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  • FIRST POST
    • MaryTaylor1971
    • By MaryTaylor1971 14th Jun 19, 8:17 PM
    • 15Posts
    • 5Thanks
    MaryTaylor1971
    Cashplus
    • #1
    • 14th Jun 19, 8:17 PM
    Cashplus 14th Jun 19 at 8:17 PM
    Cashplus are becoming a proper bank, does this mean that their card accounts will appear on credit files?
Page 1
    • Ben8282
    • By Ben8282 14th Jun 19, 8:31 PM
    • 3,139 Posts
    • 1,709 Thanks
    Ben8282
    • #2
    • 14th Jun 19, 8:31 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Jun 19, 8:31 PM
    Not the prepaid cards because they are not extending credit.
    • MaryTaylor1971
    • By MaryTaylor1971 14th Jun 19, 8:42 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    MaryTaylor1971
    • #3
    • 14th Jun 19, 8:42 PM
    • #3
    • 14th Jun 19, 8:42 PM
    This is what confuses me, I have a proper bank account with no credit, i.e no overdraft etc, so why does it appear on credit reports ?
    • DCFC79
    • By DCFC79 14th Jun 19, 9:00 PM
    • 34,560 Posts
    • 21,860 Thanks
    DCFC79
    • #4
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:00 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:00 PM
    This is what confuses me, I have a proper bank account with no credit, i.e no overdraft etc, so why does it appear on credit reports ?
    Originally posted by MaryTaylor1971
    What kind of check is it ?
    • johnsmith1890
    • By johnsmith1890 14th Jun 19, 9:12 PM
    • 506 Posts
    • 397 Thanks
    johnsmith1890
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:12 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:12 PM
    This is what confuses me, I have a proper bank account with no credit, i.e no overdraft etc, so why does it appear on credit reports ?
    Originally posted by MaryTaylor1971

    The main reason is financial surveillance. The State and its agencies have taken it upon themselves to have a central record of all bank accounts. This is mostly for the benefit of the police and security services.
    • Blackpool_Saver
    • By Blackpool_Saver 14th Jun 19, 9:15 PM
    • 6,011 Posts
    • 7,631 Thanks
    Blackpool_Saver
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:15 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:15 PM
    The main reason is financial surveillance. The State and its agencies have taken it upon themselves to have a central record of all bank accounts. This is mostly for the benefit of the police and security services.
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890




    ..............................
    Blackpool_Saver is female


    • MaryTaylor1971
    • By MaryTaylor1971 14th Jun 19, 9:16 PM
    • 15 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    MaryTaylor1971
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:16 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:16 PM
    But why aren't these cards monitored, as they operate like a bank account
    • johnsmith1890
    • By johnsmith1890 14th Jun 19, 9:21 PM
    • 506 Posts
    • 397 Thanks
    johnsmith1890
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:21 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:21 PM




    ..............................
    Originally posted by Blackpool_Saver

    Nave in the extreme. Having access to a database of accounts through which money can flow is a vital investigative tool. If the CRAs didn't maintain this list, fraud and serious crime investigations would be hampered.
    • jonesMUFCforever
    • By jonesMUFCforever 14th Jun 19, 9:36 PM
    • 25,897 Posts
    • 13,094 Thanks
    jonesMUFCforever
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:36 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 19, 9:36 PM
    Cashplus are getting a lot of flack at the moment because a lot of scammers seem to be using them.
    If they become a proper bank they will have to tighten their know your customer data considerably.
    What goes around - comes around
    give lots and you will always receive lots
    • eskbanker
    • By eskbanker 15th Jun 19, 12:11 AM
    • 10,600 Posts
    • 13,008 Thanks
    eskbanker
    The main reason is financial surveillance. The State and its agencies have taken it upon themselves to have a central record of all bank accounts. This is mostly for the benefit of the police and security services.
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    Nave in the extreme. Having access to a database of accounts through which money can flow is a vital investigative tool. If the CRAs didn't maintain this list, fraud and serious crime investigations would be hampered.
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    Priceless - you had me going for a moment there, it looked like you were being serious!

