Is this financial abuse? or am i over reacting?

thisisme2000 · 12 February 2019 at 10:15AM

post deleted

Doozergirl · 12 February 2019 at 10:29AM

It's not good, is it?

You're trying to justify it saying that it's punishment, but you've not done anything wrong. Even if you had, it's no place for a husband to punish their wife for anything.

These situations always feel 'normal' to those people stuck in them and they can't see it as being wrong because they adjust to it.

If your genuine outgoings are £50 less than your wages then debt crisis is inevitable for you and he should be contributing more. For compariosn, my gas and electric is a little over £100 a month for a decent sized four bed with no cavity wall insulation.

You are supposed to be a partnership - there is no reason why a joint bills account should not work.

Even if he has his own debt crisis (it's possible), he's still abusing your good nature. You are a grown up, trying to take responsibility for your family and having nothing left over for you at all. You have to work together. How can you take responsibility if it isn't shared?

Giving/witholding spending money when you're committed to most of the bills is a form of abuse. Criticising you for having a credit card when you have no other means of spending is awful, taking all your money from you as punishment would be shocking.

I think there's a state of affairs spreadsheet somewhere on this site, maybe someone can link to it for you. It would be a good idea for you to sit together, fill it out and look at your actual outgoings and ratify them.

Even if he refuses, you can do it yourself and look at something approaching the reality of your financial lives. It might be that the whole household is struggling, but you have to know whether he's actually keeping the money 'safe', whether he is spending his own as well, disproportionately, or perhaps even that he's just as financially committed as you are, you just haven't realised it. In any event, the beginning of the solution lies in a proper assessment of your family budget.

Comms69 · 12 February 2019 at 10:29AM

thisisme2000 wrote: »

Hi everyone,

I'm a long term reader of the forum but haven't posted. I am sorry for this Is LONG!!

I'm keen for another perspective on my situation, and given the situation I don't feel I can involve family or friends as they are likely to have a biased opinion.

I'm married for over 7 years, 2 young children. We both work, myself earning around 36k and him about 37k.

Since we bought our current home the mortgage is in my name (as he had an error on his credit file due to an issue with the last house - now resolved but wouldn't be in time for our house purchase) This was 2 years ago.
I also pay the council tax, all of the kids clubs, buy all the kids clothes, I pay a personal loan for a large purchase we made together (I don't want to say what as I feel it may identify me - I know its a big world but I'm nervous re posting this). I take home approx. 1700 - why not £2300ish as it should be? and my essential outgoings are around 1650 - doesn't leave me with much. - A large part of that is presumably the mortgage?
He pays gas, electric and childcare - childcare is less than £200 per month, gas and electric - I don't know how much this is right now. - he must also pay for food; holidays / days out etc?

In our previous home, the mortgage was joint named, my parents gave us a deposit, the bill came out of his account but I paid for the childcare (which was way more than the mortgage at the time as both were at a childminder). I always had to ask him for money before the month ran out and when I think about it now I started to become really low in mood around that time. - Surely sorting this out before moving home would've been the best solution?

Since moving again, I still have to ask him for money at the end of the month. I suggested several times that we should have a bills account and each pay a % of our salary (say50%) into this to cover it and some more for treats or saving etc. For some reason he has never been into the idea. - well at present he's not named on the mortgage; though as you're married that has little impact

I've found it harder and harder to ask him for money each month, so as a result I have been using my credit card, kidding myself on that everything was fine and under control. - this sounds more like an issue you have (you both) with communication, rather than finances I have accumulated some debt, and when I gave myself a kick up the !!! and moved it to a 0% card and cut it up I took a hard look at my finances,( I have secured a new job which I will start soon , its a pay rise with significant benefits, so I will have more income to pay the card off quicker) - I am left with very little at the end of the month and forced to have to ask for "spendies".
He has a personal loan, which he says was accumulated costs from when we last moved, and he took out another to clear it but didn't - he says he has been keeping it "just in case" - I am really not all that sure what this loan was really used for. He know tells me he has been keeping this money, just in case I messed up again (I had debt years ago but paid it off with an inheritance)

I have told him about the credit card, saying that we need to split the household bills as I cant keep pretending that I have more money than I do, and I shouldn't have to ask for money from him, as I find it extremely hard to do this for whatever reason...

His solution is that I should have my salary paid into his bank account as its the only way he can trust me again. - if you are running up secret debt and expecting him to pay it off there is obviously an element of that breach of trust I suggested again a joint account which we both agree a monthly budget for "free spending each" and the rest goes on the necessities or debt/savings. He says he would feel better if it was all in his account. He will transfer me an allowance weekly or monthly and he will control the rest. - If you are happy with that, go for it (though better if you get it paid to your account and transfer it yourself); if you're not happy, don't

In my gut this feels very wrong, however I know I betrayed his trust by spending on my credit card and maybe this is the only way I will have his trust again.
On the other hand, I am a grown woman who made a mistake, realised it and is rectifying it within my means - how am I expected to survive on such a small amount each month? - you rectified it previously from an inheritance, and this time by asking him. That's not with-in your own means

Is this the punishment for messing up? should I just get on with it? - up to you. I wouldn't. But it sounds like your marriage is pretty shaky; so which is more important?

