CCA and SARs requests

Hi Confused Debtors.
I have been managing a number of historic debts from 2004 onwards via a DMC and making regular payments. I know I should have taken out an IVA but that is another story!. I am now because of my age (72) and health (heart) currently looking into these debts which it appears have been sold on a number of times (2-3) by the original Banks. During the Summer I requested a SARS and was more than shocked to find that some of the information contained was inaccurate wrongly allocated, information lost and then found and apology given etc.. Somewhat astonished by these findings I recently requested a CCA. One company (Cabot) replied within the 12 days saying they do not have this information on file and have requested the relevant details from the original lender. However the second company (PRA) returned my £1 P.O saying that "current accounts do not require a credit agreement and such accounts are not included in the CCA act 1974. Can this advice be correct??... I have already reported the mismanagement of my personal and financial accounts to the CSA code of practice who dismissed this failure to keep accurate personal accounts as just "human error".
I would appreciate any help or advice you may be able to offer in this matter as I am sure many others are currently going through similar difficulties experiencing poor and often inaccurate administration form companies who buy and sell debt ( as if it is (like tins of beans or toilet rolls!!) without thinking of the effects their lack of accountability might be having on struggling debtors.

Walterman:(
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  • sourcrates
    sourcrates Posts: 28,717
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    Moved from diaries to DFW.
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  • sourcrates
    sourcrates Posts: 28,717
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    Hi,


    Hope its a free company you are using, and not one that charges you.


    They may be correct about the OD, different legislation applies, although there are exceptions to this.


    Info here :


    https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/CONC/6/3.html
    I’m a Forum Ambassador and I support the Forum Team on the Debt free wannabe, Credit file and ratings, and Bankruptcy and living with it boards. If you need any help on these boards, do let me know. Please note that Ambassadors are not moderators. Any posts you spot in breach of the Forum Rules should be reported via the report button, or by emailing forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. All views are my own and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.For free non-judgemental debt advice, contact either Stepchange, National Debtline, or CitizensAdviceBureaux.Link to SOA Calculator- https://www.stoozing.com/soa.php The "provit letter" is here-https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2607247/letter-when-you-know-nothing-about-about-the-debt-aka-prove-it-letter
  • Thanks Sourcrates
    I am still in correspondence with these and will keep forum informed of any progress. Or none!!
    Walterman
  • Happy New Year Sourcrates and apologies for not getting back to you sooner as I was waiting for a reply from both CABOT and PRA. Cabot tell me they cannot find the CCA for 2 of my accounts and will keep trying (they are now sending me letters every month to tell me so)...however the 3rd account with CABOt they have found all the documentation and say the agreement is now enforceable. What do you think I should do with this ...offer a Final settlement....what should this be?
    PRA have responded very differently and informed me that "we are unable to fulfill your request for a copy agreement as current accounts do not require a credit agreement, therefore no credit agreement would have been set up when opening the account, such accounts are not included in the CCA 1974. re request for Deed of Assignment, these documents include sensitive commercial information and we are not obliged to provide you with this information"

    I find it strange that different companies can interpret the CCA regulation in different ways...any thoughts on how best to progress with these 2 companies.
    Walterman
  • sourcrates
    sourcrates Posts: 28,717
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    edited 14 January 2019 at 1:45PM
    Hi,

    If you want to make a settlement offer, then start lower than the actual amount you have available, gives you some wiggle room.

    The Deed of assignment is a document put before the court that contains information on a number of accounts, that may not all belong to you.
    Its the notice of assignment you are entitled to see.

    As for the current account, an authorised overdraft facility which has been renewed annually since 2012 is regulated by s78 CCA but i suggest you obtain legal advice on this one.
    I’m a Forum Ambassador and I support the Forum Team on the Debt free wannabe, Credit file and ratings, and Bankruptcy and living with it boards. If you need any help on these boards, do let me know. Please note that Ambassadors are not moderators. Any posts you spot in breach of the Forum Rules should be reported via the report button, or by emailing forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. All views are my own and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.For free non-judgemental debt advice, contact either Stepchange, National Debtline, or CitizensAdviceBureaux.Link to SOA Calculator- https://www.stoozing.com/soa.php The "provit letter" is here-https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2607247/letter-when-you-know-nothing-about-about-the-debt-aka-prove-it-letter
  • Thanks Sourcrates.....will follow up the request for Notice of assignment. Also in the SARS communication document, I noticed a conversation which took place between the PRA debt team when they assumed wrongly that one of my small incomes was as they said "could be he has income from another rented property" and when I corrected this saying it was from part-time work I currently do they apologise!...however should such assumptions be made about my income??

