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  • FIRST POST
    • stephan
    • By stephan 13th Mar 18, 12:21 AM
    • 3Posts
    • 2Thanks
    stephan
    Did my surveyor lie to us
    • #1
    • 13th Mar 18, 12:21 AM
    Did my surveyor lie to us 13th Mar 18 at 12:21 AM
    We just bought our first house. In December we got a Homebuyer Survey done by a local company. There were a few notes to get a professional expert to check this or that.

    Now we have finally completed and got the keys we had a good look around and noticed one thing.

    In the kitchen downstairs the chimney had been taken out but is still present in the bedroom above. Next to the chimney upstairs is the old airing cupboard. When I lifted the carped I could see how they had "secured" the chimney.

    (sorry as a new user I can't post images or links. please copy and replace [DOT] with a "." )
    cdn.pbrd[DOT]co/images/HbCZRPG.jpg
    cdn.pbrd[DOT]co/images/HbCZ!!!.jpg
    cdn.pbrd[DOT]co/images/HbCZDTH.jpg

    A friend of mine said that he thinks that building regs would require steel beams due to the weight of the chimney.

    I am not sure when the chimney was removed but it would have been at least 7 years ago ( extension was added ) possibly even 12 years ( conservatory was added and doors between kitchen and conservatory was removed ). No cracks in the ceiling in the kitchen at all.

    Now back to the survey. The survey said: "The original fireplace to the breakfast kitchen has been removed and the flue sealed."

    (sorry as a new user I can't post images or links. please copy and replace [DOT] with a "." )
    cdn.pbrd[DOT]co/images/HbD3doM.jpg

    Nothing else was mentioned. So the above images don't look like it sealed. Also when he did the inspection there was a bed in front of the airing cupboard. I doubt that he would have moved it. So if he didn't move it, how could he have stated that the flume is sealed? Did he really check or did he just assume? There was nothing to suggest that we need to check this out closer and hire a "professional expert".

    So I guess my 2 main questions are:

    1. Does the chimney work look decent or is my friend right and steel support is needed?

    2. If steel support is needed, did the surveyor lie and didn't check things out properly?

    Thanks for any help and advice.
Page 1
    • franklee
    • By franklee 13th Mar 18, 1:35 AM
    • 3,686 Posts
    • 3,973 Thanks
    franklee
    • #2
    • 13th Mar 18, 1:35 AM
    • #2
    • 13th Mar 18, 1:35 AM
    Image links two work but am not getting the middle one?

    cdn.pbrd.co/images/HbCZRPG.jpg
    cdn.pbrd.co/images/HbCZ!!!.jpg
    cdn.pbrd.co/images/HbCZDTH.jpg
    Last edited by franklee; 13-03-2018 at 1:39 AM.
    • Smodlet
    • By Smodlet 13th Mar 18, 5:13 AM
    • 3,171 Posts
    • 6,291 Thanks
    Smodlet
    • #3
    • 13th Mar 18, 5:13 AM
    • #3
    • 13th Mar 18, 5:13 AM
    I can't get any of the links to work but, if a chimney breast has been removed I am pretty sure it should be supported by a steel as your friend says. A civil engineer's report would tell you whether it has been (not cheap) or you could ask a builder to come and look at it, probably for free.
    What is this life if, sweet wordsmith, we have no time to take the pith?
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    • Doozergirl
    • By Doozergirl 13th Mar 18, 6:33 AM
    • 25,194 Posts
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    Doozergirl
    • #4
    • 13th Mar 18, 6:33 AM
    • #4
    • 13th Mar 18, 6:33 AM
    I can't see anything clear but it doesn't look amazing. Something has been done though. Gallows brackets used to be acceptable but don't meet building regs anymore. Nothing has to change if it's already been done. Tripled-up joists are common now, steels less so. Anyhow, it is notifiable work under building regulations so the surveyor should have told you to check for a certificate. That would be your confirmation.

    You don't need a civil engineer - they'll design you a motorway bridge or something. It's a structural engineer you need. Send your photos to one. A builder can tell if something is inadequate but they aren't qualified to say what should be there.
    Last edited by Doozergirl; 13-03-2018 at 6:36 AM.
    Everything that is supposed to be in heaven is already here on earth.
    • stephan
    • By stephan 13th Mar 18, 7:06 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    stephan
    • #5
    • 13th Mar 18, 7:06 AM
    • #5
    • 13th Mar 18, 7:06 AM
    Thanks so far for your responses.

    Here are the first 3 images again. hopefully they work this time.

    i.imgur.com/Mf2jrA8.jpg
    i.imgur.com/Dv8gO7m.jpg
    i.imgur.com/lRbipj3.jpg


    Should the surveyor noticed that this isn't done right and written it in his report? Do the wordings show that he didn't do his job properly?
    • Doozergirl
    • By Doozergirl 13th Mar 18, 7:33 AM
    • 25,194 Posts
    • 68,802 Thanks
    Doozergirl
    • #6
    • 13th Mar 18, 7:33 AM
    • #6
    • 13th Mar 18, 7:33 AM
    It's been supported by joists on hangers. It doesn't look pretty but it could be adequate. Some effort has been made at least. Your friend is wrong about steels being needed.

    Flues are sealed at the top so I wouldn't be looking in a cupboard for evidence of that.

    Surveyors don't move furniture, so I wouldn't expect them to do that to look in a cupboard anyway but people wouldn't expect the work to be visible in he cupboard.

    What survey did you commission? I would expect them to say you needed to check for something like 'relevant permissions and consents'. I would not be expected them to inspect the work itself.
    Everything that is supposed to be in heaven is already here on earth.
    • stephan
    • By stephan 13th Mar 18, 8:42 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    stephan
    • #7
    • 13th Mar 18, 8:42 AM
    • #7
    • 13th Mar 18, 8:42 AM
    The title of the survey was

    Home Survey and Valuation (RICS Level 2)

    If the flume is sealed at the top, how would he know that it is sealed?
    • AnotherJoe
    • By AnotherJoe 13th Mar 18, 8:54 AM
    • 9,605 Posts
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    AnotherJoe
    • #8
    • 13th Mar 18, 8:54 AM
    • #8
    • 13th Mar 18, 8:54 AM
    Inspection camera?
    If it wasnt sealed you might expect to see marks on the ceiling underneath it where water has come through.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 13th Mar 18, 9:05 AM
    • 17,602 Posts
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    AdrianC
    • #9
    • 13th Mar 18, 9:05 AM
    • #9
    • 13th Mar 18, 9:05 AM
    Thanks so far for your responses.

    Here are the first 3 images again. hopefully they work this time.





    Should the surveyor noticed that this isn't done right and written it in his report? Do the wordings show that he didn't do his job properly?
    Originally posted by stephan
    You say that you noticed these joist hangers when you lifted the carpet?

    Read your survey... The surveyor doesn't - can't - lift carpet or move furniture.
    • AnotherJoe
    • By AnotherJoe 14th Mar 18, 6:14 AM
    • 9,605 Posts
    • 10,683 Thanks
    AnotherJoe
    Thanks so far for your responses.

    Here are the first 3 images again. hopefully they work this time.
    <snipped>

    Should the surveyor noticed that this isn't done right and written it in his report? Do the wordings show that he didn't do his job properly?
    Originally posted by stephan
    Possibly at the time these were done, they were "done right", building regs change over time, but even if no changed maybe joist hangers are sufficient. Pragmatically it would be simpler and likely cheaper, if a beam is what you want, to have one installed yourself rather than attempt legal redress.

    Stuff like this is why i gave up on surveyors reports, probably there are enough caveats in yours to support the chimney breast.
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