Screenconnect, Connectwise, Logmein Rescue, Teamviewer11, ShowMyPC, Microsoft Registartion Files

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  • AndyPix
    AndyPix Posts: 4,847
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    They are not easily used surreptitiously - It is clear from your words that you do not understand this technology and this is the source of your concern ..


    These tools cannot be installed by anyone except the user in fromt of the screen.


    I say again, if someone has managed to trick you into installing this, and also guided you to accept all the boxes that pop up asking if you want to allow control, then it is game over for you anyway and remote tools are the least of your worries.
  • peterbaker
    peterbaker Posts: 3,083 Forumite
    I understand it well enough to convince a bank fraud department that they had no cause to blame the fraud victim and to reimburse the £8,000 plus lost.

    Does your understanding of the subject go that far? I wonder.
  • peterbaker
    peterbaker Posts: 3,083 Forumite
    edited 7 August 2018 at 10:25AM
    AndyPix wrote: »
    They are not easily used surreptitiously - It is clear from your words that you do not understand this technology and this is the source of your concern ..
    Did I say they were easily used? They were knowledgeably used against a customer who they targeted as being likely to be easily confidence tricked into following instructions like "now just click on the link in the bottom right corner, and then just click OK on any box that pops up after that ..." etc.
    These tools cannot be installed by anyone except the user in fromt of the screen.
    Really? And why then would it be worthwhile for a fraudster to use USD1,080 of defrauded money on upgrading a trial version to PREMIUM? And how might they do that if they already have the other listed remote control softwares up and running? Think harder before you post please. What I describe did happen. What you are asserting is that no-one but a complete fool would suffer the fate of having telephone scammers emptying their bank account using fresh installs of such softwares, which I earnestly suggest is not very helpful given your enormous breadth of digital knowledge under that hood ;)
  • AndyPix
    AndyPix Posts: 4,847
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    peterbaker wrote: »
    I understand it well enough to convince a bank fraud department that they had no cause to blame the fraud victim and to reimburse the £8,000 plus lost.

    Does your understanding of the subject go that far? I wonder.


    Well I am an IT security consultant, work for a very large well known technology company, and have qualifications in offensive security amongst many others ..


    So yes my understanding on this subject is not lacking ..


    You explaining to the bank that the victim has been defrauded does not show that you understand how remote tools are installed on a system, nor does it have any bearing on wether antivirus syetems should flag remote tools as malicious - which is what this thread is about
  • AndyPix
    AndyPix Posts: 4,847
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    edited 7 August 2018 at 10:35AM
    peterbaker wrote: »
    Did I say they were easily used?


    Yes, before you edited your post

    peterbaker wrote: »
    They were knowledgeably used against a customer who they targeted as being likely to be easily confidence tricked into following instructions like "now just click on the link in the bottom right corner, and then just click OK on any box that pops up after that ..." etc.

    Really? And why then would it be worthwhile for a fraudster to use USD1,080 of defrauded money on upgrading a trial version to PREMIUM? And how might they do that if they already have the other listed remote control softwares up and running? Think harder before you post please. What I describe did happen. What you are asserting is that no-one but a complete fool would suffer the fate of having telephone scammers emptying their bank account using fresh installs of such softwares, which I earnestly suggest is not very helpful given your enormous breadth of digital knowledge under that hood ;)


    The rest of your post just hammers home that fact that you do not understand what you are complaining about - veiled insults aside

    peterbaker wrote: »
    What you are asserting is that no-one but a complete fool would suffer the fate of having telephone scammers emptying their bank account using fresh installs of such softwares, which I earnestly suggest is not very helpful given your enormous breadth of digital knowledge under that hood ;)


    Please point out where anyone asserted this .. this is entirely your imagination


    You started the thread complaining that AV suites dont flag remote tools.
    It has been explained to you why this is completely unnecessary.


    No one is talking about fools except you.


    A good analogy is the buying of hammers .. They dont come with a warning that someone may take it out of your hand and kill you with it - do you think they should ??
  • almillar
    almillar Posts: 8,621
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    edited 10 August 2018 at 6:26AM
    You are splitting hairs. Most users know that their Windows PCs suffer constant automatic updates, many of which do not even announce that they have installed.

    New applications do not have to be very large - if they are chosen because the install is quick and does not announce itself boldly or give the user any option to choose to continue to install or stop or change the install then the fact anything dodgy has been installed can easily be missed when you believe you are being guided by someone who is genuinely trying to assist.

