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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Gary
    • By MSE Gary 24th Sep 19, 10:13 AM
    • 4Posts
    • 2Thanks
    MSE Gary
    Waiters/restaurant workers (especially in chains) - tell us, who gets the tips?
    • #1
    • 24th Sep 19, 10:13 AM
    Waiters/restaurant workers (especially in chains) - tell us, who gets the tips? 24th Sep 19 at 10:13 AM
    Carluccio's has said it gives cash tips to waiting staff, but card tips are split between all staff, including managers, based on hours worked. So we want to know how it works elsewhere, so that customers who choose to tip, can understand where it goes

    Please tip us off (and let us know which chain you work at).
    Last edited by MSE Gary; 24-09-2019 at 6:28 PM.
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Page 3
    • tonyhey
    • By tonyhey 25th Sep 19, 1:59 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    tonyhey
    Ant chance of deciphering this in to English?
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 25th Sep 19, 2:29 PM
    • 23,857 Posts
    • 64,231 Thanks
    Pollycat
    Ant chance of deciphering this in to English?
    Originally posted by tonyhey
    AFAICS, all posts are in perfectly understandable English.

    What do you think needs "deciphering in to English"?
    • NeilCr
    • By NeilCr 25th Sep 19, 2:57 PM
    • 3,476 Posts
    • 5,367 Thanks
    NeilCr
    I worked as a Waitress at Bill's for just over a year. The service charge is automatically added to the bill. The waiting staff do not receive a penny of this "service charge", (that's automatically added and usually paid by card), for the service they have provided. Waiting staff only get to keep cash tips. None of the waiting staff know where it goes. There were some kind customers who asked if we got the tip, and when I said "No", they asked if I could take the "automatic service charge" off the bill, and left it for me in cash. I have since left and gone to a resturant that don't automatically add the service charge on and it's made a huge difference.
    Originally posted by YelloJello
    I came across this at Bills recently. IIRC the service charge was 12.5%. I like Bills a lot but the automatically added service charge is very irritating. I was having lunch with my friend and we took the service charge off and left 10% in cash with the (very efficient and friendly) waitress.

    We are going there again next week and I'll bear your comments in mind when tipping.
    • undrop79
    • By undrop79 25th Sep 19, 4:42 PM
    • 42 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    undrop79
    Hotel Group
    One thing is for sure, most if not all hotels and restaurants should explain how their tip system works when your job with them and if not you should be able to request this info. I've worked mainly in hotels and bars and whilst they've all had different methods of distributing tips, I've always been happy or else I wouldn't have taken the job.

    The hotel group I work at currently uses a tronc system for their restaurant and bar. All food and drink that come with table service carry a 10% discretionary gratuity which gets paid evenly by the restaurant, bar and kitchen teams equally based on how many shifts you have worked so that those who have worked more than others get a bigger slice of the pie. Seems to work pretty well and I currently get 100-200 a month on top of my basic pay.
    Last edited by undrop79; 25-09-2019 at 4:47 PM.
    • squirrel_123
    • By squirrel_123 25th Sep 19, 5:21 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    squirrel_123
    Dodgy electronic tipping topping up management salaries?
    I used to be management in a specific restaurant chain in the UK. Not front of house management, but general company management.

    When I started there, I had never worked in hospitality before as a member of management so I had no idea about how electronic card tips worked, but knew about cash tips as I had been a waitress when I was younger. I knew the waiting staff in our restaurant used to prefer cash tips (I think most in hospitality do) and didn't think anything of it at the time.

    Very shortly after starting with the company, it came to my attention that the customers were complaining of a "10% service charge" that was automatically added to the bill. There was mention of it in small print (at the time) on the menu and it was at the bottom of the receipt so very easy to miss. Turns out, this was an "electronic card tip" that the customer most of the time didn't notice (as most would also leave a cash tip on leaving the restaurant). I asked one of the waiting staff about this and they had been told NOT to tell customers about the service charge (including reminding them that it was optional and had already been added onto their bill) and who it went too, and only to answer questions when asked - bit strange I thought. They also were NOT allowed to tell customers, if asked, that the service charge goes to topping up management salaries and not just the restaurant team - again, very strange - even though on the menu it said the "10% discretionary service charge is distributed amongst the team".

