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  • FIRST POST
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 13th Mar 18, 5:10 PM
    • 13Posts
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    wrongplanet
    Trustcard Plus points: Lloyds lie about redeeming
    • #1
    • 13th Mar 18, 5:10 PM
    Trustcard Plus points: Lloyds lie about redeeming 13th Mar 18 at 5:10 PM
    I've never bothered with Trustcard Plus points in the past as all you can use them for these days is to buy vouchers for Argos etc. at a 10% discount,

    However my latest statement says:
    Don't forget you may have unredeemed Trustcard points to use
    As you spend, you collect points which you can exchange for high street vouchers. Your points balance can be found on your monthly credit card statement.
    To find out more about our selected retailers or to redeem your points, simply call us on 0345 603 7132.


    That's new. I've got over 7800 points so I gave the number a call, only to find it's still the old 10% off deal.

    OK, call Trustcard Customer Services to complain about what is at best a misleading statement.

    Had no problem explaining that wording did not agree with facts and asked to make a complaint.

    They came back with, in precis, that the wording had been approved and wouldn't be changed. I was offered 9 compensation for my calls and time.

    So Lloyds lie about the way TC Plus points can be exchanged and when challenged take the line that as it was approved it's OK.

    Did any other Lloyds customers have this on their statement and any suggestions as to how to proceed from here?
Page 1
    • zx81
    • By zx81 13th Mar 18, 5:19 PM
    • 17,295 Posts
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    zx81
    • #2
    • 13th Mar 18, 5:19 PM
    • #2
    • 13th Mar 18, 5:19 PM
    What can you redeem the points for?
    • Ben8282
    • By Ben8282 14th Mar 18, 12:15 AM
    • 2,363 Posts
    • 1,081 Thanks
    Ben8282
    • #3
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:15 AM
    • #3
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:15 AM
    What has this got to do with Lloyds?
    Lloyds and TSB have been separate banks again for years now and Trustcard is an ancient TSB credit card product from pre-Lloyds/TSB days when TSB was known as the Trustee Savings Bank. IF you really do still have a Trustcard after all this time the statements will be coming from TSB not Lloyds.
    Although I wouldn't suggest closing this account due to it's extreme age I would suggest applying somewhere for a more up-to-date rewards or cashback product.
    Last edited by Ben8282; 14-03-2018 at 12:19 AM.
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 14th Mar 18, 8:54 AM
    • 13 Posts
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    wrongplanet
    • #4
    • 14th Mar 18, 8:54 AM
    • #4
    • 14th Mar 18, 8:54 AM
    +zx81 You can only use them by buying vouchers at a 10% discount. A 50 voucher would cost you 45 and 50 points, which is not the same as exchanging them for vouchers.

    According to the leaflet I was sent dated 1/18, current participants are Argos, Currys/PCW, Boots, Leisure Vouchers, House of Fraser, National Garden Gift Vouchers, Mothercare, Debenhams, Waterstones, Halfords, Laithwaite's, WH Smith and Arcadia.
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 14th Mar 18, 9:00 AM
    • 13 Posts
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    wrongplanet
    • #5
    • 14th Mar 18, 9:00 AM
    • #5
    • 14th Mar 18, 9:00 AM
    +Ben8282
    What has this got to do with Lloyds?
    Well for a start my Trustcard statement has the Lloyds Bank logo, name, website and so on, which may suggest it is something to do with them.
    • Dobbibill
    • By Dobbibill 14th Mar 18, 9:29 AM
    • 3,152 Posts
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    Dobbibill
    • #6
    • 14th Mar 18, 9:29 AM
    • #6
    • 14th Mar 18, 9:29 AM
    OP - it's a historic card no longer offered to new customers.

    I don't think a reminder on your statement to exchange your points should lead you to believe they've changed the also historic rewards structure for this particular card.
    Badly worded - possibly but if you've had the trustcard that long and not bothered before, I'm not sure I understand why you are getting frustrated with a small sentence on your statement.
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    • PeacefulWaters
    • By PeacefulWaters 14th Mar 18, 9:34 AM
    • 8,318 Posts
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    PeacefulWaters
    • #7
    • 14th Mar 18, 9:34 AM
    • #7
    • 14th Mar 18, 9:34 AM
    +Ben8282
    Well for a start my Trustcard statement has the Lloyds Bank logo, name, website and so on, which may suggest it is something to do with them.
    Originally posted by wrongplanet
    Yeah, but apart from that?
    • Heng Leng
    • By Heng Leng 14th Mar 18, 12:38 PM
    • 4,556 Posts
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    Heng Leng
    • #8
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:38 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Mar 18, 12:38 PM
    What has this got to do with Lloyds?
    Lloyds and TSB have been separate banks again for years now and Trustcard is an ancient TSB credit card product from pre-Lloyds/TSB days when TSB was known as the Trustee Savings Bank. IF you really do still have a Trustcard after all this time the statements will be coming from TSB not Lloyds.
    Although I wouldn't suggest closing this account due to it's extreme age I would suggest applying somewhere for a more up-to-date rewards or cashback product.
    Originally posted by Ben8282
    To correct part your very abrupt comment...

