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    • Nebulous2
    • By Nebulous2 13th Jul 19, 7:37 AM
    • 2,499 Posts
    • 1,652 Thanks
    Nebulous2
    • #2
    • 13th Jul 19, 7:37 AM
    • #2
    • 13th Jul 19, 7:37 AM
    Eh? The whole point of stoozing is to make use of the cash to your advantage, not to spend it. If there is an issue with your level of borrowing you simply pay it back.


    I've posted my experience with mortgages before. I stoozed over 30k, mainly for my own entertainment, not expecting to need to borrow anything. Then I decided to buy a second home - partly financed by mortgaging my primary home. I spoke to Nationwide they told me I needed to take my credit card debt down to under 10k. I did that and the mortgage sailed through.
    • bsms1147
    • By bsms1147 13th Jul 19, 7:39 AM
    • 2,054 Posts
    • 3,660 Thanks
    bsms1147
    • #3
    • 13th Jul 19, 7:39 AM
    • #3
    • 13th Jul 19, 7:39 AM
    Simple answer is don't stooze to such high amounts if you're planning on taking out large credit products, like a mortgage, for the exact reason you describe.
    • pinknsparkly
    • By pinknsparkly 13th Jul 19, 7:49 AM
    • 448 Posts
    • 976 Thanks
    pinknsparkly
    • #4
    • 13th Jul 19, 7:49 AM
    • #4
    • 13th Jul 19, 7:49 AM
    My husband and I are currently stoozing with 4.5 years left to run on a 5 year fixed rate mortgage. I will avoid making credit card applications in the months prior to the mortgage application and pay down the credit cards to a level that is acceptable to mortgage providers. Yes, it may well cause problems if you've made a number of card applications just before applying for the mortgage but otherwise it shouldn't cause you problems!
    MFW 2019 challenge #99: 8174 / 6,000 (4671 is in "offset" pot)
    MFiT-T5 (Jan 2019 - Jan 2022) challenge #99: 7483 / 30,000
    Save 12k in 2019 challenge #99: 21,357 / 12,000
    2019 keep moving challenge: 469 / 1000 miles
    Last updated: 10/10/2019
    Initial MF date (18th Dec 2018): Jan 2054 Current MF date: Jun 2052
    • jeepjunkie
    • By jeepjunkie 13th Jul 19, 8:01 AM
    • 1,678 Posts
    • 1,478 Thanks
    jeepjunkie
    • #5
    • 13th Jul 19, 8:01 AM
    • #5
    • 13th Jul 19, 8:01 AM
    Stoozing is a hobby you can do if not in debt, applying for mortgage though in saying that I have moved twice whilst stoozing... etc. I've also never given a crap about credit scores or CRAs that so many on this site seem obsessed with so just light the afterburners For a while I was at 30k-40k purely fast stoozing, not interested in slow stoozing. The trouble is BT deals are thin ground now plus not many places to put the money for a worthwhile return. Lean times have happened before so have closed up shop in the hope of new customer deals when the "market" picks up
  • archived user
    • #6
    • 13th Jul 19, 8:45 AM
    • #6
    • 13th Jul 19, 8:45 AM
    I can only conclude people stoozing 10k+ must be on a Mich higher income than me? (Mine is low but full time) - I was stoozing 1200 on one card (nearly full limit) and had a cash back card with approx same limit for everyday groceries, I was 70-80% utilised, my "score" dropped like a rock till I cleared it, I tried to take a third card out after that and I thought that utilisation would be better if the old card was left unused but I was declined which I took as an indication that I was overstretching what my income would allow me to borrow

    I am concerned about mortgage affordability (although that would've improved 5 years in), and I'm concerned about being judged to have too much available credit for my income, so I don't have an overdraft facility

    Stoozing can steer you towards longer mortgage fixes, which is fine if you want that certainty at the extra price but if you're looking at cheaper 2 year fixes it wouldn't be as viable

