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  • FIRST POST
    • danrv
    • By danrv 9th Jun 19, 2:11 PM
    • 81Posts
    • 6Thanks
    danrv
    Unidare warm air heater not charging
    • #1
    • 9th Jun 19, 2:11 PM
    Unidare warm air heater not charging 9th Jun 19 at 2:11 PM
    Hi
    I have an old Unidare R10/73 warm air storage heater on E10 that has stopped charging.
    Iíve had the unit turned off at the main switch as the weatherís warmer but after turning it back on, thereís nothing.
    The 15a fuse at the main switch is ok and the fan operates as this is wired into a separate circuit.
    Just wondering if anybody knows these storage heaters and whether thereís a reset on the thermostat or something.
    Any help appreciated.
Page 1
    • danrv
    • By danrv 10th Jun 19, 9:36 AM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    • #2
    • 10th Jun 19, 9:36 AM
    • #2
    • 10th Jun 19, 9:36 AM
    Ok, might get an electrician to take look. May be something simple.
    Donít think many people are running this type of heating anymore and storage heaters such as this are no longer made.
    Iíve discussed other electric heating options at length here on other posts so might be time to upgrade.
    • jk0
    • By jk0 10th Jun 19, 11:17 AM
    • 3,033 Posts
    • 26,547 Thanks
    jk0
    • #3
    • 10th Jun 19, 11:17 AM
    • #3
    • 10th Jun 19, 11:17 AM
    Just get a multimeter set to continuity buzzer, and work through the off peak circuit from live to neutral. There can't be many cutouts and thermostats in the circuit.
    • Benight
    • By Benight 10th Jun 19, 3:18 PM
    • 314 Posts
    • 111 Thanks
    Benight
    • #4
    • 10th Jun 19, 3:18 PM
    • #4
    • 10th Jun 19, 3:18 PM
    Ok, might get an electrician to take look. May be something simple....
    Originally posted by danrv
    Probably best.
    You don't wanna be going meddling with electric stuff yourself if you don't know what you're doing

    Better safe than sorry
    • danrv
    • By danrv 11th Jun 19, 12:55 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    • #5
    • 11th Jun 19, 12:55 PM
    • #5
    • 11th Jun 19, 12:55 PM
    Thanks. I do repair most things if I can.
    Continuity check would be ok if I can get to the circuits.
    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 11th Jun 19, 1:30 PM
    • 4,525 Posts
    • 2,889 Thanks
    matelodave
    • #6
    • 11th Jun 19, 1:30 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Jun 19, 1:30 PM
    Just make sure that it's isolated from the mains before prodding around inside it

    Is it a Unidare or Dimplex Electricaire. If Dimplex have a shufti here https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1162167/Dimplex-R7.html?page=6#manual
    Last edited by matelodave; 11-06-2019 at 1:35 PM.
    Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large numbers
    • danrv
    • By danrv 11th Jun 19, 4:07 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    • #7
    • 11th Jun 19, 4:07 PM
    • #7
    • 11th Jun 19, 4:07 PM
    Just make sure that it's isolated from the mains before prodding around inside it

    Is it a Unidare or Dimplex Electricaire. If Dimplex have a shufti here https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1162167/Dimplex-R7.html?page=6#manual
    Originally posted by matelodave
    Thanks for the manual. Itís a Unidare R10/73 but the wiring for the R7 would be the same.
    As much as Iíd like it fixed, Iím a bit reluctant to do any further examining of the heater due to the Vermiculite insulation inside.
    Most people have done away with these storage heaters including my neighbours, who had the same. Theyíre now on electric rads.
    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 11th Jun 19, 4:26 PM
    • 4,525 Posts
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    matelodave
    • #8
    • 11th Jun 19, 4:26 PM
    • #8
    • 11th Jun 19, 4:26 PM
    Electric rads will cost twice as much to run as you wont get the benefit of off peak electricity but you might find them a bit more controllable. You need to check whether you'd need your meters/tariff changed and possibly some wiring changes as well.

