Guide discussion: Should I repay my post-2012 student loan?

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  • BoxerRules wrote: »
    I am not currently a student ( I graduated more than forty years ago) and I applaud Martin for his efforts to put this issue into perspective. It would be a great step forward officially to remove the concept of 'debt', with all its bad connotations of millstones round necks, ultimate personal bankruptcy and even the Marshalsea. If you must think in terms of debt, then try comparing it to the so-called ' Third World ', where countries borrowed money they struggled to pay back and were eventually in such dire straits that the lenders were forced to cancel the debt completely. With student finance you may feel you struggle to pay it back, but unlike ordinary debts like mortgages, car loans and the like, there is no life-long millstone and the system has a built-in guarantee that any liability to repay the sum outstanding disappears after thirty years. Wouldn't developing countries have loved a loan like that. What today's graduates have is a Personal Payment Plan and while Martin's description of a 'graduate contribution tax' is a bit clunky, it's accurate and is the best one available. I certainly haven't yet thought of a snappier title.
    Is it a good deal? Well, try applying the system to a house mortgage instead of a student loan. If you think you might currently be able to afford a £150,000 house, wouldn't you like to be able to go to the government , who would give you the money to buy the house and then say you need only repay a small percentage of what you earn above a low benchmark? What we'll do is add interest onto the sum outstanding, but after thirty years, whatever the total, it will be written off and you'll still own the house? An even better deal, you apply for a house costing £450,000 ( because it's just up the road and has a dedicated parking space) and the government still give you the money, still only want the same repayment as for the cheaper house and still write off the much-larger accumulated sum outstanding after thirty years!
    You can call such a mortgage comparison absurd, but that just illustrates why the Graduate Contribution Tax is different to a normal debt.
    The universities obviously understood the reality of the system, which is why they all queued up to charge the maximum amount for course tuition. They get the maximum money from the government up-front and leave the government to worry about reclaiming graduate contributions.
    I went to university 1968-73, when course fees were paid directly by government and I received a maintenance grant. No repayments required. However, the reasoning was that graduates were probably going to have a much-better paid career than if they didn't go to university, so over a working life of forty years the Treasury would get back much more in tax than it would otherwise and the investment was worthwhile. Importantly, however true this was, no-one could quantify it.
    Was I better off than today's students? It seems to me that in important respects the modern system is the same as that of yore. Course fees are still paid by the government and the student still receives money for maintenance. The difference concerns the attempts to quantify the students' contribution to defraying those costs over a working life. In my day it couldn't be done, so no worries were generated. Now an individual sum can be attached to each graduate and you can track how much he or she is contributing each year back into the nation's coffers. This insistence on information, transparency, call it what you will, generates the anxiety. So yes, I probably was better off, but only because I was more positive about graduating because no-one bothered to keep telling me how much I owed the state.
    One final thought . As to the politics, Mr Corbyn and the Labour Party should be supporting this system for its pure Marxist credentials. If I may re-order Karl's phraseology from 'The Critique of the Gotha', the student loan system fits exactly " to each according to his needs, from each according to his ability ( to pay-my italics)
    The write off after 30 years is not guaranteed. My worry is that our house, that will eventually be left to our four children, who each have a debt of £50,000 will be used to pay off their debt, or seized by a debt collector. Which leads me to another point ...how is inherited income to be treated. Also two of my kids took post graduate degrees and will eventually be paying 35% of their income over £21000 in taxes (income tax and student tax)
    And if they do eventually earn over £45000 they will be paying 55% and over £150000 60% tax.
  • Ed-1
    Ed-1 Posts: 3,886 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    The write off after 30 years is not guaranteed. My worry is that our house, that will eventually be left to our four children, who each have a debt of £50,000 will be used to pay off their debt, or seized by a debt collector. Which leads me to another point ...how is inherited income to be treated. Also two of my kids took post graduate degrees and will eventually be paying 35% of their income over £21000 in taxes (income tax and student tax)
    And if they do eventually earn over £45000 they will be paying 55% and over £150000 60% tax.

    It's unlikely to change for existing post-2012 loans as it's set down in law in the loan repayment regulations.

    As for repayments, from April 2018 post-2012 undergraduate loans are repaid at 9% above £25,000 (a threshold which will rise with earnings growth thereafter). Postgraduate loans are repaid at 6% above £21,000 (a threshold that will be reviewed by 2021).
  • I have just e-mailed Sam Gyimah to suggest that the annual statement from the SLC should contain a calculation to show if the loanee continues to pay off at the rate of the last 12 months whether they will or will not pay off their loan before the 30 years.

