PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING
Hello Forumites! In order to help keep the Forum a useful, safe and friendly place for our users, discussions around non-MoneySaving matters are not permitted per the Forum rules. While we understand that mentioning house prices may sometimes be relevant to a user's specific MoneySaving situation, we ask that you please avoid veering into broad, general debates about the market, the economy and politics, as these can unfortunately lead to abusive or hateful behaviour. Threads that are found to have derailed into wider discussions may be removed. Users who repeatedly disregard this may have their Forum account banned. Please also avoid posting personally identifiable information, including links to your own online property listing which may reveal your address. Thank you for your understanding.Buying out my ex - disagreeing over Declaration of Trust
Options
Comments
-
Sorry to say that really does look bad.
However, in your shoes I would go back to the original solicitor who drew the deed up and complain that it does not appear to protect your interest and ask for their free advice.
Ideally you would like them to act on your behalf (for free) to ensure that your interests are protected. If they will not then I would raise a complaint with the regulator as it may be that you can show that they have not acted to the necessary standard.
Your best argument whether you contest directly with you ex or seek compensation through the regulator is that no reasonable person would read that deed and believe, based upon the circumstances of the transaction, that it was the desired outcome. Unfortunately to try for any compensation I suspect you'd need to complete the transaction and realise your loss.
I'm not sure I can offer any better thoughts but maybe others will.0 -
Thank you j2009, that's still really very helpful (even though it's a rubbish situation!). I had to chase the original solicitors for 2 weeks with emails and phone calls to get them to look at it and then they only looked at the figures so I've been a bit stuck trying to figure it out myself. So at least I now know where the problem is, and how I can approach it. I'll speak to the original solicitors on Monday and do as you suggest. It also makes me really sad that my ex knows that he's getting more than he's entitled to, and what the intention was, but is still insisting on it. I guess you never really know what someone is like until something like this happens.0
-
I think you need to speak to an independent solicitor. Try to find a solicitor who practices in the area of property litigation and see if you can get some initial advice.
It should not be expensive or difficult for an independent solicitor to advise you on how the agreement should be interpreted, and on whether the drafting is ambiguous or not.
I wouldn't bother following up with the original solicitors. They are not likely to be particularly helpful. And if they are just conveyancers they may not be property litigators.0 -
Ideally you would like them to act on your behalf (for free) to ensure that your interests are protected. If they will not then I would raise a complaint with the regulator as it may be that you can show that they have not acted to the necessary standard.
Personally I would suggest that the Op's time and energy is better spent on getting independent advice, rather than on having a fight with her former conveyancers. I'm sure the fight with the ex is more than enough.
If the independent solicitor advisers that the conveyancers were negligent or that the drafting does not do what it is supposed to do, the Op can look at taking up a complaint at a later date.0 -
My reading of that is that he is entitled to that % if you agree to sell to a third party, it does not apply on a transfer of equity between you, otherwise it is silent.
I think you should push back and tell him to do one.0 -
tryingtobemoresavvy wrote: »Hello, I am a first-time poster, but I have been a long-time reader of the advice in these forums. I hope this is the right place to post this to get some help!
We are also going through some party wall issues with the neighbours who are planning works (this is in hand with surveyors but is the worst timing in the world) so I do not believe we can sell until this is resolved (it’s also likely to cost us a contribution to strengthen the proposed works). I don’t know how long this will be but living together is terrible. He wants me to buy him out immediately, he does not want to wait for a sale, although I plan to sell the house as soon as the party wall works are concluded (I don’t want to remain here).
His brother is a lawyer and has advised this, as well as being the one to respond to emails that I have written him explaining the calculations.
He disagrees, as this would give him less. He did say that might have been the intent, but it was worded wrong and so he wants to follow the wording. He says the Declaration should have said my deposit was taken out first and it doesn’t, so I lose out.
He thinks I’ll get a big windfall when I sell next year, but I pointed out that after all the costs (party wall and his share plus all my contributions to date), I would actually lose money, so he said I should keep the house for ten years and sell then!
