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Buying a house without a party wall agreement

Advice needed! I'm buying a house,semi detached, in the sellers pack they disclosed that the neighbouring property attached a garage to the garage wall of the property im buying without consent or agreement. This happened over 20 years ago and now the adjoining property has a legal right to easement. We want to potentially extend the garage and property. The vendors have stated they won't produce an official deed for us as the neighbours have legal rights, they will just supply indemnity insurance. Can this issue cause us problems when wanting to change / extend the house we are buying?
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  • anselld
    anselld Posts: 8,262
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    Any new application for change/ extension will start fresh on the basis of what is there now. What happened 20 years ago cannot be undone so it is irrelevant to what you are trying to change in future.

    Indemnity Insurance would be pointless. What risk is being indemnified?
  • G_M
    G_M Posts: 51,977
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    edited 28 July 2016 at 9:07PM
    A Party Wall Agreement is a specific document required by the Party Wall Act which should be drawn up prior to works on a Party Wall. It is not however legally required, and there is no come-back if it is ignored.

    The only option open to a neighbour if a PWA is not created before work begins is to obtain a court order forcing the neighbour to stop work.

    Once work is complete the Act is redundant.

    The garage that the neighbours built is now a fait acomplis. The vendors could have taken action 20 years ago, but not now.

    similarly, if the garage was built without Planning Permission, or Building Regs (if either were required), after 20 years it is too late for the council to take action.

    That just leaves your plan to extend. You would need

    * Planning Permission (unless it fell within the definition of 'Permitted Development'

    * Building Regulations certification

    * a Party Wall Agreemet, if you were building on (or nearly on) the property boundary (or the neighbour could get an order for your work to stop)

    https://www.gov.uk/topic/housing/party-walls

    https://www.planningportal.co.uk/info/200187/your_responsibilities/37/planning_permission/2

    http://planningguidance.communities.gov.uk/blog/guidance/ensuring-effective-enforcement/planning-enforcement-overview/
  • Gemsi110
    Gemsi110 Posts: 13 Forumite
    anselld wrote: »
    Any new application for change/ extension will start fresh on the basis of what is there now. What happened 20 years ago cannot be undone so it is irrelevant to what you are trying to change in future.

    Indemnity Insurance would be pointless. What risk is being indemnified?


    This is what the sellers solicitors are offering. We would prefer a deed if we want to extend about the garage we would need permission to unattach her garage roof from our wall now the party wall and then reattach. We wanted this is writing that we can do that.
  • Gemsi110
    Gemsi110 Posts: 13 Forumite
    G_M wrote: »
    A Party Wall Agreement is a specific document required by the Party Wall Act which should be drawn up prior to works on a Party Wall. It is not however legally required, and there is no come-back if it is ignored.

    The only option open to a neighbour if a PWA is not created before work begins is to obtain a court order forcing the neighbour to stop work.

    Once work is complete the Act is redundant.

    The garage that the neighbours built is now a fait acomplis. The vendors could have taken action 20 years ago, but not now.

    similarly, if the garage was built without Planning Permission, or Building Regs (if either were required), after 20 years it is too late for the council to take action.

    That just leaves your plan to extend. You would need

    * Planning Permission (unless it fell within the definition of 'Permitted Development'

    * Building Regulations certification

    * a Party Wall Agreemet, if you were building on (or nearly on) the property boundary (or the neighbour could get an order for your work to stop

    Can a party wall stop you from converting the garage or extending of the neighbour complains?
  • AnotherJoe
    AnotherJoe Posts: 19,622
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    Gemsi110 wrote: »
    This is what the sellers solicitors are offering. We would prefer a deed if we want to extend about the garage we would need permission to unattach her garage roof from our wall now the party wall and then reattach. We wanted this is writing that we can do that.

    That isn't in the gift of your vendors to offer, it's not their garage you are discussing ! Unless you can get a signed agreement made up with the neighbours (for which they would I imagine want paying) before exchanging contracts, I suggest you look at buying a different house.
  • Gemsi110
    Gemsi110 Posts: 13 Forumite
    AnotherJoe wrote: »
    That isn't in the gift of your vendors to offer, it's not their garage you are discussing ! Unless you can get a signed agreement made up with the neighbours (for which they would I imagine want paying) before exchanging contracts, I suggest you look at buying a different house.

    It is there garage. The property next door attached there garage roof to our wall
  • teneighty
    teneighty Posts: 1,347 Forumite
    I think you are worrying about this unnecessarily.

    I assume you own the wall in question and it is built on your side of the boundary. It has however become a party wall by enclosure by virtue of the fact that the neighbour has built a new garage using the existing wall as one side of the building.

    You can still do whatever you like with your wall, the only complication is that you have to go through the formal "consultation" process with the neighbour. In theory you could demolish the wall if you wanted and the neighbour could not stop you provided you erected the necessary alternative support and weather protection to their garage.
  • Gemsi110
    Gemsi110 Posts: 13 Forumite
    teneighty wrote: »
    I think you are worrying about this unnecessarily.

    I assume you own the wall in question and it is built on your side of the boundary. It has however become a party wall by enclosure by virtue of the fact that the neighbour has built a new garage using the existing wall as one side of the building.

    You can still do whatever you like with your wall, the only complication is that you have to go through the formal "consultation" process with the neighbour. In theory you could demolish the wall if you wanted and the neighbour could not stop you provided you erected the necessary alternative support and weather protection to their garage.

    The vendor believes the wall is on his side but we think it looks like it's on the boundary
  • teneighty
    teneighty Posts: 1,347 Forumite
    If the wall was built astride the boundary then it has always been a party wall and the neighbour was perfectly entitled to use in for their garage.

    The fact remains that as a party wall you and your neighbour have rights to make changes to the wall, raise it, lower it, build things up against it etc. You just have to go through the process of serving notice on the neighbour and make sure the adjoining owner are not unduly affected by the changes.
  • G_M
    G_M Posts: 51,977
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    I too am confused as to what 'indemnity' the sellers are offering? In what circumstances would this insurance pay out, and to cover what risk?

    A deed drawn up with the seller will not bind the neighbours in any way. It will not stop them objecting to any work you later propose. Only a Deed with the neighbours could do that.

    If you read the links I gave to you'll find that both owners of a party wall have rights, and obligations. Read upon the rights you would have.

    If you applied for Planning Permission to extend, the neighbour could, like anyne else, enter an objection which the council Planners would consider when deciding whether or not to grant planning consent.
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