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  • FIRST POST
    • Bobjol
    • By Bobjol 23rd Oct 18, 8:37 PM
    • 1Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Bobjol
    Smart Meters.
    • #1
    • 23rd Oct 18, 8:37 PM
    Smart Meters. 23rd Oct 18 at 8:37 PM
    We are British Gas customers for last 30 years or so, with no problems or complaints so far.
    Recent pressure has been put on us to get a smart meter fitted, with calls emails and doorstep pressure. We were never interested in getting one and certainly wont be having anything installed after the latest push. We know they can be beneficial to many people, but to us its a waste of time and money. We submit our gas and electricity readings online at the end of each month and receive an up to date email showing our usage and current expenditure...no probs with that. We have our meters read at least once a year by a meter reader who calls at the door at anytime day or night.....no probs there. However, we are not convinced by the sales push that a smart meter can save you money! Our only way of saving money on our energy bills is by turning off appliances.
    We have no intention of coming home at night and turn on some lights, bump up the heating a bit, switch on the cooker and kettle, and then have to turn everything off because the smart meter tells us we are currently using £xxxx of energy. We dont wish to sit in a cold, poorly lit house and eat a half cooked meal just because a meter has told us the cost of it.
Page 1
    • Houbara
    • By Houbara 23rd Oct 18, 10:45 PM
    • 3,994 Posts
    • 2,595 Thanks
    Houbara
    • #2
    • 23rd Oct 18, 10:45 PM
    • #2
    • 23rd Oct 18, 10:45 PM
    We are British Gas customers for last 30 years or so, with no problems or complaints so far.
    Recent pressure has been put on us to get a smart meter fitted, with calls emails and doorstep pressure. We were never interested in getting one and certainly wont be having anything installed after the latest push. We know they can be beneficial to many people, but to us its a waste of time and money. We submit our gas and electricity readings online at the end of each month and receive an up to date email showing our usage and current expenditure...no probs with that. We have our meters read at least once a year by a meter reader who calls at the door at anytime day or night.....no probs there. However, we are not convinced by the sales push that a smart meter can save you money! Our only way of saving money on our energy bills is by turning off appliances.
    We have no intention of coming home at night and turn on some lights, bump up the heating a bit, switch on the cooker and kettle, and then have to turn everything off because the smart meter tells us we are currently using £xxxx of energy. We dont wish to sit in a cold, poorly lit house and eat a half cooked meal just because a meter has told us the cost of it.
    Originally posted by Bobjol
    Simply do what I did and most others who have had a smart meter fitted. Don t plug the free In House Display monitor in..Bin it, or let it rot in a cupboard gathering dust, and carry on doing as you always did and completely ignore the meter.
    Smart meters can possibly save the users who have no idea about which appliances cost the most to run, otherwise the only people who save money , eventually , are the suppliers. Which is a good thing for us all. The more efficiently they run the business then they can pass these savings on.
    Smart prepayment meters will also be a big money saver for all suppliers battling with the extra costs of running meters from the last century in use.
    . These new meters are so cost effective to run they do not need subsidies or Government caps, they should naturally attract the cheapest tariffs given time when suppliers start to trust them.
    Last edited by Houbara; 24-10-2018 at 8:20 AM.
    • eddy
    • By eddy 23rd Oct 18, 11:20 PM
    • 41 Posts
    • 226 Thanks
    eddy
    • #3
    • 23rd Oct 18, 11:20 PM
    • #3
    • 23rd Oct 18, 11:20 PM
    We are British Gas customers for last 30 years or so.
    Recent pressure has been put on us to get a smart meter fitted, with calls emails and doorstep pressure. We were never interested in getting one and certainly wont be having anything installed after the latest push. We know they can be beneficial to many people, but to us its a waste of time and money.
    Originally posted by Bobjol
    Smart Energy GB state: Smart meters are not compulsory; it's entirely your choice. The government requires energy suppliers to offer smart meters to all homes and small businesses across Great Britain by 2020, but whether you accept them is completely up to you.

    We are not convinced by the sales push that a smart meter can save you money! Our only way of saving money on our energy bills is by turning off appliances.
    Originally posted by Bobjol
    This post links to an article regarding the British parliamentary group findings that smart meters cost the consumers more rather than saving money.

    Smart meters do not result in cheaper bills for consumers.

    It is the exact opposite. The British Infrastructure Group of Parliamentarians reported on the smart meters programme in July 2018, and stated that the consumers have been and will continue to pay higher bills to fund the entire 11 billion pound smart meters programme, with no guarantee of seeing any savings in the future.

    There is more public awareness of the real costs and issues with smart meters, so the energy companies are having to resort to dirty tricks to force consumers to take smart meters.
    Originally posted by emc
    • hareng
    • By hareng 23rd Oct 18, 11:52 PM
    • 360 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    hareng
    • #4
    • 23rd Oct 18, 11:52 PM
    • #4
    • 23rd Oct 18, 11:52 PM
    I would have a look at your readings and any inflated costs the last 20 months or so. The cost of the install is masked as free but you are/would be paying for it eventually.
    Sure costs have risen but not like they all make out when looking at most suppliers.


    I was with Npower massive increases around £350 p/a came in long to short term contracts. Also had three appointments of an install date by letter and phone we didnt make to install smart meters, one being between Christmas and New Year just gone. Other providers were much dearer based on actual usage.



    Carry on submitting your meter readings.
    Beauty is theres reputable energy suppliers (non mainstream/wholesalers) that dont require smart meters. You just submit as have been doing monthly and the costs generally for us are at least £350 p/a cheaper than those that 'trick' you in to smart meters.
    • Norman Castle
    • By Norman Castle 24th Oct 18, 9:19 AM
    • 7,570 Posts
    • 6,317 Thanks
    Norman Castle
    • #5
    • 24th Oct 18, 9:19 AM
    • #5
    • 24th Oct 18, 9:19 AM
    These new meters are so cost effective to run they do not need subsidies or Government caps,
    Originally posted by Houbara
    Its a pity there installation needs a 100% subsidy from customers which, given the choice, the vast majority of customers would choose not to pay.
    Don't harass a hippie. You'll get bad karma.

    Never trust a newbie with a rtb tale.
    • Alenna
    • By Alenna 8th Nov 18, 11:00 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Alenna
    • #6
    • 8th Nov 18, 11:00 PM
    Smartmeter for business
    • #6
    • 8th Nov 18, 11:00 PM
    Hope I can ask a question here while everyone is discussing smart meters. We have a shop and are looking for a business electricity provider who will install a smart meter for us, as the current meter is in a place we don’t have much access to. I wanted to make sure that we have a second- generation meter SMET2, but the company I spoke to, OPUS, tell me that those metres are only available to residential customers, not business and that business users other meters (he seemed to imply a completely different, simpler type for businesses) Is this true? And if so what happens if you want to switch supplier? Will the smart meter work?
    • jcontest
    • By jcontest 9th Nov 18, 1:13 AM
    • 104 Posts
    • 555 Thanks
    jcontest
    • #7
    • 9th Nov 18, 1:13 AM
    • #7
    • 9th Nov 18, 1:13 AM
    Hope I can ask a question here while everyone is discussing smart meters. We have a shop and are looking for a business electricity provider who will install a smart meter for us, as the current meter is in a place we don’t have much access to. I wanted to make sure that we have a second- generation meter SMET2, but the company I spoke to, OPUS, tell me that those metres are only available to residential customers, not business and that business users other meters (he seemed to imply a completely different, simpler type for businesses) Is this true? And if so what happens if you want to switch supplier? Will the smart meter work?
    Originally posted by Alenna

    I could be wrong but I'll chime in..


    Some provider should offer you SMETS2, I THINK the current deadline for SMETS1 is the 5th of December 2018. So anything after that date (Unless it's extended again) should be SMETS2 only.



    SMETS1 units installed after that date will not count and Capita can put a huge penalty on a company who is not installing smart meters, as such no one will want to install SMETS1 then.


    Try a provider other than OPUS, I don't keep up with the news on it all, but I am fairly sure the early SMETS2 units were non-residential installs.


    Be aware that the SMETS1 problem of communications might turn out to be a early problem for SMETS2 as well. So if your meter is in a hard to reach place, it might also be in a spot with bad cell coverage. That means they will look to install external aerials to try and get it working. I know someone who had a SMETS1 installed early in the summer (I suggested he wait), and his is still not working after several visits.


    Only a few thousand SMETS2 units have been installed across the country. So your best bet is probably to wait until the 6th of December.
    • Robin9
    • By Robin9 9th Nov 18, 7:53 AM
    • 3,274 Posts
    • 2,132 Thanks
    Robin9
    • #8
    • 9th Nov 18, 7:53 AM
    • #8
    • 9th Nov 18, 7:53 AM
    Hope I can ask a question here while everyone is discussing smart meters. We have a shop and are looking for a business electricity provider who will install a smart meter for us, ................................
    Originally posted by Alenna
    I manage the utilities for two commercial premises both which have Smart (actually Automatic Meter Reading) meters for gas and electric. The gas do not take their supply from the electric but have have a remote battery pack / transmitter several meters away from the meter itself.

    The original meters were installed by Gazprom several years ago and when we switched to Total Gas and Power 3 years ago I expected to have to do manual reads. However within a couple of the months I started to receive automatic reads.
    Never pay on an estimated bill
    • reeac
    • By reeac 9th Nov 18, 8:05 AM
    • 1,249 Posts
    • 505 Thanks
    reeac
    • #9
    • 9th Nov 18, 8:05 AM
    • #9
    • 9th Nov 18, 8:05 AM
    We had a Smart Meter fitted several years ago as I wasn't bothered by any Big Brother scare stories. Problem was that only after it was fitted did the installer discover that we have no mobile phone signal so it's actually a Dumb Meter ...never mind at least he got paid for installing it. Subsequently there has been sporadic e mailing concerning fitting an antenna to enhance the signal strength. On the most recent occasion we had a phone call from a man who wanted to arrange an appointment to install the antenna but in order to do this he had to speak to me, not my wife, and as I wasn't there he said that he'd call back later. He never did. Meanwhile I send in a reading every few months and our electricity consumption continues at a very consistent 3800kWh per annum (1100 solar plus 2700 from the Grid) whilst we sneer at the TV ads concerning all the savings which a SM will yield. A parable of our times .... rather like the pro diesel because it's cleaner campaign of yesteryear.
    • 937carrera
    • By 937carrera 9th Nov 18, 10:34 AM
    • 41 Posts
    • 10 Thanks
    937carrera
    Simple answer to the OP

    You do not have to have a smart meter fitted.

    Simply tell BG or any other supplier NO

    You're absolutely right,smart meters don't save money.

    The whole business case for the "savings" has been shown to be wildly inacurate and overstated.

    Npower kept making appointments which I didn't confirm, bloke turned up, said i didn't want one, wouldn't have one and I was deleted from the list.

    Cue Grange Hill song "Just say no"
    • Anthorn
    • By Anthorn 9th Nov 18, 11:01 AM
    • 4,007 Posts
    • 1,074 Thanks
    Anthorn
    Hope I can ask a question here while everyone is discussing smart meters. We have a shop and are looking for a business electricity provider who will install a smart meter for us, as the current meter is in a place we don’t have much access to. I wanted to make sure that we have a second- generation meter SMET2, but the company I spoke to, OPUS, tell me that those metres are only available to residential customers, not business and that business users other meters (he seemed to imply a completely different, simpler type for businesses) Is this true? And if so what happens if you want to switch supplier? Will the smart meter work?
    Originally posted by Alenna
    I'll also chime in: SMETS2 becomes outdated if it has not already done so because SMETS1 meters will have their software updated over the air which enables them to connect with the new DCC. So that means that all smart meters will connect with the central database instead of connecting with the supplier which fitted the smart meter. So therefore it doesn't really mater if you have SMETS1, SMETS2 or indeed SMETS59.5 because eventually they will all work the same.
    https://www.smartdcc.co.uk/about/
    • brewerdave
    • By brewerdave 9th Nov 18, 11:31 AM
    • 5,183 Posts
    • 2,304 Thanks
    brewerdave
    I'll also chime in: SMETS2 becomes outdated if it has not already done so because SMETS1 meters will have their software updated over the air which enables them to connect with the new DCC.
    Originally posted by Anthorn
    Not true -SMETS1 meters will have to have their own stand alone system -they will NOT BE adopted into the DCC database PLUS some SMETS1 meters will have to be replaced as they can't be upgraded.
    • Hengus
    • By Hengus 9th Nov 18, 12:02 PM
    • 6,596 Posts
    • 4,231 Thanks
    Hengus
    Not true -SMETS1 meters will have to have their own stand alone system -they will NOT BE adopted into the DCC database PLUS some SMETS1 meters will have to be replaced as they can't be upgraded.
    Originally posted by brewerdave
    They will also have to have one-2-one connection with the DCC as they will not be integrated into the SMETS2 Wide Area Network. I am sure that there are also a myriad of other technical differences between the SMETS1 and 2 protocols. The latter runs to over 800 pages.
    • Anthorn
    • By Anthorn 9th Nov 18, 12:26 PM
    • 4,007 Posts
    • 1,074 Thanks
    Anthorn
    Not true -SMETS1 meters will have to have their own stand alone system -they will NOT BE adopted into the DCC database PLUS some SMETS1 meters will have to be replaced as they can't be upgraded.
    Originally posted by brewerdave
    Not true. Or conversely if it is true SMETS1 smart meters will need to be ripped out and replaced with SMETS2 meters in order for them to be fully compatible with the new DCC network. In addition why on earth would there be an over the air update of SMETS1 smart meters to make them compatible with the new DCC if that's going to be a complete and utter waste of time.

    Really, you need to think before you rush in.

    we've had an update about this recently! If you've got a SMETS1 meter, when SMETS2 is rolled out, you won't need a meter change or engineer visit. They are going to be linked up to the DCC remotely.
    https://forum.ovoenergy.com/smart-meter-compatibility-67/how-will-smets1-meters-be-updated-when-smets2-is-rolled-out-1944

    If we want to be strict about it we could speculate that SMETS1 smart meters will link to the new DCC instead of directly connecting. But really there is no difference: If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck it's probably a duck.