    Loving the notion that police and security services would have access to CRA data but not that held by the banks themselves, so all fraudsters would need to do to combat this bombproof scheme would be to route money through savings accounts, prepaid cards, basic bank accounts without overdraft capabilities, etc, that aren't recorded by CRAs because, er, they don't involve credit.

    Obviously the police and security services won't have time for all this anyway as they'll be too busy bumping off princesses and presidents while assisting with the ongoing massive establishment cover-up about the fictitious moon landings and the truth about 9/11.

    Time for you to go back to watching James Bond movies with your tinfoil hat on, methinks....

    P.S. For Mary's benefit, the real reason why full proper bank accounts without arranged overdraft facilities are reported to CRAs is that they can still offer credit via unarranged overdrafts (unlike prepaid cards) so the facility is there even if never used.
    • johnsmith1890
    • By johnsmith1890 15th Jun 19, 1:07 PM
    • 506 Posts
    • 397 Thanks
    johnsmith1890
    Priceless - you had me going for a moment there, it looked like you were being serious!

    Loving the notion that police and security services would have access to CRA data but not that held by the banks themselves, so all fraudsters would need to do to combat this bombproof scheme would be to route money through savings accounts, prepaid cards, basic bank accounts without overdraft capabilities, etc, that aren't recorded by CRAs because, er, they don't involve credit.

    Obviously the police and security services won't have time for all this anyway as they'll be too busy bumping off princesses and presidents while assisting with the ongoing massive establishment cover-up about the fictitious moon landings and the truth about 9/11.

    Time for you to go back to watching James Bond movies with your tinfoil hat on, methinks....

    P.S. For Mary's benefit, the real reason why full proper bank accounts without arranged overdraft facilities are reported to CRAs is that they can still offer credit via unarranged overdrafts (unlike prepaid cards) so the facility is there even if never used.
    Originally posted by eskbanker

    I wish people would do some basic research before pontificating on things they obviously know nothing about. First point - you now need a current account linked to the vast majority - if not all - savings and investment products. So it's very difficult to move money around and have access to it without a current account. You think the government, police, local councils and so on don't have unlimited access to CRA data? Hilarious. Consider the situation of the police urgently wanting to track down someone - I don't know, maybe someone who's told a joke that someone else found offensive - one of the easiest ways of doing this is to look out for credit card and debit card transactions. How does the State know which financial institution(s) the wanted joker is using? Maybe they contact each and every one of the hundreds, or is it thousands, of financial institutions, or maybe the just mosey on over to the CRA databases, where a comprehensive record of address data and all accounts is held?


    As for the ability to get an overdraft on a non-overdraft account. Yes, but not on a regular basis, nor anything large. So it's hardly worth reporting these accounts. But there they all are, listed by the CRAs, updated every month with zero balances. Why isn't it the case that these types of account are only reported if they do actually go into overdraft? On that basis, very many accounts would never be reported. That would potentially make it really difficult for the State to use financial transactions to locate a wanted joker. Just saying .
    • Zanderman
    • By Zanderman 15th Jun 19, 1:12 PM
    • 2,309 Posts
    • 5,155 Thanks
    Zanderman
    I wish people would do some basic research before pontificating on things they obviously know nothing about..
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    Perhaps you could back up your pontifications and tell us about your own research?
    • johnsmith1890
    • By johnsmith1890 15th Jun 19, 1:30 PM
    • 506 Posts
    • 397 Thanks
    johnsmith1890
    Perhaps you could back up your pontifications and tell us about your own research?
    Originally posted by Zanderman

    Just as an example:


    https://www.experian.co.uk/crain/index.html


    See the section headed Public bodies, law enforcement and regulators
    • boo_star
    • By boo_star 15th Jun 19, 4:59 PM
    • 2,036 Posts
    • 1,391 Thanks
    boo_star
    First point - you now need a current account linked to the vast majority - if not all - savings and investment products.
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    Really?

    I just checked Lloyds, Natwest and Barclays and all of them had savings accounts that don't state a current account with them is a requirement and all allow branch deposits and withdrawals so you don't need a current account with anyone else either. If I could be bothered to keep going I expect most bank and building societies offer at least one savings account that doesn't require a current account with them or anyone else.
    • jonesMUFCforever
    • By jonesMUFCforever 15th Jun 19, 8:08 PM
    • 25,897 Posts
    • 13,094 Thanks
    jonesMUFCforever
    Really?

