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Parent in bad way after a failed ESA assessment, need advice

Hello, a few years back my mum was on esa for a while suffering from various mental and physical illnesses such as anxiety, chronic depression, anorexia, insomnia, copd, back pain, body aches, alcoholism and others and needs proper help and failed her assessment around the end of 2016 so subsequently hit rock bottom and tried to take her life and she was admitted in hospital for it overnight and after coming home she had a massive mental breakdown because she didn’t want to drink again so she was taken back in a few days after coming out for a big detox and mental breakdown.

She was in hospital for 8 days and obviously claimed a new esa claim because of how bad she got and after going back and doing another assessment she was put into support group and ever since been trying to get better but it takes time especially after such traumatic events. Now last month on the 26th Aug she failed her assessment and got 0 points partially because certain questions esp regarding her mental health were not asked or were asked/assessed in a way she didn’t understand as she hides/cant be herself around strangers and new places especially as she was off her medication for 3 months prior because they kept mucking up her prescription and asked her to visit gp to redo them etc and as the docs is so far away she gave up as she was too scared to push it so was a bit unfair.

Now she has hit rock bottom again and feels suicidal and is having the dark thoughts, hearing voices, sleep deprivation, all other symptoms and illnesses she suffers from have gone up and she had a breakdown again the other night and dialled 111 and after a long night we saw the doctors the next day who said they would refer her to mental health/crisis team. So the same afternoon they rung her and she couldn’t understand the person or the approach in questions as she needs help with mental issues and he was saying stuff like "have you tried a drugs group etc" so my mum ended up putting down the phone as she got into a state, again because of her mental condition.

We are going for a MR naturally and adding notes from her and me best describing the real conditions and how they effect her ability to work and we argue against many points saying the real picture and she has a 3 month fit note already sent in and that’s pretty much all we have. What we would like to know is who do we contact or how do we go about pushing for proof of her mental and physical conditions like letters or diagnosis for them etc to help fight this and if MR likely fails and we go to tribunal does she satisfy for a basic rate of pay during this as technically its a new claim and without a doubt her conditions have worsened and she believes she has others not previously mentioned so again how can we prove that and who do we push for help as she will try bad things again or end up in hospital for some reason, any and all advice and help appreciated, thanks
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  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,841
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    Does she have any letters from Consultants that she can use? When i've been to see Consultants in the past they've always CC'd me into the letter, which meant i've had a copy as well as my GP. If she doesn't then she can ask her GP if they have anything in her medical records she can use. A fit note won't help her for either the MR or Tribunal. A letter from yourself and a diary from her may help. Does she have a social worker?



    If the MR fails and she takes it to Tribunal once the Tribunal accept her appeal then she'll be able to go back onto assessment rate for ESA, providing she doesn't claim Universal Credit in the mean time. As explained in your previous post.
  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,841
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    It's also worth knowing that the DWP or Tribunal can't take into consideration a worsening of a condition since the date of the decision. They will only take into consideration what she was like at the time of the decision.
  • Thanks for the help poppy and no she doesnt have any consultant letters or anyone like that to help, do you know how we get that help and if thats the case with tribunal we will no doubt do a new claim as she is 100% unfit for work and needs real help, her head is a warzone but we just need ways of proving that and chasing it up. The attempt on her life a few years back is all she has medical wise and has never left her, we also need to prove that but dont know how as it seems were being sent in circles.
  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,841
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    gizzmansl2 wrote: »
    Thanks for the help poppy and no she doesnt have any consultant letters or anyone like that to help, do you know how we get that help and if thats the case with tribunal we will no doubt do a new claim as she is 100% unfit for work and needs real help, her head is a warzone but we just need ways of proving that and chasing it up. The attempt on her life a few years back is all she has medical wise and has never left her, we also need to prove that but dont know how as it seems were being sent in circles.
    As i advised, ask her GP if they have anything in her medical records that she can use.



    As she's in a full UC area then she won't be able to start a new claim for ESA, she'll have to claim UC. Starting a new claim when she has no evidence to continue with the Tribunal seems pointless. The same thing is likely to happen with UC. I'd advise you to contact her local CAB or other disability advice centre for help.



