Bitcoin account compromised. Bank refuse to refund.
Comments
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Looking at it from the bank's perspective, this was a transfer to an electronic money account owned by the OP, an existing payee, and completed using the OP's internet connection. The money was then transferred from that external account. After which, the customer calls them and asks to be refunded.
In a parallel universe a customer transfers some money to Coinbase and it gets stolen because unknown to him, his account was compromised and cyber criminals were waiting patiently for money to arrive in the account. In this scenario he has no recourse against the bank.
Tough for any observer to tell these scenarios apart.0 -
I was meaning in the more general legal sense of the burden of proof in civil, rather than criminal, cases.Actually it's much closer to 'beyond reasonable doubt'. The guidelines say banks need to prove either gross negligence or authorisation. There's no absolute guidance on what the threshold is, but experience says its very high, much more than balance of probabilities.
Indeed, it's agreed that the burden of proof is on the banks, but my point was that (as in situations like this one), if a customer disputes the bank's version of events then there's not much hard evidence that they can cite to counter the bank's story.Generally, customers don't need to prove anything. They get a refund unless the bank has proof it was their fault.0 -
I've spoken to the bank again and they have said: The device is different but IP is the same. They have asked me to provide proof from my ISP or Coinbase than either were compromised before they can challenge it.0
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I was meaning in the more general legal sense of the burden of proof in civil, rather than criminal, cases.
This isn't a civil or a criminal case, though. It's a decision made by the bank and regulated by the FCA.0 -
So they have the MAC address of the device?
Having a dynamic IP means nothing - my VM connection is with a Dynamic IP and ive has the same IP for nigh-on 3+ years and many router reboots and power outages.
I always get the same IP address back.
Only by changing your router are you likely to get a different public IP address.0 -
The 'different device' was probably surmised from the lack of a cookie saved from a previous login. Some banks put such logins through an additional security question.0
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They never mentioned a MAC address they told me that the IP was the same but device different. Haven't a clue what that means0
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Ok every device in the Universe has a unique MAC address hard to believe I know but it is true
so basically your computer will have a Mac address and the device used to access the account also have a Mac address
if you can get that from the bank it will at least prove it wasn't your computer0 -
Ok every device in the Universe has a unique MAC address hard to believe I know but it is true
so basically your computer will have a Mac address and the device used to access the account also have a Mac address
if you can get that from the bank it will at least prove it wasn't your computer
If the payment was sent using a phone app, it's possible the app sends the MAC to the bank. But a web browser doesn't have access to the MAC address, so if the payment was done through web-based internet banking then the bank must be making inferences about the device using cookies (as masonic says) or perhaps browser fingerprinting.0 -
Just found out that it was done over Windows PC.0
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