A quick Google search tells me that anyone who demands you hand over your salary - he isn't demanding this , doesn't pay half of the household bills - literally millions of people don't pay half the bills (mostly women...) , makes you ask for money - he isn't making you ask for money. This is just a crap relationship but freely spends on themselves are portraying financial abuse, or at the very least bullying...? - no. Maybe I am "catastrophising" I do know I have made mistakes.

If your still reading - thanks!
If you have time Id really appreciate an opinion

You need to decide what's more important; your marriage or your principles. (personally I'd take principles everytime)

DigForVictory · 12 February 2019 at 10:34AM

My lasting power of attorney includes several medical tests before the control of my income is taken from me.

I suggest you ask him to help you find another solution.

paddy's_mum · 12 February 2019 at 10:47AM

He is, in my opinion, on dodgy ground making part of this into a trust issue when he is not telling you where his money is going and has himself had debts in the past!

The only way to resolve this is by sitting down and communicating properly with one another - communicating as in the open passing of accurate information not just blah-blah-blah.

I note that you both work but are housework, garden and car care etc equally shared?

Is your husband silently resentful that his name is not on the mortgage despite the previous 'glitch' situation now being resolved?

In your shoes, I would be insisting on a day where the kids are at Grandma's house so that the two members of this partnership can sit down, communicate honestly and together find a better way forward.

And no, I would not be putting my salary into his account under just about any circumstances. I would not willingly leave myself penniless and dictated to.

Your suggestion of a separate account for necessary household spending is, in my view, a much more reasoned and sensible way forward.

Good luck but if he will not compromise, you may have to stop paying some essential bill until he is willing to listen, discuss and think.

onomatopoeia99 · 12 February 2019 at 10:49AM

I'm concerned you earn £36,000/year, which is £3,000/month, but only take home £1,700. This is, quite simply, wrong, tax and national insurance on what you are should be hundreds less than that so unless you are paying an absolute fortune into a workplace pension (that you clearly can't afford to) your works payroll is making a colossal error with your earnings.

The pair of you need to talk openly about money, all aspects of it, with all information on the table and reach an agreement which deals with your unsecured debts and is equitable to both. Your problem in your marriage seems to mostly be communication.

trailingspouse · 12 February 2019 at 10:50AM

You used your credit card rather than asking him for more money. This sends alarm bells ringing straight away.

He also has loans that you aren't entirely surely what they paid for. More alarm bells.

You need to insist that you both sit down and talk about money. And if he won't? For me, the alarm bells would be ringing so loud I would have to get out.

You've read about Financial Abuse - so now that you know what Financial Abuse looks like, and you've compared it to your situation, what do you think is happening?

Please don't kid yourself that it is punishment that is in any way justified. It's all about control. He wants it. And it's convenient for him if you think that the punishment is justified because it will make you more likely to put up with it. It isn't, and you shouldn't.

And him wanting your salary paid into his account? No, No, No. Joint account, maybe.

Broadyx · 12 February 2019 at 10:52AM

1700 take home is approx. 26k - i wonder if it was a typo.

Comms69 · 12 February 2019 at 10:52AM

onomatopoeia99 wrote: »

I'm concerned you earn £36,000/year, which is £3,000/month, but only take home £1,700. This is, quite simply, wrong, tax and national insurance on what you are should be hundreds less than that so unless you are paying an absolute fortune into a workplace pension (that you clearly can't afford to) your works payroll is making a colossal error with your earnings.

The pair of you need to talk openly about money, all aspects of it, with all information on the table and reach an agreement which deals with your unsecured debts and is equitable to both. Your problem in your marriage seems to mostly be communication.

Agreed it's £600 less than what she should be getting. (basically too much for a workplace pension)

thisisme2000 · 12 February 2019 at 10:57AM

My take home is less due to pension 9.5% and I have a company car deducted from my salary

pinknsparkly · 12 February 2019 at 11:02AM

I wouldn't say that is financial control if you are happy with the arrangement (and many people are - my husband for example puts almost all his salary into our joint account and I deal with all finances. The only difference between our situation and yours is that we are in complete agreement and it is done using a joint account which he has access to, if he ever cared to look!!). However, you are NOT happy with the arrangement. Plus I'd be nervous about these two loans he's got - it doesn't sound like he's telling you the full story with them. Whether that's because he doesn't want to upset you (by telling you exactly why he doesn't trust you financially) or because he's got them for some other reason (such as personal debts that's he racked up). But personally I'd be very nervous about handing over all my money and having no control or knowledge how it was spent, especially if it's being use to pay off debt I didn't know anything about until recently.... You really need to sit down and have a calm, rational discussion about what is important to the both of you and from there find a solution that works.

Is this financial abuse? or am i over reacting?

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