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What do you think about letting agent fees? MPs want to hear from you

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  • Jeremy1960
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    The issue that I as a landlord and letting agent have is that these forums only ever attract the aggrieved never the content!
    As a landlord of 20+ years I have never had 1 tenant complain about the cost of renting, the fees or my properties. As an agent of 25+ years I cannot recall a single tenant walking away because of fees, my office arranges 100+ tenancies a year, it is a miniscule number who are aggrieved, government would be better to use their efforts to enforce the hundreds of bits of current legislation, overnight if they did the market would sort itself out! So many agents ignore legislation such as displaying fees because they can get away with it.
    On a couple of points on this forum, renewal fees, these are charged as there is work involved, it is not as simple as just printing a piece of paper! Tenants should pay reference fees as it is they who need to show their worth, remove the fees and the not so squeaky clean or easy to process tenants will lose out! Time is money, let all the people who want to ban fees take a 20% reduction in pay and see how they like it because that's what this ban will amount to. Rents will rise, not maybe initially or for new tenants but existing tenants will pay dearly for the folly of pandering to organisations such as shelter.
    You reap what you sow - BEWARE!
  • agrinnall
    agrinnall Posts: 23,344 Forumite
    First Post Combo Breaker
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    Jeremy1960 wrote: »

    You reap what you sow - BEWARE!

    I have one word for you Jeremy (and to be fair, it's the same word that I always use when this argument is put forward) - Scotland!
  • volare11512
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    If you use a highstreet job agency I doubt you would pay a holding fee for the job, admin fees for the paperwork + arranging interviews, another fee for organising your references nor some other fee where you are asked to contribute towards office space, lighting, heating... etc.

    Letting agents became too greedy and have now shot themselves in the foot. This debate will show just how much MPs are there to serve the people as 1 in 5 are landlords!
  • tom9980
    tom9980 Posts: 1,990 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary I've helped Parliament
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    As a landlord I have never charged tenants hidden fees I have only previously asked for referencing fees at cost. I have now also decided to stop charging referencing fees and charge no fees at all. Yes that now means my tenants should expect my rents to stay closer to market levels rather than below those rates but I can afford this because I cut out agents from the equation and refuse to use them.

    I would also support landlord licensing as long as the fee only covers the costs of the councils work. Ideally this would be renewable every 5 years and all the landlords property would be inspected during the process to ensure they meet minimum standards. The added benefit of licensing would allow hmrc to find all those tax dodging landlords.

    I am not adverse to tenants enjoying a bit more security of tenure either however big changes need to be made in how troublesome tenants are evicted, currently the average time to evict through the courts is 40+ weeks, this needs to be slashed to 12 weeks. This for me is the biggest problem landlords face and causes perfectly decent tenants many problems finding decent homes because of how risk adverse you need to be selecting a new tenant.
    When using the housing forum please use the sticky threads for valuable information.
  • Risingholm
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    As you can see, this is my first post and I am giving my opinion on this particular subject.

    I am a letting agent in Devon, my managed portfolio stands at almost 300 and I carry out 'tenant find' rentals also.

    Most of the local agents charge agency administration fees of circa £350 to £500 on top of then the first months rent and deposit. My firm charges just £204 (£170 plus VAT) for the property and that includes referencing on all adult tenants, all the paperwork, written & photographic inventory, check-in and check-out. My firm carries out it's own referencing and does not use a 'call centre' agency.

    As an agent, I would be happy to see agency administration fee's capped.

    An interesting point to make, I saw someone mention agencies charge between 10% and 15% of monthly rent.....really? here the average rate is 8% and even that gets undercut from time to time.
  • Guest101
    Guest101 Posts: 15,764 Forumite
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    Jeremy1960 wrote: »
    The issue that I as a landlord and letting agent have is that these forums only ever attract the aggrieved never the content! - Happy and content people rarely need advice....
    As a landlord of 20+ years I have never had 1 tenant complain about the cost of renting - Very few do to their LL , the fees - depends on how reasonable your fees are (I still don't understand how you are both a LL and LA, unless you're agent to other LLs) or my properties. As an agent of 25+ years I cannot recall a single tenant walking away because of fees - usually because they need somewhere to live, crazy I know! , my office arranges 100+ tenancies a year - one every 3 days? One man band? , it is a miniscule number - it is indeed. who are aggrieved, government would be better to use their efforts to enforce the hundreds of bits of current legislation, overnight if they did the market would sort itself out! So many agents ignore legislation such as displaying fees because they can get away with it. - really? that's the legislation you're concerned with?
    On a couple of points on this forum, renewal fees, these are charged as there is work involved, it is not as simple as just printing a piece of paper! - you're right, you have to change the date too. Don't try it on here, many posters will have a better knowledge than you. Tenants should pay reference fees as it is they who need to show their worth - what a load of cobblers. The checks for tenancy are for the LLs benefit, you work for the LL. , remove the fees and the not so squeaky clean or easy to process tenants will lose out! -why? Time is money, let all the people who want to ban fees take a 20% reduction in pay and see how they like it because that's what this ban will amount to. - boohoo Rents will rise - evidence? in Scotland they didn't. , not maybe initially or for new tenants but existing tenants will pay dearly for the folly of pandering to organisations such as shelter.
    You reap what you sow - BEWARE!


    Which letting agency do you run? If you stand by your convictions you wont mind naming yourself
  • Guest101
    Guest101 Posts: 15,764 Forumite
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    Risingholm wrote: »
    As you can see, this is my first post and I am giving my opinion on this particular subject.

