Sourdough and long fermentation specifically

thriftwizard · 12 June 2019 at 12:43PM

silverwhistle I can't tell you how many starters I've thoughtlessly murdered! Not to mention all the ones I've started that just haven't turned out right; waayyy too sour or nowhere near vigorous enough... The current one I begged from our local artisan bakery, and an expert friend has helped me understand how to keep it alive & "refresh" it to full capacity when needed. So much so that I'm going on one of her "day courses" the weekend after next; she's spent a long time researching, delving into the science etc. & has lots of hints & tips to pass on to help simplify the process.

There's so much conflicting information out there, online & in various books. I think previously I got bogged down with technicalities like adding an eighth of a teaspoon of salt at 4-hourly intervals (even through the night? Thank you, Californian bakers...) and needed to hear that it can be simple and that you don't need expensive kit!

silverwhistle · 12 June 2019 at 1:59PM

thriftwizard wrote: »

silverwhistle I can't tell you how many starters I've thoughtlessly murdered!

Thank you for that and the rest of your (sort of reassuring )post! I must try again soon. I use a large kilner jar for my starter but have never got it quite right.

PS your location sounds like 'Ampshire too. It's a wet horrible day here so I might go and grab an untreated lemon for another go. There's a bottle of bottle conditioned beer somewhere too so perhaps start a beer barm of sorts. It can work away whilst I'm at ladies football training tonight and then bake tomorrow.

Vanlady · 12 June 2019 at 5:45PM

Ooooh loving this thread......thank you kittie for getting us ....erm.....started! .....excuse the pun:D

Kittie - what's the longest period you've ever let you starter sleep for? I think I've left mine for 10 days, took a while to revive, but it did. Hardy little so N so! Can't believe it's survived so long with me!

Pollywollydoodle (love your name:D!) - yes, I bake my loaf under an upturned Pyrex bowl, it acts like a Dutch oven, or a cloche. But sometimes I don't bother, for experiment sake, and it turns out just as good as long as I have the temp high.

Silverwhistle - you could try adding a slice of apple to your starter, I've done that before and it seems to love it!

Thrift wizard - I've never heard of adding salt to the starter before, I thought that would have slowed it down?
Does anyone else do this?

caronc · 12 June 2019 at 8:32PM

silverwhistle wrote: »

PS: No need for razors for slashing: a fine, well sharpened knife should do. Anyway, not sure I'm to be trusted with such a razor, my legs would end up in a right state. :-)

After trying various knives (well sharpened) I found the razor well worth the few pounds it cost but defintely not essential.

I not sure what you keep your starter in matters that much as long it is a good size and has a lid. I use a 1L kilner-type jar from Asda which I think was £1.50. My son's fiancee uses a tall plastic tub from a cheap IKEA set. The longest I've left my starter in the fridge without feeding was 8 days and it was a bit sad looking but came back just fine after discard/feeding and leaving on the counter for a couple of hours before popping back in the fridge.

Before I started on sourdough, I used to often mix the yeast with water, about a third of the weighed flour and a pinch of sugar and let it "think" covered on the worktop overnight and then carry on with the bread making the following day.

Camomile · 13 June 2019 at 10:41PM

Oooh, found my crowd:j:j:j

Baked one bread about 10 years ago and never tried it again as too much work kneading the !!!!!!.

Returned to it because of food issues of my son. Still learning.

No expensive equipment needed, I bake mine in casserole dishes and prove in wicker basket with linen cloth/pyrex bowl oiled and dusted with flour/oats.

Baked 2 loaves yesterday straight after proving and 2 this morning. 2 with herbs, 2 with onion. Love it. Moist, tasty(too tasty) and doesn’t go stale.

Having a first go at pizza tomorrow, dough in the fridge.

About flour: using bog standard bread flour from asda, wholemeal strong from tesco(awesome),canadian superstrong and mixture of speciality flours from Doves Farm (spelt, rye, buckwheat).

At the rate I’m going and neighbours asking I might consider buying flour by sack, was looking at Shipton Mill flours, maybe worth looking if you have any local mills around you?

Camomile · 13 June 2019 at 10:45PM

Has any of you tried autolyse? It’s mixing flour and water and leaving it for a while- it helps to develope gluten structure reducing kneading required.

Vanlady · 15 June 2019 at 7:28AM

Hi there Camomile,

Yes, I always try to autolyse, even if it's just for 20 mins or so, like you say, really helps with the kneading.
Your bread flavours sounds yum. Tell me, do you fry your onions before adding it to your dough?
And how did your pizza go? No more buying supermarkets ones ones from now on I bet!

Caronc, I love the idea of letting some of your dough 'think ' overnight, I do that when making ciabatta. I think it's called a 'poolish '. But a great way to give the bread a depth of flavour.

Unfortunately no mills too close to me. I used to buy a big sack of Canadian manitoba flour when I was in Costco, but now an aldeee has opened up 10 mins walk from me I buy my bread flour from there. I honestly can't see any difference plus it's at least half the price. And.....I had to stop my Costco membership as Vanman used to go wild in there and spend far too much money:D

Wraith lady, I haven't yet made sourdough rolls, only ever a loaf. I must give that a go.

Righteo, off to feed my starter. We're away glamping at the minute and yes.....I've brought my starter with me. No oven here, so I'll just make flat breads with the dough in a few days.

Ps just reading back and ooops realised that kittie opened this post back in 2017, great to see it being revived!

VJsmum · 15 June 2019 at 5:33PM

I don't knead mine... I stretch and fold. Although sometimes the dough comes out runny so I just stir it a bit and pour.

Can you tell i'm not purist

it's always edible...

I don't slash mine either and bake in a loaf tin with a roasting pan of water on the shelf above....

caronc · 15 June 2019 at 7:36PM

Camomile wrote: »

Has any of you tried autolyse? It’s mixing flour and water and leaving it for a while- it helps to develope gluten structure reducing kneading required.

Yes definitely seems to help it come together better.:)

Vanlady wrote: »

Caronc, I love the idea of letting some of your dough 'think ' overnight, I do that when making ciabatta. I think it's called a 'poolish '. But a great way to give the bread a depth of flavour.

What a great name:D, I'd heard it referred to as a "biga" before and also a "sponge". Regardless of the name it does seem to boost the flavour and getting an airy structure.:)

Camomile · 15 June 2019 at 9:47PM

Vanlady, I fried finely chopped onions until they started to go brown in small quantity of olive oil.

Pizza went fine, I just need to adjust the quantity of dough as made far too much. Chickens enjoyed the rest though. You’re right, it’s completely different to greasy supermarket ones, able to roll out the dough really thin. I need to work on tomato sauce though, seemed to be very tomatoey when I cooked it, on the pizza, it lacked “zing”.

VJ’s mum, I also stretch and fold.

Last time I made enough dough for 4 loaves, 2 baked straight away after final proving, 2 left to “think about” in the fridge overnight. It’s also called retarding I heard. Once I left the dough for a few days only because I shove shopping in the fridge and only discovered it when tried to shuffle things aroud. Bread still turned out good.

My base flour is asda strong bread one as it works out cheapest for me at the moment. Might think about buying sack from Shipton seeing as it’s organic just to try.

Happy baking:)

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Sourdough and long fermentation specifically

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