    If you do decide to go for electric rads remember that a £25 one from Argos or somewhere similar will cost the same to run and give out the same amount of heat as similarly rated super-duper extra special one, filled with magic fairy dust costing £100's from the likes of Fischer or some other exotic manufacturer. Be warned
    Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large numbers
    • danrv
    • By danrv 11th Jun 19, 6:18 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    • #9
    • 11th Jun 19, 6:18 PM
    • #9
    • 11th Jun 19, 6:18 PM
    Thanks for the reply.
    My E10 off peak times are way off the normal 3 block arrangement. Been here for just over a year and the timer clock mustíve drifted and hasnít been reset. Iíve worked it out and my cheap rate is 5.10am to 3.10pm in one block.
    Quite useful for washing, electric shower etc..
    Evening though is peak rate and more expensive than the standard one.

    Iím not out everyday so not sure which rate would be best but I think I can put rads in and still use the E10 tariff as all sockets are on it.
    The storage heater is on a timer and automatically charges when off peak is active (it used to anyway).

    Iíve read up on here about the electric rad business and have already had a Fischer chap visit. Very expensive quote but did include removal of storage heater at reasonable cost.
    Also have another quote for 6 chamotte clay rads plus WiFi hub thatís a quarter of the Fischer price.
    Or thereís always the cheaper alloy type that donít retain the heat. Would like central control though.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 13th Jun 19, 1:55 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    If you do decide to go for electric rads remember that a £25 one from Argos or somewhere similar will cost the same to run and give out the same amount of heat as similarly rated super-duper extra special one, filled with magic fairy dust costing £100's from the likes of Fischer or some other exotic manufacturer.
    Originally posted by matelodave
    Thanks. Just wondering if the surface area of an electric radiator makes a difference in heat output ie a basic £20 2kw oil filled portable radiator compared to a super duper 2kw Chamotte Clay one.
    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 13th Jun 19, 2:30 PM
    • 4,525 Posts
    • 2,889 Thanks
    matelodave
    a 2kw heater on for one hour will provide 2kwh of heat never more but possibly less if it's got a thermostat

    It might get a better distribution from a bigger area but if the rad is filled with clay, magic dust, fairy oil or some other wonderful or exotic material it wont produce more heat. The best heat distribution is from a fan heater cos it blows it all over the place.

    Likewise the fact that a magic heater might store the heat (say like a storage heater) then it will take a finite time for the heat to get stored which means that the radiator will take some time to warm up and then when it switches off it will take some time to cool down based on the amount of insulation in the unit. However it wont give out more heat than it's rated at

    A proper storage heater is rated at say 2kwh and is filled with very high density bricks and insulation to retain the heat. It will heat for seven hours using off peak electricity thus storing approx 14kwh of heat - this is slowly released throughout the next 14-16 hours when the heater is actually switched off.

    However a magic dust heater, can't store the heat for more than an hour or so and thus needs to use peak rate leccy to provide heat when you need it and will cost you at your peak rate tariff when it's on.

    You appear to be being sucked in by the advertising about so called Chamotte Clay. In what way is this different to the stuff that Fischer put into their heaters and charge silly prices for. Likewise Rointe, who's heaters are basically oil-filled rads. They look pretty but cost exactly the same to run as a much cheaper heater from Argos or Amazon.

