Pendin Payment Gotcha

bwallx · 12 May 2018 at 8:44AM

I recently cancelled an Amazon order which was confirmed by both Amazon and the supplier. Looking at my bank online I found a pending payment in the amount of that order. This reduced the amount available on my account.

After a lot of tooing and froing I discovered that within ten minutes of placing my order, amazon obtained authorisation from my bank for the sum required and the bank then set aside this sum as a pending payment. Amazon said that upon me cancelling the order, they sent Barclays authorisation to cancel the payment but it could take a week for it to be actioned. A week during which I had no access to my money.

I rang Barclays and they said they would immediately put the money back into my account but that as they had given Amazon authority to take the money originally, this still stood and the bank would only refund the money on the understanding that Amazon could, at anytime, still take it.

This was all news to me. It is fair enough that Amazon would confirm funds were available before processing the order but for the bank to take it out of my account, and keep it out of my account despite Amazon sending official notification of cancellation beggars belief.

If I hadn't checked and called Barclays, how long would I have been out of pocket?

molerat · 12 May 2018 at 8:55AM

7-10 days usually. That is how the banking system works. You were not out of pocket, the money was still in your account and, if applicable, still earning interest.

bwallx · 12 May 2018 at 9:19AM

No it wasn't in my account. I couldn't spend it. Yet I hadn't bought anything or got anything to show for it. And as it doesn't show in my account it can't earn interest can it?

18cc · 12 May 2018 at 9:32AM

This is a problem with pre authorisations and ASDA for example have been in the headlines recently for reserving £99 at petrol pumps, and there's a story today about delta Airlines doing a reservation of £2,400 and then taking another £2,400 whilst the original reservation had not dropped off the card

This is the problem that nobody seems to be addressing technology wise it shouldn't take 7 to 10 days to release an authorisation

in your case they hadnt actually taken money but the 'available balance' had decreased and yes you would not be earning interest on that

the only way around it at the moment I fear is to use a credit card rather than debit card because hopefully by the end of the month it will all have evened up when it comes to pay

brewerdave · 12 May 2018 at 9:41AM

18cc wrote: »

This is a problem with pre authorisations and ASDA for example have been in the headlines recently for reserving £99 at petrol pumps, and there's a story today about delta Airlines doing a reservation of £2,400 and then taking another £2,400 whilst the original reservation had not dropped off the card

This is the problem that nobody seems to be addressing technology wise it shouldn't take 7 to 10 days to release an authorisation

I've noticed that this happens quite frequently with some retailers ,notably Lidl -fortunately for relatively small amounts - don't THINK it has taken 7-10 days tho' -normally 3 or so days.
Also had a problem where the retailer (Buyology) said that the transaction hadn't gone thru' -repeated the transaction 3 times before the sales assistant was happy but all 3 were actually authorised (altho' only one was finally charged):(

bwallx · 12 May 2018 at 9:51AM

What's galling is that the order was never even dispatched. The supplier saw that the last remaining item was damaged and told Amazon and the order was cancelled immediately. Amazon made much of saying it never took my money. Technically not true!! They deprived me of my money which is the same thing.

bwallx · 12 May 2018 at 9:53AM

Amazon wrote me:
We are sorry for the confusion this situation has created. Further to your query, I have checked your account and I can confirm that you have not been charged whatsoever with regards to the order 404-1083034-9918766 as it has been cancelled.

When you place an order in Amazon.es, we contact your payment card's issuing bank to confirm that your card has a valid number, and has not been reported as lost or stolen. This is communicated via a full authorization for the amount of the purchase. However, we do not actually proceed with the charge. This is simply one of the security measures that we use to protect our customers and this is why your bank statement currently shows this amount related to the aforementioned order.

While most card issuers release authorizations within 7-10 business days, this time may vary from one company to the next. You may need to contact your card issuer if you want to have the authorization(s) removed sooner ......

molerat · 12 May 2018 at 9:54AM

18cc wrote: »

in your case they hadnt actually taken money but the 'available balance' had decreased and yes you would not be earning interest on that

If the amount has not been taken from the actual balance then you would still be earning interest on it. Some time ago Santander were taken to task for this and had to pay the missing interest to customers.

The big problem is the antiquated back systems being used by the banks with every new idea being tacked onto this system. Amazon asked the bank if they could have the money, bank said yes we will hold onto it for you - here is the authorisation. Bank waits for Amazon to take money on that authorisation, if they do not claim it after 7 days it drops off and they have to try again if they still want it. To release the hold earlier takes manual intervention and by the time that gets to the top of someones to do list it has naturally timed out.

18cc · 12 May 2018 at 10:11AM

Yes molerat that is a good summary.

Until somebody gets their act together this will continue to be a problem

as I said before the workaround is to use a credit card but I appreciate that might not be what everybody wants to use

From the Amazon side in their defence they have to check at the time of order placing that the funds are available to pay for it. that is why they put a Hold on the funds. once the item is dispatched they should then take the payment and release the hold all in one transaction (I believe they match up the transaction ID or something like that).

if an order is cancelled Amazon simply release the hold. I suppose in their defence they cannot control how long it takes the card issuer and the bank to actually process that release

Dobbibill · 12 May 2018 at 11:29AM

bwallx wrote: »

No it wasn't in my account. I couldn't spend it. Yet I hadn't bought anything or got anything to show for it. And as it doesn't show in my account it can't earn interest can it?

The money was still in your account as it was only pending. Quite similar to when you pay a cheque in your balance increases but until the cheque is cleared you cannot spend the funds.

The account balance is what determines what interest you can earn. If it was the available balance many of us would have accounts with large overdrafts and a small balance to earn the maxmimum interest allowed.

The bank has to tell you Amazon 'could' still take the money as your purchase agreement is with Amazon and the bank releasing the pending funds doesn't change that.

The process does need to brought up to speed so to speak as waiting x amount of days is not always practical and our technology should be able to process things much faster than that - maybe that will be something they look at collectively with the recent media coverage around pay at pump.

deadendwaterfall · 12 May 2018 at 1:56PM

18cc wrote: »

This is a problem with pre authorisations and ASDA for example have been in the headlines recently for reserving £99 at petrol pumps, and there's a story today about delta Airlines doing a reservation of £2,400 and then taking another £2,400 whilst the original reservation had not dropped off the card

This is the problem that nobody seems to be addressing technology wise it shouldn't take 7 to 10 days to release an authorisation

in your case they hadnt actually taken money but the 'available balance' had decreased and yes you would not be earning interest on that

the only way around it at the moment I fear is to use a credit card rather than debit card because hopefully by the end of the month it will all have evened up when it comes to pay

So say for example I only had £2500 of funds, then spent the amount you mentioned with Delta Airlines, would that mean I'd end up with a huge unauthorised overdraft or would the transaction just be refused on the basis I didn't have enough to take off whilst the original reservation hadn't yet dropped off?

Pendin Payment Gotcha

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