (14) and (16)
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