Electric cars
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Disagree. My point being, comparing old ICE against new electric cars is unfair. You have to compare against the same age/mileage of car.I wouldn't touch a 'brand new' petrol or diesel, so the comparison with the Clio is kind of pointless
You can't compare a 20 yr old ICE against a 20 yr old EV, because the latter doesn't exist. That doesn't mean you just compare the 20 yr old ICE against a new EV and claim EV is expensive, that's an unfair comparison.
Buying a new car, EV or ICE, vs keeping your own car, would buy a LOT of petrol or diesel. Buying a new car rarely saves money!"Some electronics" = "AC/DC converter"!
No. Your home charger/destination charger gives out AC. The AC/DC converter is inside the car.0 -
Disagree. My point being, comparing old ICE against new electric cars is unfair. You have to compare against the same age/mileage of car.
Yep.
The argument for bangernomics is fine, but since nobody builds new secondhand cars, the comparison is unfair.
So it's new ICE v's new EV, and old ICE v's old EV.
If the stories/evidence is true, then older EV's might be a safer purchase than an ICE which is just about ready to 'die'.Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)
For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.0 -
Interesting. How does it compare financially to say an equivalent 'efficient' petrol or diesel?
Obviously the initial outlay for an EV is still quite high at the moment. Would you say you are starting to notice the savings or are you still approaching breaking even?
My Car does 5 Miles Per KWh at home I pay 5p Kwh on Eco 7 so 1p Mile
Polar Plus Costs 10p Kwh so 2p Mile.
Ecotricity is 30p Kwh but so often their chargers are stuck on free vend my average works out about 5p Kwh so about 1p mile.
So about 90% Cheaper on Home Electricity than Petrol Diesel and about 80% Cheaper on Polar.
I used to do over £350 a month every month on Diesel am now averaging about £35 a month on electric.
As for costs this time I bought a Renault Zoe, they cost between £16k and £20k depending on spec with an owned battery (£5k less if you lease the battery rather than owning it)
The similar spec Renault Clio on which it is based is about £1k cheaper as a diesel so not much difference
I expect to run mine for 4 years.. 160k miles. Depreciating it to Zero at about £5k per year, at that point it will either be scrapped and the battery kept and used for home enerby storage or the car sold on it still viable. Time will tell but it will be one of those options, that battery is expected to deteriorate to between 90% and 80% usable capacity over that mileage. So a loss of between 20 and 40 miles on its initial 200 mile range
My last EV a BMW i3 I bought it as an ExDemo from BMW with 500 Miles on it sold it 14 months later with 48k miles on it for a £3500 loss on what I paid for it. so very happy at that over 48k miles (Depreciation on a 3 Series Diesel would have been more)
For me with the fuel savings and congestion charge savings and free parking in Westminster its a no brainer.. I really believe currently they are viable for anyone who does 25k a year plus and especially if you are in central london a lot.Over 100k miles of Electric Motoring and rising,0 -
Martyn1981 wrote: »Yep.
The argument for bangernomics is fine, but since nobody builds new secondhand cars, the comparison is unfair.
So it's new ICE v's new EV, and old ICE v's old EV.
If the stories/evidence is true, then older EV's might be a safer purchase than an ICE which is just about ready to 'die'.
Right, but for many people, the idea of buying a new EV can be off putting when a very good second hand car can be purchased. That is my point. I just wanted a comparison.
Fair to say, from a new car perspective, EV all the way.
What do you get range wise?0 -
HiRight, but for many people, the idea of buying a new EV can be off putting when a very good second hand car can be purchased. That is my point. I just wanted a comparison.
Fair to say, from a new car perspective, EV all the way.
What do you get range wise?
I don't really follow your point ....Currently Aut0trader is showing somewhere around 7500 electric & hybrid used vehicles for sale of which >750 are full electric & >1400 plug-in hybrids so there's plenty on the 'second-hand' market as long as there's not an immediate rush ....
HTH
Z"We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
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We bought ours second hand, though admittedly only 6 months old. However there seem to be plenty of 3-4 year old cars for sensible prices (maybe a bit more than the equivalent ICE but not much). If I wanted a car for the typical 'lots of short journeys' that many people have I would leap on one of these, it would save money in no time at all.0
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We bought ours second hand, though admittedly only 6 months old. However there seem to be plenty of 3-4 year old cars for sensible prices (maybe a bit more than the equivalent ICE but not much). If I wanted a car for the typical 'lots of short journeys' that many people have I would leap on one of these, it would save money in no time at all.
I'll have a look at those second hand ones.
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We bought ours second hand, though admittedly only 6 months old. However there seem to be plenty of 3-4 year old cars for sensible prices (maybe a bit more than the equivalent ICE but not much). If I wanted a car for the typical 'lots of short journeys' that many people have I would leap on one of these, it would save money in no time at all.
I'd need a car with a range to take two or three of my football team to the other side of the county and back! I can't imagine saying "sorry girls, we're going to have to stop at the services on the way back to recharge"!
Prices aren't too bad but to that I'm going to have to add the cost of a dropped kerb (+council permissions), knocking down my front garden wall and paving the area. I'm pretty handy with a lump hammer, but the rest is a bought in job.
As Stageshoot has pointed out, it's often the high users who can justify the current capital costs. I'm going to wait a bit as my car is only 9 years old and there's still plenty of life in it. But certainly I'd hope my next one to be pure EV.0 -
Depends on the size of your county! I often take our children to events 35-40 miles away and don't need to recharge before getting home. When we go further and do need a recharge at some point, we just factor it in to the journey time (adds 20 mins or so) - or just recharge while they are doing whatever they are doing.
Having said that, once EVs have an effective range of, say, 200 miles, that means that nearly all journeys are eminently doable without having to stop and recharge.0 -
What range are we looking at then? 100 miles? I suspect for most people, that'd be enough. The 200 mile barrier with fast charging will make a big difference.0
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