    A couple of months and some payslips later, I soon realised I wasn't being paid correctly. I discussed this with my manager. I had had some pay issues as I was a new employee, so again, didn't think much of it at the time. Turns out, my salary was being topped up by this service charge and I was being under-paid as I wasn't being paid enough of the service charge. To clarify, I was being paid minimum wage for my age per hour, and then it was topped up with this service charge to make it up to my agreed monthly salary in my contract. This would probably explain WHY the floor staff were not allowed to make the customers aware of the service charge on their receipt.
    • sinbinjack
    • By sinbinjack 25th Sep 19, 10:02 PM
    • 26 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    sinbinjack
    indian night restaurant Chelmsford.essex
    I am told by staff that the management keep all the tips so they can pay the wages of the staff. I would like to know why we even bother with tips to wait staff as they are just workers like any others ,but if In do tip then I tip the person who serves me not the owners.
    Last edited by sinbinjack; 25-09-2019 at 10:02 PM. Reason: mistake
    • cofi01
    • By cofi01 26th Sep 19, 9:32 AM
    • 1 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    cofi01
    We were owner/operators of a small, independent restaurant. We had a very firm policy that all tips were pooled (if paid on card, the cash was taken from the till and placed in the pool) and shared equally among ALL staff working on that evening. This included both waiting and kitchen staff as they were all an important part in the customer experience.
    • Miles_W
    • By Miles_W 26th Sep 19, 12:25 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    Miles_W
    Interesting topic, but why is it under the Marriage, Relationships & Families sub-board?
    (I only found it through a link from the MSE's Money Tips email.)
    • tfvs2
    • By tfvs2 26th Sep 19, 12:59 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    tfvs2
    Misconceptions
    I've run restaurants for 20 years, both independent and branded, and there is often misconceptions over service charges and tips - sometimes purposely so.

    Largely credit card tips get shared and paid along with usual pay, so taxed and NI'd, and usually dependent on hours worked, though some places pay them out as cash. This is usually just waiting staff, though often a share of this is then "tipped out" to bar and kitchen staff.

    A handful of companies also include managers in this to top up salaries and save the company money. Whilst most managers, including myself, aren't necessarily comfortable with this, it does provide a source of motivation to be active in the service side of the business. Managers will usually have bonus opportunities which more than compensate them enough in my eyes, but as I say it may be their employer who "suggests" the policy.

    It is worth remembering that cash tips taken by any staff outside of their normal pay isn't taxed. I've run places where they can earn several hundred pounds a week in cash tips and I think it's commonly accepted that they won't declare these. This money alone would be a decent income to many who pay tax on their earnings so it is fair to say this is basically tax avoidance, which contributes to higher tax rates to others. It's a nice idea to think giving cash to your server or chef means they get it, but if in the rare occasion they do it is likely they are earning a good (illegal) tax-free income as you won't be the only one handing over cash.

    Most employers have safeguards to ensure tips are properly recorded and distributed evenly across the team and compliant with tax law. It is a very grey area in terms of fairness and tax regulations, but it is worth remembering that the people your server my be sharing tips with are often at least equally as good and hard-working as they are!
    • frugal2
    • By frugal2 27th Sep 19, 1:06 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    frugal2
    Hi I work as a waitress in a Tiptree tearoom for the company Wilkin & Sons on minimum wage.


    All of the tips whether given in cash or by card have to be put in a pot which the manager counts at the end of each day and sends to head office.


    At head office they are taxed and divided between all staff on site including managers based on the number of hours worked.


    This is really annoying as I give extremely good customer service and the customers would like the tip to go to the waitress that has served them but the reality is that it goes in the pot and we see about a pound a day on our payslips!



    • Kim kim
    • By Kim kim 27th Sep 19, 7:06 PM
    • 2,936 Posts
    • 4,100 Thanks
    Kim kim
    Hi I work as a waitress in a Tiptree tearoom for the company Wilkin & Sons on minimum wage.


    All of the tips whether given in cash or by card have to be put in a pot which the manager counts at the end of each day and sends to head office.


    At head office they are taxed and divided between all staff on site including managers based on the number of hours worked.


    This is really annoying as I give extremely good customer service and the customers would like the tip to go to the waitress that has served them but the reality is that it goes in the pot and we see about a pound a day on our payslips!



    Originally posted by frugal2
    So you think you should earn more for doing your job properly?

    I pay tax & NI on every penny I earn too.
    Last edited by Kim kim; 30-09-2019 at 10:39 PM.
    • puk999
    • By puk999 27th Sep 19, 9:58 PM
    • 510 Posts
    • 458 Thanks
    puk999
    Not sure if off topic but I don't tip. It's the MSE thing to do, surely?
    • rawhammered
    • By rawhammered 30th Sep 19, 12:50 PM
    • 61 Posts
    • 40 Thanks
    rawhammered
    nope, never tip and encourage everyone else to do the same. Get rid of this unfair, underhand system of tax evasion that puts pressure put on both staff and customers. An open and transparent system of paying the advertised price at restaurants would benefit all in the longer term. Get employers to pay a reasonable salary.
    • No Kash
    • By No Kash 30th Sep 19, 3:08 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    No Kash
    Give waiters cash only
    Carluccio's has said it gives cash tips to waiting staff, but card tips are split between all staff, including managers, based on hours worked. So we want to know how it works elsewhere, so that customers who choose to tip, can understand where it goes

