Elderly parent with savings

Lil_frazzle · 10 February 2019 at 10:30AM

My dad who I have been estranged from for many years recently got quite ill and went to a nursing home. He is 78.

I came on board after being contacted by his social workers and tried to get his house back to normal as it was in a terrible state, for him to return home with a care package.
It has now recently came to light that over the past few years his benefit money has been building up in his bank account to a tune of around £70’000.
I was bringing him his post and before I knew this helped him fill in a routine form which he signed and on it he stated he had no savings.

This man is very denial about having any money. And is very non compliant about pretty much everything.

So apparently his social worker declared he would be self funding due to savings being too high. And the benefits office now want to know how much savings he has. Again he says that he has none which is obviously not true.

The benefits have wrote to me too ask this. How do I get him to agree a total of his savings, or should I tell them and is that even legal. He is deemed fully capable of making decisions.
Will I get into trouble for helping him fill in the form as I had no knowledge of savings.
And how do we pay it all back?
Also if he pays it all back he wouldn’t have been liable for self funding so should he challenge this to get state funding.

pmlindyloo · 10 February 2019 at 11:04AM

Do you know what benefits your dad is receiving?

If it is Pension Credit then he may have an income assessed period during which he did not have to report any changes in savings. His PC award letter should tell you whether he has one or not.

https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/assessed-income-period

To be honest, I am very surprised that Pension Credit has asked you for this information if you are not his appointee, or have lasting power of attorney and he is mentally capable of making his own decisions.

My personal feelings are that you should write to PC and tell them that you are not your dad's appointee/have lasting power of attorney and he has mental capacity so you have no authority to give them any financial information.

Once you know whether there is an assessed income period you could try to speak to your dad but if he is not co-operative then I feel you should leave well alone.

Cheeky_Monkey · 10 February 2019 at 11:42AM

How did you and his social worker find out about his £70k savings?

You might want to persuade him to be more compliant before he is potentially prosecuted for benefit fraud!

Lil_frazzle · 10 February 2019 at 12:14PM

Not entirely sure how the social worker knew. And I found out recently from his social worker. As I queried the self funding.

I filled the form in with his answers as he can’t write and I got him to sign it. But I added a note that he was in a home and that I had filled it out for him so I guess that is why they’re asking me.

Re benefits he is on dla, housing benefit and a state pension and there was something else but I can’t remember. So I would assume all of them should have stopped at some stage or something?

Thanks for the advice re telling them that I am not his appointee etc and that he is of sound mind as that never crossed my mind. I’d say he knew what he was doing and that it been going on a while and all I can do is advise him to rectify it.

I don’t think he would get prosecuted as he is completely bed bound now.

KatrinaWaves · 10 February 2019 at 12:32PM

If he is ONLY on the benefits you describe above them the only overpayment will be from housing benefit. Neither DLA nor his SP would be changed my savings.

I am going to assume along with HB he may have got help to cover his council tax from the council too, which will have also been overpaid, so that alongside rent costs could be significant.

pmlindyloo · 10 February 2019 at 12:40PM

It is very difficult to advise without knowing exactly which benefits he is on.

As I said if he was on Pension Credit then he may have had an assessed income period where he didn't have to notify them of a change of circumstances. If this was the case then then he would still have been automatically entitled to housing benefit. His DLA is not means tested but is affected when you go into a care home.

Since you did not know that he had the savings when you completed the form for him then you have done nothing wrong.

However, now you know which makes things difficult.

Although I do not think you have any legal duty to report his savings there is the moral issue.

How would you feel about telling the authorities that he has these savings?

I do not know whether social services would be legally bound to report their findings of these savings. Does anyone know?

If your dad is not protected by an assessed income period then he would have to pay back any monies owing.

What would then happen as regards paying for his care I do not know. Someone else wrote, I believe, on another thread, that social services said that paying back a debt would not be allowed?????

Could you speak to the social worker?

Sorry I cannot be of more help. Hopefully others will comment.

calcotti · 10 February 2019 at 1:08PM

Lil_frazzle wrote: »

I filled the form in with his answers as he can’t write and I got him to sign it. But I added a note that he was in a home and that I had filled it out for him so I guess that is why they’re asking me.

That doesn't make you responsible. You have simply acted as a scribe, the information on the form is as supplied by your father and confirmed by him by means of his signature.

Alice_Holt · 10 February 2019 at 1:18PM

KatrinaWaves wrote: »

If he is ONLY on the benefits you describe above them the only overpayment will be from housing benefit. Neither DLA nor his SP would be changed my savings.

However, if he remains in a nursing home for more than 28 days then he will be no longer eligible for the DLA care element. The DLA mobility component will also stop if he is receiving nursing care.
It is the claimant's responsibility to notify the DWP of these circumstances.

http://www.rights4seniors.net/content/after-28-days

Lil_frazzle · 10 February 2019 at 3:12PM

Ok so I found out the benefits and they are attendance allowance income support and pension. He is in as temporary care so apparently he would have been allowed his aa as he is self funding and also income support for 52 weeks. But of course this would only be true re the income support if he didn’t have loads of savings.
So it is obvious he shouldn’t have been claiming income support housing benefit or whatever else. So how far back do they look as this may have been going on a while. I simply don’t know as I said earlier I was estranged.
Realistically I should just ring and tell them it’s nothing to do with me and I have no power of attorney. But part of me wants to try and help.

elsien · 10 February 2019 at 3:18PM

Pass the information on to the social worker and let them sort it out.
They need to know because if he's assessed as self funding then has to pay back a load of overpaid benefits that couid leave him in difficulties.
They can also carry out a financial capacity assessment if there is any doubt.
With regards to power of attorney and presuming he has capacity obviously your dad wouid have to agree that he wants one, decide who he wants to act for him and agree to pay for it. Are any of these likely?

Lil_frazzle · 10 February 2019 at 3:23PM

I doubt he would agree to anything at all. He really is a very difficult individual. When I asked did he have any savings he got nasty and said he has no money and only gets invalidity and old age benefit (his words). When I said “you must have savings if they are making you self fund” he said he wasn’t paying anything because he has no money.

But yes I will get the social worker to take over as when the over paid is sorted out. I have no idea how we will get him to pay it back as he would refuse. Maybe they can just take it back?

Elderly parent with savings

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