    I am a letting agent in Devon, my managed portfolio stands at almost 300 and I carry out 'tenant find' rentals also. - decent number. quick search on RM suggest a 2 bed is approx. £600 per month, so we'll use that as an average. That should give you a turnover of £216,000 per year in management fees at the lower end of 10%.

    Most of the local agents charge agency administration fees of circa £350 to £500 on top of then the first months rent and deposit. My firm charges just £204 (£170 plus VAT) for the property - interesting... and that includes referencing on all adult tenants - for the landlord , all the paperwork - for the landlord, written & photographic inventory - for the landlord, check-in and check-out - for the landlord. My firm carries out it's own referencing and does not use a 'call centre' agency. - you are charging the tenant for a service for the landlord....

    As an agent, I would be happy to see agency administration fee's capped.

    An interesting point to make, I saw someone mention agencies charge between 10% and 15% of monthly rent.....really? here the average rate is 8% and even that gets undercut from time to time.



    I'll lower my above figure given you say it's 8% (usually it's more)= £172,800


    For a stand alone business which requires no more than two employees that seems pretty decent
  • Guest101
    Guest101 Posts: 15,764 Forumite
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    tom9980 wrote: »
    As a landlord I have never charged tenants hidden fees I have only previously asked for referencing fees at cost. I have now also decided to stop charging referencing fees and charge no fees at all. Yes that now means my tenants should expect my rents to stay closer to market levels rather than below those rates but I can afford this because I cut out agents from the equation and refuse to use them.

    I would also support landlord licensing as long as the fee only covers the costs of the councils work. Ideally this would be renewable every 5 years and all the landlords property would be inspected during the process to ensure they meet minimum standards. The added benefit of licensing would allow hmrc to find all those tax dodging landlords.

    I am not adverse to tenants enjoying a bit more security of tenure either however big changes need to be made in how troublesome tenants are evicted, currently the average time to evict through the courts is 40+ weeks, this needs to be slashed to 12 weeks. This for me is the biggest problem landlords face and causes perfectly decent tenants many problems finding decent homes because of how risk adverse you need to be selecting a new tenant.

    Whilst I agree with you, the problem is the courts are too busy to accommodate this.
  • Tom54*
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    If I apply for a mortgage I undergo thorough checks to ensure that I will be able to meet the monthly payments. I pay the lender an application fee to cover the work involved. Monthly rent payments can be very similar to mortgage payments, often more, and it is right that care is taken to verify the applicant’s ability to meet the financial commitment involved. Is it not unreasonable to have to pay for this service?
    We process around 200 applications per year in our office. We cannot recall the last time a prospective tenant complained about our fees. They seem to understand the process and that there is a reasonable charge for the service. We don’t charge for check-in or check-out but do charge for renewal to reflect the administrative work involved (which is not simply printing out a document).
    Tenant fees represent around 15-20% of our income. In a highly competitive market it is unlikely that landlords will accept much in the way of fee increases. There will certainly be job losses. In an already difficult post-Brexit market with low transaction levels in sales, some mixed service agents will go to the wall.
    Tenants will no longer be clients of ours in any way. We will continue to try to represent their interests as far as we can and to act as a buffer between landlord and tenant when things get difficult, but many agents will no longer bother. There will be a power shift towards landlords.
    Having just conducted a survey of tenant fees amongst our competitors we have been in one or two cases a little shocked at what is being charged for, and how much. I would have to say that the worst offenders (not exclusively but by and large) on our patch are the corporates. We would support a cap on fees.
  • Guest101
    Guest101 Posts: 15,764 Forumite
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    Tom54* wrote: »
    If I apply for a mortgage I undergo thorough checks to ensure that I will be able to meet the monthly payments. I pay the lender an application fee to cover the work involved. Monthly rent payments can be very similar to mortgage payments, often more, and it is right that care is taken to verify the applicant’s ability to meet the financial commitment involved. - apples and oranges. Is it not unreasonable to have to pay for this service? - depends for who's benefit the checks are done.
    We process around 200 applications per year in our office. - are you, yet another, letting agent? We cannot recall the last time a prospective tenant complained about our fees. - because they want to rent a property. But here you go: I'm complaining about your fees. Now you can recall it. They seem to understand the process and that there is a reasonable charge for the service. - the service for the landlord?.... We don’t charge for check-in or check-out but do charge for renewal to reflect the administrative work involved (which is not simply printing out a document). - no you also need to change the date.
    Tenant fees represent around 15-20% of our income. - which means they're too high.... In a highly competitive market it is unlikely that landlords will accept much in the way of fee increases. - unless all agencies do it? hmm... There will certainly be job losses. - oh no.... In an already difficult post-Brexit - that's marketing 101 by the way. On june 24th, marketing managers popped several corks of champagne knowing that any price rise was 'linked to brexit'. market with low transaction levels in sales, some mixed service agents will go to the wall. - oh no...
    Tenants will no longer be clients of ours in any way. - your client is the landlord. That's basic agency law. We will continue to try to represent their interests as far as we can - then you are breaking the law. and to act as a buffer between landlord and tenant when things get difficult - literally that is NOT your job. You MUST protect the Landlords interest at all times. , but many agents will no longer bother. There will be a power shift towards landlords. - so they will do the right thing?
    Having just conducted a survey of tenant fees amongst our competitors we have been in one or two cases a little shocked at what is being charged for, and how much. I would have to say that the worst offenders (not exclusively but by and large) on our patch are the corporates. We would support a cap on fees.
    Perhaps you can go on a course which explains basic agency law first?.....


    Kev - this is why the sector needs regulating!
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