water softner help in chosing and is this true

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  • sapstar
    sapstar Posts: 50
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    This is a fairly big thread with lots of information on water softeners. I didn't get a chance to read through it. Can someone help me answer my question please?

    I got a quote for £1600 from a local company who installs water softeners, to install a Twintec S3. I later found that there are other models with good reviews around the internet which could be installed by hiring a plumber. Below are the 2 models I am currently looking at. Can someone please recommend what to get? I have a family of 2 adults and 2 kids with 2 bathrooms.

    Water2Buy W2B800 (£599 at Amazon) or Monarch Midi (£491 at Amazon). I am very much included at the W2B due to it being a bigger machine and less regeneration. I understand regeneration consumes a lot of water.

    Also I am looking for a reverse osmosis water purifier. How is the Water2Buy RO500?

    I appreciate any help.
  • sapstar
    sapstar Posts: 50
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    After my previous post, I realised that the W2B800 is too big to fit next to my washing machine due to its height. I have now decided to go with Monarch Midi.

    Now the tricky thing is, I am unable to decide which kit I need to order. There are multiple kits being sold, one for combi boilers, one for 15mm pipes, etc... I have a combi boiler, but I also have 15mm pipes. Unsure which one to order.
  • that
    that Posts: 1,532 Forumite
    If you look on ebay.co.uk there is a second hand Monarch Midi for sale with no bids for £99 and a buy it now price for £249
  • Fazzie
    Fazzie Posts: 1 Newbie
    Read quite a few of the comments. Looking at buying a Monarch Solo Ultra (Non electric due to the amount of power cuts).
    Has anyone got any advice on this model

    Thanks
  • Read through bits of the thread, very interesting. I would like to add, if not already covered: Electrical cost of running the electrical powered units is probably somewhere in the region of £40-50 / year (based on 50W permanently, 12p/kWh)... over 10 years that is £400-500... so cost is a non electric at sub £700 (e.g. Monarch Solo Ultra) is probably better value over its life.
  • Doc_N
    Doc_N Posts: 8,267
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    KGosrani wrote: »
    Read through bits of the thread, very interesting. I would like to add, if not already covered: Electrical cost of running the electrical powered units is probably somewhere in the region of £40-50 / year (based on 50W permanently, 12p/kWh)... over 10 years that is £400-500... so cost is a non electric at sub £700 (e.g. Monarch Solo Ultra) is probably better value over its life.

    The electricity costs are, in reality, nothing like £40-50 per year - because these units only use the 50W you quote for a small amount of time. The rest of the time the use is minimal - just powering an LCD display.

    Reworking your figures to allow for about 1.5 hours usage every three days (pretty typical) produces a yearly cost of around £1 - about £10 over the 10 year period you mention, rather than your estimated £400-£500.

    I think most people could live with that, given that the Monarch Solo Ultra costs around £240 more to buy than the Tapworks AD11. :)
  • bazzie
    bazzie Posts: 62
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    Hi All,

    My first post here so please forgive any ignorance and for the long post - I came across this thread by pure chance & felt like it might be the God Send I am such dire need of!

    I am a complete Novice & Neophyte when it comes to Water Softeners & have found it very hard to do any meaningful research on what to buy & how to make an informed choice!

    We live in NW London in 5 Bed, 2 Bathroom Home with a Worcester Bosch 35Cdi Combi Boiler & have huge scaling problems.

    I have finally decided to invest in a WS but am really quite lost as to what to get & whether it is good quality & worth the money.

    Some points to consider:

    1) Want Good Strong/Flow & Pressure Rates so no water or pressure drop if both bathrooms & things like dishwashers & washing machines, heating etc are all used at the same time - especially the showers!

    2) Are “Fittings Kits” included always supplied with the Water Softener or are they an extra purchase? If an extra purchase, why are they so expensive at over a £100 for just a few plastic parts & a a couple of hoses etc?

    3) Can a “Fittings Kit” by made up by just buying the needed bits from somewhere like Screwfix/Toolstation etc?

    4) Would like a model with easily available & reasonably priced parts if ever needed in future - even generic parts that could be bought at places like Screwfix etc.

    5) Do I need a “High Flow/High Pressure” Model?

    6) Good build Quality & not cheaply or flimsily made so bits do not break of like the lid/hinges etc

    7) How many Litres are needed for my place - 10L/14L/20L?

    8) Economical to run/operate including cost of the salt

    9) Modern LCD Display & easy to use, set & service

    10) How to tell if the Resin inside any WS is of the highest/Higher Quality?

    11) VERY IMPORTANT - If buying new, I would prefer ones with a 5 or 7 Year warranty


    Harveys Type Non Electric Models:

    Intitially, these really appealed to me due to being:

    - No Power needed & always on line but what about flow & pressure?
    - The Twin Tank Systems means Water always available
    - Easy to install & other so called "advantages" of this non electric twin cylinder system

    BUT
    - Do not like using expensive block salt
    - Very expensive - will only buy a used/reconditioned one
    - Which one - Harveys, Crown, Twin Etc, Kinetico etc?
    - What do i need to consider for my place & what are the downsides?
    - Are they suitable/powerful enough for our home?