    Clever controls with digital readouts or remote operation might mean that the temperature control is a a bit more accurate but they wont save you anywhere near as much as you'll pay up front for them.
    Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large numbers
    • danrv
    • By danrv 13th Jun 19, 8:12 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    Thanks for the info.
    I have 2kw fan heater just for a quick heat boost and it gets the room warm in about a minute and have to turn it off otherwise too hot.
    My heating situation is a bit of a dilemma as I’m electric only unless I go for
    a complete oil wet system from scratch. Fair bit of distruption, not a lot of room for a tank
    and would need a flue installed too.
    Also fossil fuel.
    My 3 bed house design has ducting and vents in the walls and the Unidare is a central unit.
    Modern storage heaters are space heaters only unfortunately so my dry central heating system is
    not upgradable.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 16th Jun 19, 10:08 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    You appear to be being sucked in by the advertising about so called Chamotte Clay. In what way is this different to the stuff that Fischer put into their heaters and charge silly prices for.
    Originally posted by matelodave
    It’s the same. The radiator design seems to be available under different brand names.
    They are expensive but I like the clay idea for retaining heat.
    Not sure if it’s possible but If I can get my E10 off peak times better suited for daytime on demand heating then they would be cheaper to run.
    Last edited by danrv; 16-06-2019 at 11:13 PM.
    • coffeehound
    • By coffeehound 16th Jun 19, 10:36 PM
    • 2,780 Posts
    • 4,714 Thanks
    coffeehound
    My 3 bed house design has ducting and vents in the walls and the Unidare is a central unit.
    Modern storage heaters are space heaters only unfortunately so my dry central heating system is
    not upgradable.
    Originally posted by danrv
    There have been previous threads on here about the ducted warm air systems ó it would be worth your while reading them as there are still people out there who can service them, and many users are very happy with the unidare systems by all accounts.

    The magic clay radiators are a rip off ó they are not proper storage heaters and are unjustifiably expensive; please donít be sucked in by disingenuous advertising copy.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 16th Jun 19, 11:52 PM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    There have been previous threads on here about the ducted warm air systems ó it would be worth your while reading them as there are still people out there who can service them, and many users are very happy with the unidare systems by all accounts.

    The magic clay radiators are a rip off ó they are not proper storage heaters and are unjustifiably expensive; please donít be sucked in by disingenuous advertising copy.
    Originally posted by coffeehound
    Thanks. I think those threads are mine. Any others seem to be regarding removal and asbestos
    issues.
    I may be wrong but I donít think anybody is using electric warm air systems now.
    While it worked, it was very good and I could maybe get someone to take a look.
    Also Iíd get an asbestos check and opinion on it.
    The cupboard door is lined with it but it has been sealed. Pinned on so would get rid of the whole door if it came to it.

    There was a suggestion to check out Elnur storage heaters. Thinking three could be used for downstairs heating but not sure how that would fit in with my electrics.
    If fan operated, Iím assuming theyíd need two feeds.
    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 17th Jun 19, 6:51 AM
    • 4,525 Posts
    • 2,889 Thanks
    matelodave
    It’s the same. The radiator design seems to be available under different brand names.
    They are expensive but I like the clay idea for retaining heat.
    Not sure if it’s possible but If I can get my E10 off peak times better suited for daytime on demand heating then they would be cheaper to run.
    Originally posted by danrv
    The are NOT storage heaters, they only retain heat for less than an hour (and of course it will take that long to heat them up in the first place)

    Please read the thread about Fischer heaters to find out what people think and some of the horror stories of ridiculously high prices and then high running costs https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=3516223&highlight=fischer

    Calling it something different or shrouding it in mysterious technospeak doesn't make them better or more efficient.

    But in the end it's your money and your choice
    Last edited by matelodave; 17-06-2019 at 6:56 AM.
    Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large numbers
    • danrv
    • By danrv 17th Jun 19, 10:30 AM
    • 81 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    danrv
    The are NOT storage heaters, they only retain heat for less than an hour (and of course it will take that long to heat them up in the first place)

    Please read the thread about Fischer heaters to find out what people think and some of the horror stories of ridiculously high prices and then high running costs https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=3516223&highlight=fischer

    Calling it something different or shrouding it in mysterious technospeak doesn't make them better or more efficient.

    But in the end it's your money and your choice
    Originally posted by matelodave
    Thanks. Yes, I realize that they’re not storage heaters. Just that they retain heat longer than oil filled rads.
    I have read and do get the whole Fischer thing and have had one of those quotes.
    The fact is that all electric heaters are 100% efficient. The problem is the cost per unit of electricity compared to gas.
    Will need to check how my E10 off peak cost compares to gas prices but I hope to run electric radiators sparingly on off peak electric.
    Hot water is ok as I just turn immersion on for 30mins during off peak hours.
    And yes, agree that the German radiators and the like are way overpriced. A £20 portable heater produces same amount of heat but would like something that’s Lot20 compliant.
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