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  • FIRST POST
    • domdeath
    • By domdeath 20th Oct 19, 9:08 AM
    • 21Posts
    • 1Thanks
    domdeath
    Discovered fault on newly bought car
    • #1
    • 20th Oct 19, 9:08 AM
    Discovered fault on newly bought car 20th Oct 19 at 9:08 AM
    *Cross Post from motoring*

    I bought a second hand car from a second hand dealership about 28 days ago and I discovered a problem with it yesterday.

    I hadn't trusted the garage had done an oil change so decided I'd do one myself however when I removed the undertray of the car, I noticed oil everywhere (but crucially it had only leaked onto the undertray and isn't visible from an external inspection of the car, like you woudk do when buying a second hand car). I narrowed this down to a leaking sump gasket and it looks like the sump has been hit (it has a dent in it). I realise this is a relatively simple fix for a garage (well the dealership) but I am concerned the damage may go further and I can't tell because its hidden by the oil.

    As I am within my 30 days I believe it is within my consumer rights to demand a full refund however I know the garage will of course dispute this and probably try and say I am the one who has damaged the car. I know the onus is on the supplier to prove it wasn't damaged when I bought it but I have a feeling they will use excuses like it passed its mot (but the oil isn't visible from the outside). What is acceptable by way of proof it wasn't leaking when they sold it?

    I suspect if I want my money back I will end up having to go to court for it which is a lot of faff but then again, if the damage does go further, it could be very expensive and a lot of effort for me further down the line.

    I also bought the car across 2 credit cards so could claim back from either of those if necessary...

    What does everyone recommend as a way forward? Do I go back and demand a refund and persue all avenues possible or do I accept an offer of a repair? I realise I am close to the 30 day deadline so unfortunately need to decide today so I can contact them tomorrow!

    Thanks in advance!
Page 1
    • mattyprice4004
    • By mattyprice4004 20th Oct 19, 9:09 AM
    • 4,244 Posts
    • 3,912 Thanks
    mattyprice4004
    • #2
    • 20th Oct 19, 9:09 AM
    • #2
    • 20th Oct 19, 9:09 AM
    I don’t see what’s wrong with a repair - just ask them to replace the gasket and go from there.
    • domdeath
    • By domdeath 20th Oct 19, 9:53 AM
    • 21 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    domdeath
    • #3
    • 20th Oct 19, 9:53 AM
    • #3
    • 20th Oct 19, 9:53 AM
    My concern is there is more damage other than just the sump and even if the sump is then repaired, it could still continue to be costly in the future.

    I'm also a bit pressured that my 30 days is rapidly ticking down and once that has gone I would lose the right to claim a refund. However, I think it is because I'm so time pressured it's my cautious side making the decision whereas realistically it is unlikely there will be anything else wrong so I appreciate the advice!
    • Inner Zone
    • By Inner Zone 20th Oct 19, 10:01 AM
    • 2,669 Posts
    • 1,605 Thanks
    Inner Zone
    • #4
    • 20th Oct 19, 10:01 AM
    • #4
    • 20th Oct 19, 10:01 AM
    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=6060795
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 20th Oct 19, 10:52 AM
    • 11,304 Posts
    • 12,905 Thanks
    shaun from Africa
    • #5
    • 20th Oct 19, 10:52 AM
    • #5
    • 20th Oct 19, 10:52 AM
    As I am within my 30 days I believe it is within my consumer rights to demand a full refund however I know the garage will of course dispute this and probably try and say I am the one who has damaged the car. I know the onus is on the supplier to prove it wasn't damaged when I bought it but I have a feeling they will use excuses like it passed its mot (but the oil isn't visible from the outside). What is acceptable by way of proof it wasn't leaking when they sold it?
    Originally posted by domdeath
    The bit in bold is incorrect.
    Generally any fault discovered within the first 6 months is deemed to have been present at the time of sale but the only time this doesn't apply is when rejecting within the first 30 days.

    As you want a refund under your 30 day short term right of rejection then the onus is on you to prove that the fault existed at the time of sale.
    If however, you opt for a repair then it is assumed that any fault was present at the time of sale and it's up to the dealer to prove otherwise.
    • born again
    • By born again 20th Oct 19, 4:01 PM
    • 615 Posts
    • 319 Thanks
    born again
    • #6
    • 20th Oct 19, 4:01 PM
    • #6
    • 20th Oct 19, 4:01 PM
    Well if the damage was done by the sump hitting anything. Then the undertray would be damaged as well.
    So that would make it hard for the dealer to argue you did it.
    • domdeath
    • By domdeath 20th Oct 19, 5:06 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    domdeath
    • #7
    • 20th Oct 19, 5:06 PM
    • #7
    • 20th Oct 19, 5:06 PM
    Born again, that was my thoughts and I can't see damage to the undertray. My thoughts is the sump could have been damaged from someone jacking the car in the wrong place?

    Shaun, thank you for that information, I will try and investigate the wording of the rights further!
    • domdeath
    • By domdeath 20th Oct 19, 5:12 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    domdeath
    • #8
    • 20th Oct 19, 5:12 PM
    • #8
    • 20th Oct 19, 5:12 PM
    Born again, I have just rechecked the undertray and there is no sign of damage to it at all. Not even any scrape marks and as it's made of plastic it should show pretty easily. This should help with my case that it wasnt me that did the damage.
    • bris
    • By bris 20th Oct 19, 5:35 PM
    • 8,882 Posts
    • 7,780 Thanks
    bris
    • #9
    • 20th Oct 19, 5:35 PM
    • #9
    • 20th Oct 19, 5:35 PM
    How do you know it's not just over spill or old oil that's been in there for years. You say you found oil but are you sure it's actually leaking?


    Any way it goes they have the right to inspect it before any decisions are made.
    • domdeath
    • By domdeath 20th Oct 19, 6:18 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    domdeath
    Bris, I think if they had spilt oil when filling there would be signs of oil from above. The oil in parts had part formed drips, indicating it is being generated somewhere, rather than just being old oil so I am fairly certain it is leaking.

    I have just drafted my initial letter to the company and I have suggested the next step is to get an independent assessment of the cause of the leak. I think then I will be in a position to say whether I am happy for it to be repaired or whether I want a refund.

    Does anyone know where I stand if during the period of getting an independent assessment the 30 day timescale elapses? As I have identified the issue and am offering the car back within the 30 days, I would assume I am OK here or do I have to make the final call within the 30 day window?
    • mattyprice4004
    • By mattyprice4004 20th Oct 19, 6:30 PM
    • 4,244 Posts
    • 3,912 Thanks
    mattyprice4004
    They have a right to inspect, it doesn’t need to be independent.
    • domdeath
    • By domdeath 21st Oct 19, 3:46 PM
    • 21 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    domdeath
    So, an update on the issue.

    I contacted the garage today and they said as the car is in their 3 month warranty they give they will repair it under that.

    I am concerned that if I accept for it to be repaired under warranty, I am then at risk that if they discover the fault is a major issue (like a shaft seal or something) then I have already committed to a repair under warranty and lose the right to a refund under consumer rights? Am I right to be concerned or would I still be within my right to request a refund if the fault is major?
    • mattyprice4004
    • By mattyprice4004 21st Oct 19, 5:12 PM
    • 4,244 Posts
    • 3,912 Thanks
    mattyprice4004
    Why not just let them try and fix it, and worry about the what ifs if the car comes back with an issue?

    With all due respect you’re starting to sound like a nightmare customer that wouldn’t be happy with the world on a stick.

    Let them try and fix it, and see what happens next without stressing.
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