Avoiding probate

amy1982_2
amy1982_2 Posts: 4 Newbie
in Old Threads
Hello, wonder if anyone can help us check if the following is legal and OK to do.

my sister has sadly been diagnosed with a very aggressive form of cancer and given only weeks to live and has been very keen to get all her affairs in order this week, she has paid off the only debt she had "£1000 credit card" has no other liability's, assets "excluding bed, TV, sofa and other household items", shares, property or savings etc and just 1 bank account with £60k in it that she received as a lump sum from early retirement.

she made a will herself leaving half to me and half to our brother "has no other living relatives", but has suggested to us that she just transfer £30k each into our accounts now while she still can rather than it have to go through probate, and we would then obviously pay the cost of her funeral between us.

I can see her point that it would be a lot easier and faster that way but just wanted to check, please note that everything here is the truth and the outcome would be the same after probate as if she done it now.

thanks to anyone that can offer advice on this, before she goes ahead and transfers the money.

Comments

  • Fire_Fox
    Fire_Fox Posts: 26,026 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Anniversary First Post Combo Breaker
    Welcome! :) Have your sister make out a proper will with a solicitor, many people don't get wills witnessed properly or make other minor mistakes that mean they are invalid. It isn't even expensive and they will give basic legal advice at the same time. Probate is about settling all the affairs, paying household bills and distributing everything not just the bulk of the money. I don't think it is wise to take large sums of money from people who are terminally ill without legal advice, it could look like you have taken advantage when you have not.
    Declutterbug-in-progress.⭐️⭐️⭐️ ⭐️⭐️
  • amy1982_2
    amy1982_2 Posts: 4 Newbie
    thank you for the reply, the will she made her self, and got witnessed by two people she worked with, and is held by us, no solicitors involved, "her wish not too" she read that if opon death the estate is worth less than £5000, its a lot simpler and quicker too sort out. And as there is no one else involved surely it won't matter how it looks? as won't be anyone who would question it right?
  • paddedjohn
    paddedjohn Posts: 7,512 Forumite
    First Anniversary
    Was/is your sister receiving any benefits that might be affected by the £60k? If not and there's only the 2 of you then it looks like a sensible way to tidy up her affairs.
    Be Alert..........Britain needs lerts.
  • amy1982_2
    amy1982_2 Posts: 4 Newbie
    no benifits and all bills are pre-paid by monthly direct debit, just gas/elec/water/tv/phone and all in good standing obviously we would pay any balance on each but at the moment all slightly in credit.
  • oldtoolie
    oldtoolie Posts: 750 Forumite
    For your's and your sister's peace of mind, paying a solicitor £100-£200 to review the will and arrangements would be money well spent.
  • amy1982_2
    amy1982_2 Posts: 4 Newbie
    I know it might not seem much, but I do feel even £200 would be a waste as her affairs are so simple, providing there is no issue with her simple given us £30k each, there is zero chance of there being any other will, any other claim made, or any money in her bank at time of death.

    The only thing I can not find 100% confirmation on, is if she gives us £30k each now as neither me or my brother receive any benefits would it for all intents an purposes be the same as getting it 6 months later via probate? I.E via probate we wouldn't be liable to pay tax on it our self as income, we are both in full time PAYE employment.

    Thanks again for all the replies.
  • antrobus
    antrobus Posts: 17,386 Forumite
    amy1982 wrote: »
    ... if she gives us £30k each now as neither me or my brother receive any benefits would it for all intents an purposes be the same as getting it 6 months later via probate? ....

    Yes, there is no gift tax in the UK.
  • CAB_National_Representative
    CAB_National_Representative Posts: 220 Organisation Representative
    amy1982 wrote: »
    Hello, wonder if anyone can help us check if the following is legal and OK to do.

    my sister has sadly been diagnosed with a very aggressive form of cancer and given only weeks to live and has been very keen to get all her affairs in order this week, she has paid off the only debt she had "£1000 credit card" has no other liability's, assets "excluding bed, TV, sofa and other household items", shares, property or savings etc and just 1 bank account with £60k in it that she received as a lump sum from early retirement.

    she made a will herself leaving half to me and half to our brother "has no other living relatives", but has suggested to us that she just transfer £30k each into our accounts now while she still can rather than it have to go through probate, and we would then obviously pay the cost of her funeral between us.

    I can see her point that it would be a lot easier and faster that way but just wanted to check, please note that everything here is the truth and the outcome would be the same after probate as if she done it now.

    thanks to anyone that can offer advice on this, before she goes ahead and transfers the money.

    Hi amy1982 - we're not covering probate issues on the board at the moment. We'd recommend that you get expert advice on this, from your local bureau and/or a solicitor.

    You may also be interested in reading through the following information on wills on our Adviceguide website, which covers making a will without a solicitor - and also what details it is essential to have covered.
    “Official CAB Representative
    I am an official representative of CAB. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to questions on the CAB Board. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. If you believe I’ve broken any rules please report my post to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com as usual"
  • agrinnall
    agrinnall Posts: 23,344 Forumite
    First Post Combo Breaker
    amy1982 wrote: »
    I know it might not seem much, but I do feel even £200 would be a waste as her affairs are so simple, providing there is no issue with her simple given us £30k each, there is zero chance of there being any other will, any other claim made, or any money in her bank at time of death.

    The only thing I can not find 100% confirmation on, is if she gives us £30k each now as neither me or my brother receive any benefits would it for all intents an purposes be the same as getting it 6 months later via probate? I.E via probate we wouldn't be liable to pay tax on it our self as income, we are both in full time PAYE employment.

    Thanks again for all the replies.


    I'm sorry, but spending £200 when there is £60,000 in the bank is not a waste of money, it's sensible financial planning. Clearly neither you nor your sister actually know the answers to the questions you are raising, and when your sister has passed away it'll be too late to say "I wish I'd done x, y or z". It's also a waste of what little time she has to be worrying about it when it's easily resolved.
  • zzzLazyDaisy
    zzzLazyDaisy Posts: 12,497 Forumite
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    OP, you have my sympathy at this sad time.

    To answer your question:

    Your sister's estate is under the IHT limits, and there is no gift tax in UK. This means that if she simply gives you each £30,000 now, there will be no adverse implications for you, and as you say it will make life much simpler once she has gone.

    If you consult a solicitor, their concern is likely to be about your sister, and whether she is of sound mind to make such a decision - and does she understand that, in the unlikely event that she were to recover, she is gifting away her money forever, and would have no right to claim it back. The soicitor would also be concerned to ensure that she is not giving the money away to you 'under duress' (in other words because you are putting pressure on her, in her weak and vulnerable state).

    Please understand that these are not accusations against you, but they are areas that the solicitor MUST satisfy himself/herself about, as there is a clear conflict of interests between your interests and hers. If YOU were to consult me about this matter, I could advise YOU, but I would also have to advise your sister, in writing, to take her own separate legal advice about this, because it would be impossible for me to protect both your interests and hers.

    So you see where this is leading - involving a solicitor is likely to take time that you may not have.

    I can tell you this, though... I am in a similar position to your sister, in that I have a degenerative illness and am unlikely to live to a ripe old age. I do have a will, but hopefully I will know when I am getting ready to leave this planet, and I fully intend to give my money away before I go, knowing that there will be no repercussions on the people who receive the money, and it will simplify things for my family who will have to deal with my stuff when I am gone. So this is not legal advice, but maybe it answers your question?

    Dx
    I'm a retired employment solicitor. Hopefully some of my comments might be useful, but they are only my opinion and not intended as legal advice.
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