    When claiming LCW with UC with a fit note your work coach doesn't always reduce your work commits to zero and she could very well end up having to attend appointments and look for work for a certain amount of hours per week. If she doesn't do this they she'll be sanctioned, i've heard this so many times. I really wouldn't advise her to go down the UC route. Continue with the MR/Tribunal is my advice.
  • poppy12345 wrote: »
    As i advised, ask her GP if they have anything in her medical records that she can use.



    As she's in a full UC area then she won't be able to start a new claim for ESA, she'll have to claim UC. Starting a new claim when she has no evidence to continue with the Tribunal seems pointless. The same thing is likely to happen with UC. I'd advise you to contact her local CAB or other disability advice centre for help.



    When claiming LCW with UC with a fit note your work coach doesn't always reduce your work commits to zero and she could very well end up having to attend appointments and look for work for a certain amount of hours per week. If she doesn't do this they she'll be sanctioned, i've heard this so many times. I really wouldn't advise her to go down the UC route. Continue with the MR/Tribunal is my advice.

    Dont worry after the help on the previous post we will be pushing tribinal especially as she is deserving of it and we can show that verbally there but just need help and ways to gather evidence and other means.

    Say we do have no choice after tribunal except to start a new claim i heard they still do assessments similar to esa to see your state and ability to work so surely its not too different from esa in that regard or that is surely illegal forcing someone into work without a way to show they cant, goes without saying this is a last resort.
  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,841
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    gizzmansl2 wrote: »
    failed her assessment around the end of 2016
    Can i just check the date here is correct? and that she hasn't recently been found fit for work? If the date is correct here then you're outside the time scale for MR and Tribunal. What has she been claiming since this date?
  • poppy12345 wrote: »
    Can i just check the date here is correct? and that she hasn't recently been found fit for work? If the date is correct here then you're outside the time scale for MR and Tribunal. What has she been claiming since this date?

    Sorry in the end of 2016 she failed so tried to take her... And was hospitalized etc so we went for a new claim and didnt fight the old one and after having an assessment after coming out she got back on and now its happening all over again as she failed this most recent one end of Aug but now we want to obviously fight it to stay on esa.
  • poppy12345
    poppy12345 Posts: 17,841
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    gizzmansl2 wrote: »
    Sorry in the end of 2016 she failed so tried to take her... And was hospitalized etc so we went for a new claim and didnt fight the old one and after having an assessment after coming out she got back on and now its happening all over again as she failed this most recent one end of Aug but now we want to obviously fight it to stay on esa.
    As she's previously been in hospital then surely her GP has letters etc in her medical file that she can use. Any other appointments that she's previously had? Usually Consultants will write a report and send it to the GP. Does she have a social worker?


    I'd advise her to speak to her GP for the medical evidence. She may not be able to get any of that ready in time for the MR but there will be plenty of time to get everything ready for a Tribunal. Waiting times for these are several months and more in some areas.


    Appearing in person for her Tribunal, if she gets this far will give her the best chance of a decision in her favour.
  • poppy12345 wrote: »
    As she's previously been in hospital then surely her GP has letters etc in her medical file that she can use. Any other appointments that she's previously had? Usually Consultants will write a report and send it to the GP. Does she have a social worker?


    I'd advise her to speak to her GP for the medical evidence. She may not be able to get any of that ready in time for the MR but there will be plenty of time to get everything ready for a Tribunal. Waiting times for these are several months and more in some areas.


    Appearing in person for her Tribunal, if she gets this far will give her the best chance of a decision in her favour.

    Thanks for your help poppy, yes your right we will chat to the gp to ask for that but would have thought its so long ago you cant bring it up but as it stands i had a call from mental health team and they are advising things so hopefully we will make leway in getting her well and finding the cause of this so we can maybe use that.

    Do you know at a tribunal if they still do take some sort of new evidence such as the state you can see my mum in worsening conditions or not and if by then we get regular gp/mental health checks the things stated on that, because if all they look at is the evidence they had at the time it makes it a no win situation, what can normally swing favour in your way and how do others suceed when they failed at the assesment and what sort of evidence or things do we need to push for?

    So sorry for all the questions but this is all new to me and im struggling to make sense of some of it but your being so helpful, many thanks
  • So awful for you all. I am going through something similar with my mum. I can highly reccomend looking at https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk there are some free guides but the paid ones are the best. Think it's a £20 yearly subscription which is well worth it with detailed guides around assessment, tribunals etc I couldn't of done it with out it
    Recently married and loving it x
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