    - Non Harveys - Non Harveys Types:

    - Much cheaper to buy new but are they any good & if so, which ones?

    Electric Types:

    - Currently no Power Plug under sink & maybe a challenge to install one there - need to consider hassle & cost electrician will charge to put a socket there
    - No Idea which is a good/best one as they all look ugly as hell to me so tend to look at the aesthetics only!
    - Prefer an easy to use LCD display & maintenance/hassle free one
    - What size do I need for my place & without compromising of water pressure/flow?
    - Is it good idea to get a bigger, more capacity & higher performing model than technically needed to allow for extra “Headroom”? That is to be safe, get the next model up?
    - Do not want any of the Home Visit Sales people coming round as I suspect they will cost thousands & try to do the hard sell!

    Been looking at Amazon/Ebay etc but need assurance of after sales service & that the warranty will be honoured with out extra costs like returns costs & parts etc. So far (& mainly based just on LOOKS(!)) I have made a preliminary list of the following:

    Twin Tank Harveys Types under various Brands - all ugly & mega expensive new so will only consider used/reconditioned to save money & will live with the looks IF these are suitable for my home - I see they can be had for about £300 s/h - is this worth the risk or is it a false economy?

    Other Non-Electric Types - Monarch Solo/Solo Ultra & the Scalemaster Softline 150 are the two that I could find - any others worth considering & are they as good as the Harveys Types? Do they also have Twin Cylinders?

    Electric Types:

    - Ecowater Models - these look awesome but fear they will be very expensive as sold via dealers who need to come round to do an “assessment”!
    - Monarch Midi Hi-Flo/Midi Ultimate - these “claim” to have the highest flow rates? & get good reviews?
    - BWT WS355HF - seems to get good reviews? Force India promote them on their F1 Cars!
    - Tapworks AD11 - I see some have recommended it here but dealer "blurb" states it is nowhere near as good as the Ecowater ones?
    - Tapworks Infinity - a little expensive tbh but looks pretty good?
    - Calmag Calsoft Mini - Looks kinda OK?
    - Aqualdial Softlife Hitec Hi-flo - again, looks kinda OK?

    These are just some I looked at by basic perusing & have no idea which are suitable & better at what than each of the others so if there are other better ones, please kindly let me know! I saw some cheaper ones from a company called Water2buy but they looked pretty cheaply made & nasty to me & learned that you have to fork out about an extra £100 for a fittings kit which really put me off but they did seem to get plenty of good reviews on Amazon?

    Most on the list seem to range from about £350-£500 & I would prefer to pay around £300-£350 but for better quality & longer warranty, I would pay extra. Many are on ebay, amazon & their own websites & some are offering a free Filter Tap (which I would buy later anyway) - is the free one supplied worth having (in case it might be crap) or is it just a sales tactic & is it better to but the unit alone if it can be found cheaper without the free Filter Tap?

    Like I said, I am a complete neophyte regarding Water Softeners & feel like I am searching in the dark without a flashlight with no clue on how to navigate. I was considering a “Water Conditioning System” like Combimate & the various others but from what little I have gleaned is that they might be very good but not as good as a salt based softener? Every year we need to have boiler parts replaced & scale gets everywhere. To give an example, I bought a brand new Kettle, & put not one but 4 steel wire balls inside to collect scale but they have made next to nil difference & the new kettle scales up within a matter of days!

    My profound apologies for being this ignorant & what makes me nervous, is that unlike many other home devices around that get reviewed by multiple sources professionally, there is very little if any regarding Water Softeners which leads to to believe there might be much smoke & mirrors out there!

    PLEASE let me know of other things that I might need to consider or take account of as I have just started looking into this WS world!

    Many Kind Thanks!
    Bazzie!
  • bazzie wrote: »
    feel like I am searching in the dark without a flashlight with no clue on how to navigate.

    This thread (if you go through it) will answer all of your questions and more....
  • Doc_N
    Doc_N Posts: 8,267
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    As you say, there's a lot of smoke and mirrors out there, and you've already experienced some I think in view of your comment about the Tapworks AD11.

    Somebody might answer all your questions, but I'm afraid it would take too long - most of the answers are already in the thread.

    Best advice is to look at one of the cheaper softeners recommended (after checking them out fully) and take with a very large pinch of salt anyone who tells you you need to spend much more than £500 for a perfectly decent softener. There are huge profit margins in this industry, but you don't need to pay them.
  • bazzie
    bazzie Posts: 62
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    ihshaikh wrote: »
    This thread (if you go through it) will answer all of your questions and more....

    Hi,

    Thanks for the reply - I will surely have a read & try to absorb as much as I can in the hope I might at least learn some stuff about WS in general if nothing else!

    Many Thanks!
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