The Declaration of Trust does not state whether these shares apply to ownership or equity. I have gone back to the solicitors who drew up the Declaration, and they have stated the figures are correct, but have not yet responded regarding the wording, nor whether the shares apply to ownership or equity. He said I shouldn’t waste money on legal advice (which he’s getting for free from his brother), I should just pay him so he can move out tomorrow, and that any court would follow the wording of the Declaration and not care about the stated relative contributions or the intent, so I would lose and have to pay his costs as well. He said I could pursue a claim for the difference against the solicitor who drew up the Declaration.
While I am waiting to hear back from the solicitors, it is horrible here and I don’t know what to do. I can afford to take on the remaining mortgage (I have been speaking to the mortgage broker who arranged our mortgage), but I cannot afford to pay him what he wants as well as whatever may be required for the party wall, and I am upset at the prospect of losing quite a lot of the deposit I put in so he can profit from it. He flatly disagrees with my interpretation and insists on his, so we have reached an impasse. He has said if we don’t agree and sort it out, terrible things will happen (but hasn’t said what those are). Please, does anyone have any advice?
Welcome to MSE.
He can want and insist any amount of hot air. His brother must have told him he cannot actually force anything quickly or easily. So they are trying to bully and harrass you into making poor snap financial decisions. He has nothing else but hot air.
One of you can move out, the other can take in a lodger to make that work financially until the party wall stuff is resolved. Then sell. In the mean time get independent legal advice.
For now do not listen, do not respond, do not engage. Or use the 'broken record technique'. Same short phrase over and over and over whatever he says.
Turn away, walk away, run away, move away so he cannot verbally bully and manipulate you. You are stronger and smarter than he is. And you have MSE on your team. :money:
(((hugs)))Declutterbug-in-progress.⭐️⭐️⭐️ ⭐️⭐️0 -
Major failure on the DOT.
We see this a lot on here some including solicitors don't have a clue how to get these right.
Apart from the financial details being a mess there are no trigger clauses to cause a sale.
No clauses to determine costs if a party moves out dies or moves a different partner in.
The financial clauses 1, 1.1, 1.2 is a % of net proceeds.
Not a good agreement.0 -
Thanks everyone, all this advice and support means a lot. I thought we were doing the right thing at the time by getting a DoT but have now learned that you need to get legal advice on your legal advice! I have got some recommendations for other solicitors who've done this kind of thing for family/friends so I will speak to an independent solicitor and find out what to do next. I will tell him I am not agreeing to anything until I do this, so he just has to wait. I really don't want to move out because we have a lot of animals, none of which he wants, so I need to be sure they are taken care of, plus the house is full of my furniture and possessions (previously bought or inherited from my late granny), there's actually only a few big-ticket items we bought together as part of the equal-split improvements. So there's so much in here that means something to me and I really worry about it leaving it all with him. And he says he refuses to move out until he 'gets what he deserves'. I think he deserves something quite different to £48,000!0
-
He is jointly liable for the debt on the mortgage until he is removed from the mortgage.
Do you think you will be able to take the mortgage on in your sole name? If the lender doesn't agree then he can whine and complain all he wants, he ain't coming off that mortgage until the property is sold.
Might give you a bit of breathing room.
Also, if you buy uim out now as you are unable to sell, who is liable for sales fees when you can sell?
Unless you are to blame for relationship breakdown and you are trying to make good, there is no point in putting yourself in a worse financial position until you agree ready0 -
tryingtobemoresavvy wrote: »We didn't take independent legal advice separately - we paid for the DoT to be drawn up (included in the fees split), and provided all the figures so they could do that. I thought that would be enough - clearly I should also have paid a second solicitor to check it!
Normally the solicitor drafting the DOT will recommend that one party does seek independent advice. In order that any advice can be given to the other if impartiality is required.
A DOT is a legal document which binds the court should adjudication be required. Too late to say I meant something else.
How much influence did your ex have in the drafting of the DOT. Solicitors are there to follow their clients instructions.0
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 343.2K Banking & Borrowing
- 250.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
- 449.7K Spending & Discounts
- 235.3K Work, Benefits & Business
- 608K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
- 173.1K Life & Family
- 247.9K Travel & Transport
- 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
- 15.9K Discuss & Feedback
- 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards