Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • Hansodeon
    • By Hansodeon 3rd May 19, 8:23 PM
    • 1Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Hansodeon
    What to replace ceiling heating with?
    • #1
    • 3rd May 19, 8:23 PM
    What to replace ceiling heating with? 3rd May 19 at 8:23 PM
    We are taking on a project. 1970s house in a village with no gas supply. The house currently has ceiling heating panels which are incredibly energy inefficient and which will need replacing with some other type of system. Most houses in the village have either oil-fired boiler and radiators or storage heaters. I really feel the cold so want a properly warm house but would like something eco-friendly if possible. I am not sure the oil-fired boiler is the beat long term option. I would be very grateful for any thoughts.
Page 1
    • jk0
    • By jk0 3rd May 19, 8:59 PM
    • 2,993 Posts
    • 26,504 Thanks
    jk0
    • #2
    • 3rd May 19, 8:59 PM
    • #2
    • 3rd May 19, 8:59 PM
    Storage heaters IIWY.


    You have a choice of electronic ones that will comply with building regs, (but will require expensive repairs when the electronics pack up) or second hand electro-mechanical ones from ebay.


    My experience of Duoheat radiators in my rentals suggests going with the 2nd hand traditional storage heaters with maybe some direct heaters for bedroom and top up in living room.
    • Ectophile
    • By Ectophile 4th May 19, 1:43 PM
    • 3,620 Posts
    • 2,336 Thanks
    Ectophile
    • #3
    • 4th May 19, 1:43 PM
    • #3
    • 4th May 19, 1:43 PM
    Air source or ground source heat pumps are more efficient than any other sort of heating. They are expensive to install, but there are subsidies for them.


    But they will only really work in a well insulated house, as they put out a constant low heat. In a typical UK house, you'd struggle to keep the place warm.
    Last edited by Ectophile; 04-05-2019 at 1:44 PM. Reason: Typo
    If it sticks, force it.
    If it breaks, well it wasn't working right anyway.
    • Benight
    • By Benight 4th May 19, 2:02 PM
    • 314 Posts
    • 111 Thanks
    Benight
    • #4
    • 4th May 19, 2:02 PM
    • #4
    • 4th May 19, 2:02 PM
    We are taking on a project. 1970s house in a village with no gas supply. The house currently has ceiling heating panels which are incredibly energy inefficient and which will need replacing with some other type of system. Most houses in the village have either oil-fired boiler and radiators or storage heaters. I really feel the cold so want a properly warm house but would like something eco-friendly if possible. I am not sure the oil-fired boiler is the beat long term option. I would be very grateful for any thoughts.
    Originally posted by Hansodeon
    What power source do the "incredibly energy inefficient" ceiling heating panels consume?

    Afaik, almost all types of electrical heater are at least 100% efficient (almost)

    As suggested above, only the likes of air or ground source heat pumps will be more efficient
    (i.e. they produce more heat than the electrical energy they consume, as they extract/pump existing heat from elsewhere)
    Last edited by Benight; 04-05-2019 at 2:06 PM.
    • Mister G
    • By Mister G 4th May 19, 2:10 PM
    • 1,066 Posts
    • 652 Thanks
    Mister G
    • #5
    • 4th May 19, 2:10 PM
    • #5
    • 4th May 19, 2:10 PM
    OP, have you looked at bulk LPG?

    Firstly, check what price per litre your local suppliers are charging.

    Anything around 30ppl will make it cheaper to run than oil and the boiler will be about half the price of an oil one.

    You will need somewhere suitable to site the tank, but that is also true of oil. Also with LPG, the supplier usually installs the tank free of charge.

    LPG also has lower CO2 emissions than oil and you never hear of thefts!

    Certainly worth a look.

    You may find this useful:

    https://nottenergy.com/our-services/resources/energy-cost-comparison/
    Last edited by Mister G; 04-05-2019 at 2:14 PM.
    • Rodders53
    • By Rodders53 4th May 19, 4:51 PM
    • 689 Posts
    • 448 Thanks
    Rodders53
    • #6
    • 4th May 19, 4:51 PM
    • #6
    • 4th May 19, 4:51 PM
    As heat rises having the heat source on a ceiling is plain daft.

    When renovating: Insulate. Insulate. Insulate. and draught proof.

    You will need to overhaul wiring for storage heaters and maybe go to E7 if it's not there already. You will need to install tanks for LPG or oil plus radiators or UFH (if the floors can be insulated etc.,.). Not all homes have space for a LPG or oil storage tank that meet the restrictive buildings regulations, or extra costs are incurred for fire walls and the like.

    WET heat pump systems can get subsidies and can work well if designed in from scratch with lots of insulation. Will need UFH and/or larger radiators to cope with lower circulating water temps, plus a Legionella regime for the HW tank via an immersion heater. Poorly designed and they can be as useless as the existing ceiling panel heaters!

    Air to air heat pumps (air con in summer, fan heater in winter) may be another option worth looking at and pricing up for some rooms if not all.

    You'll need to get costs (or do estimates yourself) for all the alternatives and the 'payback' period for any investment; compared to an all electric panel heater install.
    • Cardew
    • By Cardew 4th May 19, 6:15 PM
    • 27,869 Posts
    • 13,732 Thanks
    Cardew
    • #7
    • 4th May 19, 6:15 PM
    • #7
    • 4th May 19, 6:15 PM
    Welcome to the forum.


    Your question has been posed dozens of times on this forum and there is no 'one size fits all solution'. If you search for the many threads in this section you will find varaitions of the points made in the posts above; although I don't recall seeing many suggesting LPG - most are trying to get rid of LPG.



    A heating system that will suit, say, a retired couple who spend most of the day in the house, may not be the best solution for a family who are out at work.


    You don't give your reasons why you are 'not sure the oil-fired boiler is the best long term option'.



    Good luck!
    • Benight
    • By Benight 4th May 19, 6:18 PM
    • 314 Posts
    • 111 Thanks
    Benight
    • #8
    • 4th May 19, 6:18 PM
    • #8
    • 4th May 19, 6:18 PM
    As heat rises having the heat source on a ceiling is plain daft....
    Originally posted by Rodders53
    With respect, it would appear you do not fully understand how such ceiling heating panels are designed to operate.

    Most heaters, and indeed incorrectly termed radiators in a typical central heating system, operate primarily on the basis of convection.

    That is the heat is transferred to the air, and hot air as you say rises... and so circulates in a closed room.

    However, ceiling heaters work on a different basis, called radiation,

    That is the heat is transferred via infrared waves. These can travel in all directions. Some of the large sheds, such as B&Q, often use such type of heating in winter to supplement their usual fan heating ... probably because the ceilings are high and as said, hot air rises.

    The sun is perhaps the biggest radiator of heat we know ... and you know how hot that can be on a summers day, and that is coming from almost 100 million miles above us!

    Actually the sun is fighting a constant battle when it heats the earth via radiation. Because as the earth's surface temperature rises due to the radation, then the air above it rises due to convection, allowing cooler air to rush in. That's why you often get to enjoy a cool coastal breeze whilst you are soaking up the hot sun's rays at the beach.
    Last edited by Benight; 04-05-2019 at 6:23 PM.
    • Mister G
    • By Mister G 4th May 19, 6:57 PM
    • 1,066 Posts
    • 652 Thanks
    Mister G
    • #9
    • 4th May 19, 6:57 PM
    • #9
    • 4th May 19, 6:57 PM
    If you search for the many threads in this section you will find varaitions of the points made in the posts above; although I don't recall seeing many suggesting LPG - most are trying to get rid of LPG.

    A heating system that will suit, say, a retired couple who spend most of the day in the house, may not be the best solution for a family who are out at work.
    Originally posted by Cardew
    Those trying to get rid of LPG are probably paying the likes of Calor and Flogas an exorbitant 50-60ppl. At 30-35ppl (which a number of people on here have achieved) it is very cost effective compared with oil and produces less CO2.
    • Cardew
    • By Cardew 4th May 19, 10:38 PM
    • 27,869 Posts
    • 13,732 Thanks
    Cardew
    Those trying to get rid of LPG are probably paying the likes of Calor and Flogas an exorbitant 50-60ppl. At 30-35ppl (which a number of people on here have achieved) it is very cost effective compared with oil and produces less CO2.
    Originally posted by Mister G

    I have seen your other posts on costs of LPG and at 35p a litre which is approx 5pence a kWh it is competitive with CH oil. Currently with Boilerjuice this costs approx 46p a ltre so approx 4.5pkWh





    However I have been trying to find current quoted prices for LPG and can't find any approaching 35p/litre, and people in the LPG thread, to which you contribute, are also finding it difficult.


    The reliable Nottingham Energy link you gave lists prices for March 2019 as CH oil at 5.62p/kWh and LPG at 6.86p/kWh. so LPG is 22% more expensive than oil.
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

1,618Posts Today

7,195Users online

Martin's Twitter