    I thought to myself that on a lowish income that maybe the way I can borrow most of all (and focus on pension instead) is to repay mortgage slowly rather than use cards since cards even on minimum payment still are clearing debt much faster than an early stage mortgage (1% a month vs 3% a year)
    • molerat
    • By molerat 13th Jul 19, 9:50 AM
    • 21,526 Posts
    • 15,780 Thanks
    molerat
    • #7
    • 13th Jul 19, 9:50 AM
    • #7
    • 13th Jul 19, 9:50 AM
    I can only conclude people stoozing 10k+ must be on a Mich higher income than me?
    Originally posted by MatthewAinsworth
    Not necessarily. I am on a "low" pension income and was stoozing well in excess of 10K at the peak, in fact just under double my income. Only a 2700 leftover now due to the lack of opportunity of both offers and where to put it.
    https://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/give-support/donate-now/
  • archived user
    • #8
    • 13th Jul 19, 10:49 AM
    • #8
    • 13th Jul 19, 10:49 AM
    Molerat - how did you achieve that? What am I doing wrong? Thanks in advance (I could've made more attempts applying, but my "credit score" (for what that's worth) improved up to a point, into the 'good' range and never increased after that, and the only bad thing I have is a stooze a couple of years ago, thus I'm nervous of a longer lasting impact than people believe. I also got declined on a current account once, although that could've been that when you upload photo ID and statements it was a tiny bit blurry due to cheapo phone)

    I mean I have 1 or 2 preapproved offers from clear score but the two times I've applied for a 95% chance of a good product it was either declined or offered a rubbish alternative - I suppose that's possible

    FYI whilst I was stoozing before, now its more about sparing an investment from sale to pay for a future wedding, or dipping into emergency funds
  • archived user
    • #9
    • 13th Jul 19, 10:56 AM
    • #9
    • 13th Jul 19, 10:56 AM
    Come to think of it, are you mortgage free, molerat? Since that would certainly help you stooze more
    • Ben8282
    • By Ben8282 13th Jul 19, 9:10 PM
    • 3,923 Posts
    • 2,145 Thanks
    Ben8282
    For an individual who has been using credit cards for decades, especially those who had established credit profiles during the credit card proliferation of the 1990's, having sufficient available credit to stooze 40,000+ is probably not uncommon.
    The problem however is with how to actually make a profit. Existing customer offers, at least for me, are not good. The typical offer at the moment appears to be 12 months with 3% fee. Fine I guess if I had a sudden unexpected large expense that I wanted to repay over time, but useless for stoozing purposes.
    That means that stoozing really requires new applications to be made (0% purchases preferably or 0% no-fee balance transfers perhaps when a no-fee 4.9% money transfer offer is available which can be repaid almost immediately from the balance transfer card).
    This of course limits stoozing possibilities to whatever credit limits are given on the new cards. As to whether or not you consider the current interest rates make stoozing worth bothering with, that is very much a matter of personal opinion.
    Last edited by Ben8282; 13-07-2019 at 9:13 PM.
    • jeepjunkie
    • By jeepjunkie 14th Jul 19, 8:18 AM
    • 1,678 Posts
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    jeepjunkie
    Talking about stoozing returns. When I had 30k-40k “under management “, lol, the money was in multiple 5% current accounts which then fed regular savers. All interest/Cashback/ bonuses was paid into the wife’s SIPP pension which of course got a further uplift with tax relief being credited and thanks to all the Brexit malarkey significant growth. That was my version of snowballing. Sadly it’s not on the scale it was in the past.
  • archived user
    For those looking to make a return I think its OK to invest it in something like VLS20 as long as you don't rely upon selling that to pay it back or can stomach a small unlikely loss if you were to sell it, in other words, accelerating investment you would've done anyway, much like prioritising that over clearing a mortgage.

    From what I can tell your affordability goes further with mortgages than it does with cards, would people agree? I've read that debt to income ratio only considers minimum payments but even a CC's minimum payment is a higher % than that of a (early stage) mortgage - and that what you do stooze has about 7x effect on how much you can borrow
    • adindas
    • By adindas 14th Jul 19, 3:06 PM
    • 4,202 Posts
    • 2,698 Thanks
    adindas
    From what I can tell your affordability goes further with mortgages than it does with cards, would people agree? I've read that debt to income ratio only considers minimum payments but even a CC's minimum payment is a higher % than that of a (early stage) mortgage - and that what you do stooze has about 7x effect on how much you can borrow
    Originally posted by MatthewAinsworth
    It is common sense not to apply for new credit card which will maximise your credit utilisation thorough stoozing if you are about to apply for a major credit such as Mortgage. Nowadays the profit from stoozing is not as it used to be. In many cases today it is probably not worthy the effort anymore.
  • archived user
    Here's an idea - borrow say 30% but put into say VLS80 or 100, that way you get a decent overall return, can pay it back quite easily and don't dent credit utilisation much, if anything building credit history. Because putting a larger amount into low risk exposes you more to fees (both card and investing fees) - thus this is safer than say 100% in VLS 20
    • adindas
    • By adindas 15th Jul 19, 10:12 AM
    • 4,202 Posts
    • 2,698 Thanks
    adindas
    Here's an idea - borrow say 30% but put into say VLS80 or 100, that way you get a decent overall return, can pay it back quite easily and don't dent credit utilisation much, if anything building credit history. Because putting a larger amount into low risk exposes you more to fees (both card and investing fees) - thus this is safer than say 100% in VLS 20
    Originally posted by MatthewAinsworth
    It is a consensus investing should be aimed for a long term, not short term. Doing this you will be riding the boom and boost of the fund performance. The history has proven that investing in funding will outperform saving in the long run sometimes quite significantly.