    Taking into account existing interest rates then the date of repayment will either mean - they repay the full amount or part will be wiped off.

    If it to be wiped there is no advantage to paying it off but if it will be paid off them additional payments will reduce the interest charge. It could then be a case of taking out a 4% loan to repay the 6% interest SLC!

    But from the above it is clear there is confusion from so many. So a final paragraph on the SLC statement will help.

    Will Martin join in pushing for this request to be actioned by the SLC?
  • I have a very small student loan around £600 due to my course being pulled 5 weeks in. I've only just started to repay it as I had a one off bonus which must have put my wage over the threshold, would I be better just paying it all off before the interest piles up or should I get in contact with the student loans company and stop the repayments as my salary is actually under the threshold and carry on ignoring it until I have to start repaying if I ever earn enough to need to?
  • LizzeyK
    LizzeyK Posts: 2 Newbie
    Hi all. Just reading the guide. I thought repayment difference for tuition fee loans (repayable on earnings of £25,0000) & maintenance loans (repayable on £21,000). Is that right? If so, guideneeds to make clearer
  • koru
    koru Posts: 1,501 Forumite
    Name Dropper Combo Breaker First Post First Anniversary
    LizzeyK wrote: »
    Hi all. Just reading the guide. I thought repayment difference for tuition fee loans (repayable on earnings of £25,0000) & maintenance loans (repayable on £21,000). Is that right? If so, guideneeds to make clearer
    I have never seen any suggestion that the threshold for maintenance loans is lower. Do you have a source you can quote?
    koru
  • UCL e-mailed my Sixth Form student son in advance of a UCL open day to tell him about student finance & quoted these repayment thresholds. I have contacted UCL and they have confirmed that this was an error (phew) & the repayment threshold is £25,000 for ALL types of loan. Quite staggered UCL could have made such a mistake. They have promised to correct in all future correspondence, so thankfully panic over. Money Saving Expert Guide 1, UCL nil
  • Fascinating articles and especially unwinding the confusion and the political games played over many years, for which many thanks.

    I have one son at university and hope my daughter subject to A level grades will start this October. Both upon seeing the figure of 6.1% have been shocked (accepting this applies across their study period initially before the working career earnings related calculation kicks in) which shows that they have at least learned something I think!.

    Both hold considerable value in personal savings plans plus ISAs, LISAs and SIPPs established by my wife and myself for them since birth. Because of parent's earnings levels they will only get the lower maintenance grant and we already meet accommodation costs directly in helping finance.

    Which given none of us (children or parents) has any trust in there being no material government changes in policy or collection for the next 30 years (the onset of BREXIT only adding to that confusion), I suspect we will end up with a strategy of each child now funding their own maintenance; parents funding accommodation (as currently); and, each child only drawing tuition fee loans with an intention to consider repayment after graduation subject to how matters then stand overall.

    This may go against the general thrust of the guidance given in the article but with "surplus cash" (a relative term it is accepted) and obtaining certainty being the key determinants for us at least.

    P.S. Wonder if in the face of an onslaught of IHT for more estates in recent years (largely driven by property values) how long it will be before gifts to help relatives pay off university loans becomes an exempt transfer on death?!
  • EAB2
    EAB2 Posts: 166 Forumite
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker First Post
    Sorry, I expect this has already been asked, but I'm so confused.

    According to Martin's guide, the amount you repay is unaffected by the amount you borrow. So someone with a £10k loan pays the same as someone that borrowed £100k.

    https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/students/repay-post-2012-student-loan/

    If you went to uni for a year and decided it wasn't for you, you'd have a loan of around £10,000.

    In my head, it doesn't make sense to pay the same for that loan as someone who stayed for 4 years and borrowed close to £50,000. What am I missing?
  • Ed-1
    Ed-1 Posts: 3,886 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    EABowden wrote: »
    Sorry, I expect this has already been asked, but I'm so confused.

    According to Martin's guide, the amount you repay is unaffected by the amount you borrow. So someone with a £10k loan pays the same as someone that borrowed £100k.

    https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/students/repay-post-2012-student-loan/

    If you went to uni for a year and decided it wasn't for you, you'd have a loan of around £10,000.

    In my head, it doesn't make sense to pay the same for that loan as someone who stayed for 4 years and borrowed close to £50,000. What am I missing?

    You're not missing anything. It's a 9% contribution based on earnings, not a full loan repayment regardless.
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