    I just checked Lloyds, Natwest and Barclays and all of them had savings accounts that don't state a current account with them is a requirement and all allow branch deposits and withdrawals so you don't need a current account with anyone else either. If I could be bothered to keep going I expect most bank and building societies offer at least one savings account that doesn't require a current account with them or anyone else.
    Originally posted by boo_star
    Try sending a payment out of a Lloyds savings account online - then you will know why a current account is needed.
    What goes around - comes around
    give lots and you will always receive lots
    • boo_star
    • By boo_star 15th Jun 19, 8:32 PM
    • 2,036 Posts
    • 1,391 Thanks
    boo_star
    Try sending a payment out of a Lloyds savings account online - then you will know why a current account is needed.
    Originally posted by jonesMUFCforever
    I'm not arguing with that, but his claim that almost all savings accounts and investments need a linked current account is complete nonsense.

    But then the claim that the authorities need to ask the CRAs for account details is complete nonsense too so I suppose it's all moot.
    • johnsmith1890
    • By johnsmith1890 15th Jun 19, 9:50 PM
    • 506 Posts
    • 397 Thanks
    johnsmith1890
    I'm not arguing with that, but his claim that almost all savings accounts and investments need a linked current account is complete nonsense.

    But then the claim that the authorities need to ask the CRAs for account details is complete nonsense too so I suppose it's all moot.
    Originally posted by boo_star

    Increasingly you need a current account to operate other accounts, especially online, but while some savings accounts are still completely independent they are massively inconvenient to operate via a branch network, what with needing to go in with identification to make withdrawals - that's if you can find a branch. As for the second 'claim' - who made it? I didn't.
    • eskbanker
    • By eskbanker 16th Jun 19, 10:53 PM
    • 10,600 Posts
    • 13,008 Thanks
    eskbanker
    I wish people would do some basic research before pontificating on things they obviously know nothing about. First point - you now need a current account linked to the vast majority - if not all - savings and investment products. So it's very difficult to move money around and have access to it without a current account.
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    As already pointed out by others, this isn't true, so while the CRAs hold plenty of valuable data, not by any stretch of the imagination are they "a central record of all bank accounts" as you claimed, because of all the accounts that they don't record.

    You think the government, police, local councils and so on don't have unlimited access to CRA data?
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    No, that's not what I was saying at all, I was saying that it's laughable that they'd rely on what is clearly an incomplete picture and that they'd wouldn't have access to underlying bank data if deemed necessary for law enforcement purposes.

    Consider the situation of the police urgently wanting to track down someone - I don't know, maybe someone who's told a joke that someone else found offensive - one of the easiest ways of doing this is to look out for credit card and debit card transactions. How does the State know which financial institution(s) the wanted joker is using? Maybe they contact each and every one of the hundreds, or is it thousands, of financial institutions, or maybe the just mosey on over to the CRA databases, where a comprehensive record of address data and all accounts is held?
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    As above, it's not comprehensive.

    As for the ability to get an overdraft on a non-overdraft account. Yes, but not on a regular basis, nor anything large. So it's hardly worth reporting these accounts. But there they all are, listed by the CRAs, updated every month with zero balances. Why isn't it the case that these types of account are only reported if they do actually go into overdraft? On that basis, very many accounts would never be reported. That would potentially make it really difficult for the State to use financial transactions to locate a wanted joker. Just saying .
    Originally posted by johnsmith1890
    Are you seriously trying to make the case that such routine reporting of accounts that can go into unarranged overdraft somehow endorses your rather odd view of the role of CRAs in law enforcement?
    • EarthBoy
    • By EarthBoy 17th Jun 19, 6:53 AM
    • 2,171 Posts
    • 1,516 Thanks
    EarthBoy
    Try sending a payment out of a Lloyds savings account online - then you will know why a current account is needed.
    Originally posted by jonesMUFCforever
    My Lloyds Standard Saver account allows me to send payments to other people online without having to transfer the money to my current account first. The same with my Halifax Everyday Saver account.
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