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  • FIRST POST
    posttokev
    Probate/intestacy stalemate query
    • #1
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:12 PM
    Probate/intestacy stalemate query 5th Mar 13 at 5:12 PM
    Dear All,

    I was hoping someone might be able to help me with a probate/intestacy matter. I have simplified the circumstances as best I can below.

    My maternal grandmother died intestate in January 2012, shortly after which her son sold his home and moved into the home formerly occupied by my maternal grandparents. My mother wishes that the proceeds of my grandmother's estate be split 50 - 50 between herself and her brother. (They are the only two children of my grandparents.) However, he insists that he is entitled to the entirety of the estate.

    Correspondence between solicitors for both parties appears to have reached a stalemate and I am looking for some guidance as to how my mother can best proceed with this matter without incurring significant costs.

    Please could you tell me:

    If my uncle can legally reside at the home formerly occupied by my maternal grandparents under these circumstances.

    If there are any means by which my mother can enforce the eviction of my uncle from this property whilst he refuses to address the issue of the distribution of the estate .

    If there are any means by which my mother can break the current stalemate and enforce the distribution of the estate on a 50 - 50 basis between herself and her brother.

    Any help you can offer me would be very much appreciated.

    Thank you very much for your help,

    Kevin.
    Last edited by posttokev; 05-03-2013 at 7:35 PM. Reason: correction
Page 1
    • Gingernutty
    • By Gingernutty 5th Mar 13, 5:19 PM
    • 3,519 Posts
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    Gingernutty
    • #2
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:19 PM
    • #2
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:19 PM
    Try this questionnaire. The laws are different according to where in the country you are.

    If there was no will and no other relatives, then the estate must be distributed equally between the remaining offspring (your mum and your uncle).

    Your uncle's solicitor should have explained this, but what he actually told the solicitor is anyone's guess.

    Either your uncle can buy out your mother's share to own the house outright or he has to leave.

    Hoe you get him to leave is beyond me.
    Last edited by Gingernutty; 05-03-2013 at 5:24 PM.
    Don't know what I'm doing, but doing it anyway...
  • posttokev
    • #3
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:24 PM
    • #3
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:24 PM
    Just to clarify, this does not concern inheritance tax as this is not a concern in this case.
    • Gingernutty
    • By Gingernutty 5th Mar 13, 5:26 PM
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    Gingernutty
    • #4
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:26 PM
    • #4
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:26 PM
    Yeah, but the page I directed you to takes you through the steps to determine who inherits what in such a case.
    Don't know what I'm doing, but doing it anyway...
  • posttokev
    • #5
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:29 PM
    • #5
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:29 PM
    Cheers. We know that, as there is no will, the estate should be split 50 - 50 between my mother and her brother (my uncle), but there is a stalemate as he believes the entirety of the estate should go to him. I am looking to ascertain what we can do to move this forward.
    • NAR
    • By NAR 5th Mar 13, 5:47 PM
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    NAR
    • #6
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:47 PM
    • #6
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:47 PM
    Your mother should put the property up for sale. Her solicitor can write to uncle's solicitor setting out the intestate rights, saying this is why she has put the house up for sale and ask why he has not instructed your uncle about the intestacy rules.
  • posttokev
    • #7
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:56 PM
    • #7
    • 5th Mar 13, 5:56 PM
    Would my mother not need the permission of my uncle to do this though? (As legally they both own the house now, although my uncle feels that it should be solely his.)
    • RAS
    • By RAS 5th Mar 13, 6:08 PM
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    RAS
    • #8
    • 5th Mar 13, 6:08 PM
    • #8
    • 5th Mar 13, 6:08 PM
    Has either uncle or mother applied for probate (letters of administration)?
    Last edited by RAS; 05-03-2013 at 6:12 PM. Reason: correction
    The person who has not made a mistake, has made nothing
    • daska
    • By daska 5th Mar 13, 6:10 PM
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    daska
    • #9
    • 5th Mar 13, 6:10 PM
    • #9
    • 5th Mar 13, 6:10 PM
    Have either of them applied for letters of administration? If not why not?

    What grounds is your uncle's solicitor citing to justify disinheriting your mother?
    Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants - Michael Pollan
    48 down, 22 to go
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  • posttokev
    Does probate apply if there isn't a will?
  • posttokev
    I do not know if he has applied for letters of administration as we have no contact with him. Can my mother do this or can he block her?
    • daska
    • By daska 5th Mar 13, 6:19 PM
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    daska
    No, Probate doesn't apply, it's Letters of Administration if she died intestate.
    Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants - Michael Pollan
    48 down, 22 to go
    Low carb, low oxalate Primal + dairy
    From size 24 to 16 and now stuck...
    • RAS
    • By RAS 5th Mar 13, 6:19 PM
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    RAS
    If there is no will, your mother needs to contact the Probate office and arrange to get letters of administration. If she can do this before unlce, then she has control over the estate (assume he has already started the process).

    The local probate Office can advise on how to do this process. Get a quick valuation from a local estate agent.
    The person who has not made a mistake, has made nothing
    • daska
    • By daska 5th Mar 13, 6:20 PM
    • 6,011 Posts
    • 11,915 Thanks
    daska
    It may be that your Uncle's solicitor may have advised him to do apply and the correspondence is simply a delaying tactic. Don't hang around.
    Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants - Michael Pollan
    48 down, 22 to go
    Low carb, low oxalate Primal + dairy
    From size 24 to 16 and now stuck...
    • RAS
    • By RAS 5th Mar 13, 6:22 PM
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    RAS
    he has quite possibly also emptied all the bank accounts your grandmother had as well. Does mum know where she had accounts? Does mother have certified copies of the death certificate?
    Last edited by RAS; 05-03-2013 at 6:28 PM.
    The person who has not made a mistake, has made nothing
    • getmore4less
    • By getmore4less 5th Mar 13, 6:48 PM
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    getmore4less
    the process is the same for probate and letters of administration.

    PA1 and IHT205/IHT400

    The solicitor should have covered this if there is one involved.

    It would need both to sign this off, but he may have instructed solicitors they may be able to go ahead without both signing.

    IT may be wise to put in a caviat ASAP.
  • posttokev
    This has been ongoing for around 12 months. My mother has put in a caveat, although her solicitor said this was unnecessary. (She isn't happy with the solicitor and has already made a complaint about him. I'm hoping she'll seek a new solicitor.)
    • getmore4less
    • By getmore4less 5th Mar 13, 7:25 PM
    • 37,185 Posts
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    getmore4less
    This has been ongoing for around 12 months. My mother has put in a caveat, although her solicitor said this was unnecessary. (She isn't happy with the solicitor and has already made a complaint about him. I'm hoping she'll seek a new solicitor.)
    Originally posted by posttokev
    First post said jan 2013, might need an edit if you meant 2012
  • posttokev
    Well spotted. Cheers!
  • madbadrob
    The rules of intestacy are quite clear and it sounds to me like there is more to this than is at hand here. Firstly your mother will need to obtain the letters of administration (if these have not been obtained already). Then you need to get the deeds to the house because as yet you haven't said whose name is on the deeds. It is possible that your grandfather owned it outright and if he left a will he could have gave your grandmother a life share in the house but left it to your uncle. I am surprised your mothers solicitor hasnt already advised you of this. If this has been going on for 12 months I am thinking that the estate value is being diminshed week by week due to these solicitors acting for both parties. Why does your uncle assume he has the right to the whole of the property anyway?

    Rob
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