    I don't think 'the user has to install, the scammer cannot' is splitting hairs, I think it's actually fundamental to your argument. Anyway, your defence above, is that users shouldn't have to read stuff on their screen whilst installing or updading things. I bet you've had your default search engine changed because you haven't read something properly before. Again, that's your fault.
    It is very clear that the makers of these types of software know their products are used far too easily and surreptitiously by scammers, so they should contain clear warnings when they are being installed.

    Right, so you get your way, the makers alter their software. The scammers remove the warnings. Back to square 1. I reiterate - make users smarter!
    Really? And why then would it be worthwhile for a fraudster to use USD1,080 of defrauded money on upgrading a trial version to PREMIUM?

    You think scammers pay for software.

    (Text removed by MSE Forum Team)
  • peterbaker
    peterbaker Posts: 3,083 Forumite
    edited 10 August 2018 at 6:24AM
    almillar wrote: »
    You think scammers pay for software. You really are deluded.
    No you guys are. You need to look up from your ones and zeros occasionally and see beyond what you believe to be the scope of the problems besetting everyday applications of the latest data science, and also besetting the users who barely know their way to their webmail from switching on, and who typically keep their way in to ebanking as Desktop shortcut or a bookmark as they can't find their way in the raw without a little prompting.

    I have the receipt from Connectwise ScreenConnect for $1,080, paid for by a fraudulent transaction during the course of a telephone scam, so because I hold that receipt, and receipts for other transactions made fraudulently in the same attack, does that make me the scammer? Clue: No it doesn't, and it doesn't make the victim the scammer either because she didn't have a clue what software had been installed or used against her, nor that her money had been used to buy the PREMIUM software licence, nor that any software house receipts existed that I could discover - nor do you by the sounds of it.

    Otherwise hold your fire please.

    (Text removed by MSE Forum Team)
  • GunJack
    GunJack Posts: 11,669
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    I really can't believe this thread is still running...and that peterbaker is STILL not understanding the true nature of the problem...
    ......Gettin' There, Wherever There is......

    I have a dodgy "i" key, so ignore spelling errors due to "i" issues, ...I blame Apple :D
  • rmg1
    rmg1 Posts: 3,123
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    I've been following this thread with some interest as it's something I want to learn more about.

    I haven't been scammed (thankfully) but I'm not as computer-savvy as some (although not a novice by any means).

    Even I know that the user has to download a program and install it (whether by being duped into doing so or deliberately).

    Scammers cannot do anything on your machine without you first giving them access. I have had a couple of calls from "Microsoft" or "my ISP" saying my computer had viruses and they needed access to my machine to sort it out.

    Fortunately, I know enough to ignore these calls as "Microsoft" or "my ISP" is not philanthropic enough to make these calls (or even care what's on my computer if it doesn't cause them issues) but some people wouldn't.

    I agree with previous posters that these sharing tools do not need to come with warnings (as has been said before, scammers would just hack them to remove the warnings) as they are perfectly legitimate. Users need educating to show that people will not phone up, out of the blue, to "help" them with their computer issues.

    If someone has the misfortune to falls for one of these scams, I just hope that their are people available (like on here) to help get them out of the mess they have unwittingly caused themselves.
    :wall: Flagellation, necrophilia and bestiality - Am I flogging a dead horse? :wall:

    Any posts are my opinion and only that. Please read at your own risk.
  • almillar
    almillar Posts: 8,621
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    I have the receipt from Connectwise ScreenConnect for $1,080, paid for by a fraudulent transaction during the course of a telephone scam, so because I hold that receipt

    A receipt from a fraudster? Think it might be fake? They got your neighbour to buy software for them?

    Look, you're overthinking all of this on the basis of 1 experience. Someone was on the phone with your neighbour and was able to persuade them to do all sorts of things on their own computer, including installing some remote desktop software. There would have been lots of

    'just click here'
    'close that window'
    'type this in here'
    'just ignore that'.

    Your super duper solution of warning users upon installation would just be another window that can be clicked away, if indeed the scammers don't get rid of it in the dodgy version they install.
    Go find it if you are interested - should be a breeze for those such as your goodselves if applying the latest string search techniques.

    Post anything relevant in this thread, please.
    Please re-read my posts, explaining why your solution simply, won't, work, instead of calling us smart alec know it alls.
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