    I have now gone through the SARS document for CABOT and noticed that one of my debts was given by CABOT to Debt Managers to manage....however after I wrote to Debt Managers service in Jan 2018 re my health situation giving recent GP and Cardio Reports... DMS wrote back saying "our file has been closed and returned to our client Cabot Credit management and no further action will be taken by DMS. I then checked the SARS/Cabot entries for that time and noted that the debt was written off in 2/2/18 and again 9/2/18 Vulnerable Customer reason was given!!....however CABOT continues to receive a monthly DD payment for this debt. I would now like to stop paying this DD as I believe CABOT's admin system is questionable due to many admin problems I have had with them in the past. I have also asked them to only communicate with me via Resolver which they seem reluctant to do but keep sending me letters asking me to phone them to discuss my concerns. I am sure I am not the first to have such experiences with both PRA and CABOT. I did previously complain to the CSA re Cabot's quality of staff but it was very much a "whitewash" as they very much sided with CABOT stating that human mistakes can be made with admin issues and that they did not necessarily need qualified medical staff to assess medical reports submitted by GPs and Cardiologists!!.....is this good enough from very wealthy Firms such as CABOT to be let off the hook like that!!

    Grateful for any helpful thoughts on the above

    Walterman.
  • Good Morning Sourcrates
    CABOt have now written to confimr that 3 out of 4 debts are unenforceable ...these are historic debts 22/17 years but with CABOt between 6/9 years. I now plan to stop making my monthly payments for thest. For the 4th because so many admin mistakes were made/incorrect names (my wifes) amounts and apologies given I plan to escalate this to the Ombudsman via Resolver which I have been using...any advice would be helpful.
    Walterman
  • sourcrates
    sourcrates Posts: 28,717
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    Good result, well done.
    I’m a Forum Ambassador and I support the Forum Team on the Debt free wannabe, Credit file and ratings, and Bankruptcy and living with it boards. If you need any help on these boards, do let me know. Please note that Ambassadors are not moderators. Any posts you spot in breach of the Forum Rules should be reported via the report button, or by emailing forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. All views are my own and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.For free non-judgemental debt advice, contact either Stepchange, National Debtline, or CitizensAdviceBureaux.Link to SOA Calculator- https://www.stoozing.com/soa.php The "provit letter" is here-https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2607247/letter-when-you-know-nothing-about-about-the-debt-aka-prove-it-letter
  • Just_Di
    Just_Di Posts: 385
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    Walterman wrote: »
    For the 4th because so many admin mistakes were made/incorrect names (my wifes) amounts and apologies given I plan to escalate this to the Ombudsman via Resolver which I have been using...any advice would be helpful.

    It's good to see that Cabot have admitted three of your debts are unenforceable. They may still write to you and ask for money but you may wish to ignore them.

    I don't know enough about the fourth debt but tread carefully.

    The main thing is not to give them any information which allows them to correct the errors - and then they might issue a court claim once everything is in order thanks to your tip-off :)

    So if they've sent you documents in your wife's name they will then be able to produce new documents if you make them aware of the error. Don't do their work for them.

    I'd be hesitant to make a complaint and involve the FOS at this stage.

    If Cabot want to escalate matters to a legal situation they would instruct solicitors such as Restons, Shoosmiths or Mortimer Clarke (which they own).

    Under Pre-Action Protocol Cabot must send you a formal Letter Before Claim before they issue proceedings giving you 30 days to respond.

    A little more information about the fourth debt would help, in order to help you plan your next step.

    Di
  • Thanks, Di
    Apologies for the delay in getting back to you as I was out of the country but appreciate your advice which is very helpful. Cabot as a result of the CAA and SARS requests have now sent me the paperwork for the 4th debt....." a reconstituted true copy" with my signature on the original agreement with the Bank. This debt goes back 15yrs (2004) and with CABOT for 6 yrs and the most recent statement gives a total amount still due to £4188. I have in the past year disputed the ownership of the debt as they kept sending incorrect info on their statements ie. incorrect amounts owed, given my wifes' name as ownership etc. When I pointed this out to Cabot (being naive and as you said doing their work for them!!) I was given an apology "human error" and £50 refund. In the SARS it showed that the debt had been written off on 2/2/18 and again an entry on 9/2/18 stating that Debt Managers had returned this debt to CABOT due to "Vulnerable Customer reason" ...I supplied medical records plus my age is now 72 yrs.
    Due to the number of Admin errors in the management
    of this debt I requested that all correspondence in future be via the Resolver website....this they continue to ignore and send written correspondence. I continue to make monthly payments for this debt of £21 per month via a DMP and have been doing do for 6 yrs...I now feel that this historic debt has been repaid and would like to have rid of it in the coming month/s

    Walterman
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