    The problem with your approach is that, no 0% on BT / Money transfer credit card that will give a you a long-term commitment (Say more than five years). Most of them (If not all) are less than five years.

    What happen if the value of your fund are valued lees than initially invested when you already need to pay back what you owe?

    What happen if the bank suddenly asks you to return all of the money you owe before the end of the deal?

    But this does not suggest it is not a good idea, you just need to accept the risk, anticipate the problem that may emerge and should be able to provide a back up plan when this kind of things happen.

    True stoozing is risk free. For that reason many stoozers put their money in the FSCS easy access saving accounts that could be withdrawn anytime when needed or have a very sound back up plan. Otherwise you will be doing a calculated gambling.
    Last edited by adindas; 15-07-2019 at 10:33 AM.
  • archived user
    Your last paragraph is the key, with a small borrowing it should be more reasonable to pay back without a sale and/or from balance transfers - that way 1 new BT card could theoretically bail out 3. And with a small borrowing, minimum payments eat into it more. I assume that a bank won't ask for it early unless you somehow break a rule. The larger the scale of it the safer it'd have to be assuming that trying to repay it could be a strain.

    It's unsecured, compared to a mortgage, so its trading off one risk against another. Bear in mind a remortgage could be an (undesirable) bailout which would improve affordability again for new cards
    • vacheron
    • By vacheron 15th Jul 19, 10:34 AM
    • 1,047 Posts
    • 1,013 Thanks
    vacheron
    My 0% stooze of 65K is offsetting my mortgage at 3.19% and so is saving me around 2,000 per year.

    As I have a mortgage balance of zero it doesn't make any difference to me how high the interest rate of the mortgage is so I have no need to re-mortgage.

    I believe a credit report is there to be used to your advantage. Some people say you can't put a price on a good credit report, but I have. I trashed mine in order to earn 2K per year and am very happy with my decision.
    The rich buy assets.
    The poor only have expenses.
    The middle class buy liabilities they think are assets.
    Robert T. Kiyosaki
    • Sad_Dad
    • By Sad_Dad 15th Jul 19, 11:17 AM
    • 822 Posts
    • 11,736 Thanks
    Sad_Dad
    My 0% stooze of 65K is offsetting my mortgage at 3.19% and so is saving me around 2,000 per year.
    Originally posted by vacheron
    Nearly identical to myself (are you with YBS?) apart from my outstanding mortgage is slightly higher.

    My 3.19% fixed rate has just ended so I'm now on their SVR.

    Even though I'm fully offset I still want to switch to a cheaper rate of 2.57%. Hopefully I can do this without any credit checks.
  • archived user
    With a 30% utilization stooze you could even get a card to bail itself out via money transfer in perpetuity
    • vacheron
    • By vacheron 15th Jul 19, 11:53 AM
    • 1,047 Posts
    • 1,013 Thanks
    vacheron
    Nearly identical to myself (are you with YBS?) apart from my outstanding mortgage is slightly higher.

    My 3.19% fixed rate has just ended so I'm now on their SVR.

    Even though I'm fully offset I still want to switch to a cheaper rate of 2.57%. Hopefully I can do this without any credit checks.
    Originally posted by Sad_Dad
    I'm with Barclays and fortunately their SVR for me is the 3.19%.

    It's certainly worth looking for better deals, especially if you are looking to dip deeply into the mortgage account in the near future.

    Unfortunately for me, the only better Barclays offset deals (less than 0.8% lower) are 2 and 5 year fixes which come with ridiculous 1800-2000 fees, so I'm happy to sit tight where I am and keep my head under their radar!
    The rich buy assets.
    The poor only have expenses.
    The middle class buy liabilities they think are assets.
    Robert T. Kiyosaki
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