    The current TSB Bank was actually Lloyds TSB Scotland / TSB Scotland and never previously operated outside Scotland.

    It isn't the previous organisation simply demerged.
    • EarthBoy
    • By EarthBoy 14th Mar 18, 11:38 PM
    • 1,879 Posts
    • 1,174 Thanks
    EarthBoy
    • #9
    • 14th Mar 18, 11:38 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Mar 18, 11:38 PM
    What has this got to do with Lloyds?
    Lloyds and TSB have been separate banks again for years now and Trustcard is an ancient TSB credit card product from pre-Lloyds/TSB days when TSB was known as the Trustee Savings Bank. IF you really do still have a Trustcard after all this time the statements will be coming from TSB not Lloyds.
    Although I wouldn't suggest closing this account due to it's extreme age I would suggest applying somewhere for a more up-to-date rewards or cashback product.
    Originally posted by Ben8282
    Lloyds inherited the TrustCard brand when they merged with the old TSB. Existing customers kept their TrustCards, but they were no longer issued to new customers. After the new TSB was formed, both Lloyds and TSB kept the rights to the TrustCard name, like they both did to several other ex LloydsTSB brands, so existing TrustCards can be from either Lloyds or TSB.
    Last edited by EarthBoy; 15-03-2018 at 12:03 AM.
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 15th Mar 18, 4:55 PM
    • 13 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    wrongplanet
    +Dobbibill TBH I didn't think they'd changed the way you redeemed points but it was worth checking, hence my call to the redemption number.

    Their response to the wording when I read it to them was "Oh, that's a bit optimistic" and they confirmed the scheme had not changed.

    So I called Lloyds CC CS number, expecting something along the lines of 'Oh yes, I see what you mean - it is misleading/badly worded. We'll make sure it doesn't go out again'.

    Instead they came back with what I wrote in the OP - the wording had been approved (at several levels apparently) and wouldn't be changed.

    I do wonder if they actually understood the way the old Trustcard Plus points worked, but with them stating the wording has been 'approved' then it surely must be correct and as a result one should reasonably expect be able to exchange points for vouchers.
    Last edited by wrongplanet; 15-03-2018 at 5:20 PM.
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 29th Mar 18, 2:35 PM
    • 13 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    wrongplanet
    The next statement has arrived and the wording is exactly the same.

    I did suggest they change it to something like "...which you can exchange for a discount on high street vouchers" which got the 'the wording had been approved and wouldn't be changed' response above.
    • However
    • By However 18th Apr 18, 9:13 AM
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    • 5 Thanks
    However
    All I got on my statement (yesterday) was to "Call 0845 603 7132 to redeem your points". That would cost me 6501.60 (for all points) which is more than twice the credit limit on this ancient card, so couldn't be done even if I wanted.

    I recall they threatened to void old points if they hadn't been redeemed by a certain date. This encouragement clearly didn't work because the voiding never happened. I expect nobody did any redeeming becuase the scheme was downgraded to being virtually useless, but equally I expect Lloyds didn't care to carry out their voiding of tens-of-millions of points because their future/potential value of millions of pounds would appear as though written-off in their accounts, and that would raise questions - effectively they would be unilaterally writing off their own debt to someone else and that is a business practice open to challenge.

    Anyway, it's effectively a useless scheme. Lloyds would be better advised to provide a real incentive to get this millstone off their backs - if they cannot bring themselves to provide a direct benefit to their customers, they could at least offer to give the implied customer value (1000 points being worth 100) to charity. Or even send me the value of the rewards in the form of cases of wine.
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 19th Apr 18, 11:03 AM
    • 13 Posts
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    wrongplanet
    +However: Many thanks for picking this up.

    The statement I quoted in the OP was on the first page of my TC statement, on the left below the address under "Your credit card statement...". Does yours the say the same as mine?

    I've looked back through the four years or so of TC of statements on file and can't find an earlier occurrence than on the Feb one and I'm pretty sure I'd have picked up on it had it done.

    In my case the accrued TC+ points would cost me 7050 to 'redeem', which like you is somewhat over my credit limit.

    Yes, I to remember them saying they'd void old points some years back but as you say they didn't carry it out.

    Yes, the scheme is useless as it now stands. It's only the >7k points on the card and the possibility that Lloyds might at some point in the future do the decent thing to that's stopped me cancelling it.

    One way Lloyds could do this would be to transfer any TC+ points over to their equivalent Choice Reward scheme points, which are redeemable for vouchers or cashback. With CR points accruing at 20 per 10 spend vs. 1 per 10 for TC+ this would be 20 for 1.

    Since my last post I've gone back to Lloyds about the second occurrence of the 'can exchange for vouchers' statement.

    The first response was "We are not going to exchange your points for vouchers", followed by them saying that I'd already raised a complaint about this and had it settled. True, but the misleading statement has now been repeated so it's a new complaint.