    What remains is when SMETS1 meters will connect to the DCC. I've seen dates of December 2018, December 2019 and when the rollout of SMETS2 is complete.

    But consider the problem with Scottish Power SMETS1 smart meters: Half-hourly smart readings used to work but now they don't and customers now have to specify daily readings. The reason stated is that half-hourly readings is not compatible with the DCC. So from that draw your own conclusion!
    • Mister G
    • By Mister G 9th Nov 18, 12:41 PM
    • 804 Posts
    • 474 Thanks
    Mister G
    Hope I can ask a question here while everyone is discussing smart meters. We have a shop and are looking for a business electricity provider who will install a smart meter for us, as the current meter is in a place we don’t have much access to. I wanted to make sure that we have a second- generation meter SMET2, but the company I spoke to, OPUS, tell me that those metres are only available to residential customers, not business and that business users other meters (he seemed to imply a completely different, simpler type for businesses) Is this true? And if so what happens if you want to switch supplier? Will the smart meter work?
    Originally posted by Alenna
    Yes, this is true. I manage our Village Hall which has a commercial supply. We have just had the old spinning wheel type meter replaced this morning with one that can be remotely read. I had a long discussion with the guy who was fitting it as to how it worked

    This is a complete separate system to the SMETs system and is only for commercial premises and has been in place for sometime.

    The meter is equipped with a multi network SIM card and will choose the mobile network with the strongest signal. The data finally ends up back with your supplier.

    If you change supplier the data is then sent to your new supplier.
    • chrisw99
    • By chrisw99 9th Nov 18, 1:36 PM
    • 318 Posts
    • 191 Thanks
    chrisw99
    I've had mine installed a few weeks now and although initially apprehensive, I don't see what the fuss was all about. It's really good to be able to see this...

    https://imgur.com/rSIP7Fa
    • Chino
    • By Chino 10th Nov 18, 4:29 PM
    • 577 Posts
    • 306 Thanks
    Chino
    It's really good to be able to see this...
    Originally posted by chrisw99
    I can imagine.

    Adding the daily costs shown by the histogram (generally rounded down to the nearest pound) I get:
    Gas: 5 + 4 + 3 + 1 + 2 + 5 + 5 + 5 + 6 + 4 + 6 + 6 + 6 + 6 = £64
    Electricity: 3 + 3 + 2 + 1 + 1 + 3 + 3 + 3 + 4 + 2 + 4 + 3 + 3 + 3 = £38

    Giving a total cost of approximately £102 yet the combined cost calculated by the meter is £68.82!
    • reeac
    • By reeac 10th Nov 18, 5:19 PM
    • 1,249 Posts
    • 505 Thanks
    reeac
    I can imagine.

    Adding the daily costs shown by the histogram (generally rounded down to the nearest pound) I get:
    Gas: 5 + 4 + 3 + 1 + 2 + 5 + 5 + 5 + 6 + 4 + 6 + 6 + 6 + 6 = £64
    Electricity: 3 + 3 + 2 + 1 + 1 + 3 + 3 + 3 + 4 + 2 + 4 + 3 + 3 + 3 = £38

    Giving a total cost of approximately £102 yet the combined cost calculated by the meter is £68.82!
    Originally posted by Chino
    That's changed my mind about SM s .... there's a built in 33percent discount. Why didn't they tell us about that?
    • chrisw99
    • By chrisw99 11th Nov 18, 9:00 PM
    • 318 Posts
    • 191 Thanks
    chrisw99
    I can imagine.

    Adding the daily costs shown by the histogram (generally rounded down to the nearest pound) I get:
    Gas: 5 + 4 + 3 + 1 + 2 + 5 + 5 + 5 + 6 + 4 + 6 + 6 + 6 + 6 = £64
    Electricity: 3 + 3 + 2 + 1 + 1 + 3 + 3 + 3 + 4 + 2 + 4 + 3 + 3 + 3 = £38

    Giving a total cost of approximately £102 yet the combined cost calculated by the meter is £68.82!
    Originally posted by Chino
    Er,not quite. You are reading the gas as starting from the bottom of the scale. It starts from where the electric ends so is more like 1.5, 1.5,1, 0.5 etc

    So what you put as Gas (5+4+3 etc ) is the total combined cost per day
    Last edited by chrisw99; 11-11-2018 at 9:02 PM.
    • kuepper
    • By kuepper 12th Nov 18, 1:03 AM
    • 698 Posts
    • 112 Thanks
    kuepper
    I've given in, just got sick of phone calls and emails to have one so I've been bullied into it
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