    Went round this loop a few times until eventually they gave in and, after several 'I'm just talking to..." and a considerable time on hold, it was escalated it to Complaints Central.

    Their line was that my earlier feedback would have been passed on but no one else had raised this matter and they wouldn't change something based on only one complaint (yes, that was what was said). "Even if it's obviously wrong?" I asked and got no answer.

    It was left that I would be called back within 48 hours to check the facts before it is raised at a meeting.

    I suggested that I'd be happy if they honoured their statement to exchange my points for vouchers, which was taken on as "a possibility".

    If you've read this far, if you or anyone else's recent statement has the same wording as mine on the LH of the first page I'd suggest you call the number given and ask for your points to be exchanged for vouchers as stated, raising this to a complaint if refused. The more people who do this the more chance Lloyds may do the decent thing.
    Last edited by wrongplanet; 19-04-2018 at 12:27 PM.
    • Ian011
    • By Ian011 19th Apr 18, 5:50 PM
    • 2,027 Posts
    • 1,187 Thanks
    Ian011
    All I got on my statement (yesterday) was to "Call 0845 603 7132 to redeem your points".
    Originally posted by However
    FCA regulations effective 26 October 2015 have banned the use of 084, 087 or 09 numbers for contact by existing customers.

    The number has in fact changed to 0345 603 7132 and there is a message on the old premium rate 0845 number telling callers to hang up and re-dial the new number.

    Looks like the document template for the statement needs updating.
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 19th Apr 18, 11:05 PM
    • 13 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    wrongplanet
    +Ian011 Well spotted - I'll point that out to them when or more likely if they call me back as promised.

    [Edit] My Lloyds TC card, valid from Feb 2016, has an 0845 customer services number on it too.
    Last edited by wrongplanet; 20-04-2018 at 7:54 AM.
    • wrongplanet
    • By wrongplanet 20th Apr 18, 1:09 PM
    • 13 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    wrongplanet
    Got the promised call just before midday.

    The wording wasn't wrong or misleading on the basis that anyone using the scheme would know how it worked, so my complaint was not upheld.

    Suggested they show the wording to someone unaware of how the scheme worked and ask how they took it to mean the scheme worked, as I have done.
    No, they couldn't possibly do that.

    Suggested that they could have unwittingly changed the terms of the scheme, particularly after insisting the wording was correct.

    Suggested winding up the scheme and transferring points to Choice Rewards at 20:1 for redemption only.
    Unlikely to happen.

    Pointed out the 084... number still being given on CC statements. Yes, this had just been noticed and would be changed.

    Any comments?
    • eskbanker
    • By eskbanker 20th Apr 18, 2:29 PM
    • 7,446 Posts
    • 8,030 Thanks
    eskbanker
    Any comments?
    Originally posted by wrongplanet
    You stated further back that "You can only use them by buying vouchers at a 10% discount. A 50 voucher would cost you 45 and 50 points" and you've asserted that this "is not the same as exchanging them for vouchers", but they could (and presumably do) argue that it is exchanging them for vouchers (50 points equating to 5 worth), even though money has to change hands as well, in much the same way that redeeming Avios for flights also entails making cash payments.

    Either way, it seems to me that you're making a huge issue out of a very narrow semantic point and are doggedly insistent that, just because you choose to read their wording in a different way from them, that means that they're lying, an unnecessarily extreme and dogmatic overreaction!

    But the bottom line is that, short of making impassioned speeches to the European Court of Human Rights or the United Nations, I'm not sure where you think you can go with this?
    • jonesMUFCforever
    • By jonesMUFCforever 20th Apr 18, 6:20 PM
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    jonesMUFCforever
    Well said that man.
    What goes around - comes around
    give lots and you will always receive lots
    • However
    • By However 22nd Apr 18, 9:48 AM
    • 20 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    However
    +However: Many thanks for picking this up.

    The statement I quoted in the OP was on the first page of my TC statement, on the left below the address under "Your credit card statement...". Does yours the say the same as mine?
    Originally posted by wrongplanet
    No. It must be tailored 'info-puff'. I only use mine occasionally to keep it active (a) to have access to the credit if ever needs be (b) in the vain hope the Rewards might become useful. I got a message about the card's interest rate rising because of the BoE rate rise.

    I've essentially written off any benefit from the Rewards scheme. Much the same thing happened with Air Miles - when they changed to Avios, the Air Miles paper vouchers I had (an award from work) became valueless. Then Avios became less useful. And now they're being junked in favour of BA Executive Club - and that scheme, according to a friend, is becoming degraded. Sainbury's has a new pilot for Nectar Cards which seems the dumbest idea for many a moon and will surely result in a big "cannot be bothered" reaction from most sensible people. Nationwide gives the silliest of 'tailored' Simply Rewards - the latest is a single 10% off at The Idle Man - I don't even know what that is or what they do, so I must be doing something right when the big-data harvesters believe they've harvested good data. Subversive or what, eh?

    The days of promotional giveaways have effectively been over for years - best to ignore them all, and instead have a pint at Wetherspoons and put the 2 thus saved into a piggy bank!
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