    Please tip us off (and let us know which chain you work at).
    Originally posted by MSE Gary

    Card tips are the biggest fraudulent company policy I have ever come across, especially the law stating that one of the waiters should be held in a position to be in charge of the tips. What mostly happens is that, the position is given to a person in head office, which is never distributed out to waiters inaccurate amounts if not at all. It disgusting that 10 to 14% of service is charged at times. When in no way is the waiter or other service members are seeing the rewards by card tips. There needs to be a union or body that deals with these issues to back up claims by waiters where this is unlawfully happening. This comes from a Michelin star resturant worker. So much for upper-class establishment. Businesses will state they need to pay overheads, but waiters need to pay there bills for the roof over there heads. Abolish the Service charge!!
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 30th Sep 19, 3:30 PM
    • 23,857 Posts
    • 64,231 Thanks
    Pollycat
    Card tips are the biggest fraudulent company policy I have ever come across, especially the law stating that one of the waiters should be held in a position to be in charge of the tips. What mostly happens is that, the position is given to a person in head office, which is never distributed out to waiters inaccurate amounts if not at all. It disgusting that 10 to 14% of service is charged at times. When in no way is the waiter or other service members are seeing the rewards by card tips. There needs to be a union or body that deals with these issues to back up claims by waiters where this is unlawfully happening. This comes from a Michelin star resturant worker. So much for upper-class establishment. Businesses will state they need to pay overheads, but waiters need to pay there bills for the roof over there heads. Abolish the Service charge!!
    Originally posted by No Kash
    Isn't there a union that represents restaurant workers?
    Would you join if there was?
    If there already is a union, are you a member?

    Maybe the customer should take some personal responsibility and check their bill and ask for any service charge to be removed.
    I will not pay a service charge.
    I do pay by card.
    I do tip in cash.
    • dekaspace
    • By dekaspace 30th Sep 19, 4:19 PM
    • 5,151 Posts
    • 4,890 Thanks
    dekaspace
    Whilst probably uncommon had a relative that worked in a bar that served food till late, the tips all went to the bar staff who spent most of their time chatting to regulars and doing no work, and kitchen staff were understaffed such as 1 person on even for busy periods so a 10pm finish they might not get out till 1am yet only paid till 10pm
    • Kim kim
    • By Kim kim 30th Sep 19, 10:39 PM
    • 2,936 Posts
    • 4,100 Thanks
    Kim kim
    nope, never tip and encourage everyone else to do the same. Get rid of this unfair, underhand system of tax evasion that puts pressure put on both staff and customers. An open and transparent system of paying the advertised price at restaurants would benefit all in the longer term. Get employers to pay a reasonable salary.
    Originally posted by rawhammered
    Absolutely agree.
    A fair days work for a fair days pay.
    Pay the price for the meal to include all business overheads.
    • Tammykitty
    • By Tammykitty 1st Oct 19, 1:43 PM
    • 819 Posts
    • 1,645 Thanks
    Tammykitty
    I think this is a very interesting thread.
    It's obviously gone out in the weekly MSE newsletter (evidenced by the number of newbies posting - Hi & welcome to you all ).


    I'm very surprised by this statement:


    I'd be interested to hear from more chefs about hourly rates.

    It's really made me think more about tipping.

    On reflection, I think splitting tips between kitchen staff and waiters - maybe with a higher percentage going to the chef than the washer up? - is fair.

    I'm still of this mind:

    Any managers out there who want to change my mind?
    Originally posted by Pollycat

    Now i'm not a manager, but I am going to stick up for them


    Depends on the individual restaurants but the managers often take the flack from those higher up, they absorb a lot of the sh*t, and protect their staff from it.
    If you have a happy waiter or waitress serving you, the chances are its a good place to work, and the manager is a good manager.
    If staff phone in sick, the manager deals with and phones around etc, to try to make sure the place isn't understaffed so your waiting staff have time to serve you!
    • Pollycat
    • By Pollycat 1st Oct 19, 1:55 PM
    • 23,857 Posts
    • 64,231 Thanks
    Pollycat
    Now i'm not a manager, but I am going to stick up for them


    Depends on the individual restaurants but the managers often take the flack from those higher up, they absorb a lot of the sh*t, and protect their staff from it.
    If you have a happy waiter or waitress serving you, the chances are its a good place to work, and the manager is a good manager.
    If staff phone in sick, the manager deals with and phones around etc, to try to make sure the place isn't understaffed so your waiting staff have time to serve you!
    Originally posted by Tammykitty
    And that's fine.
    Still not changed my mind though.
    I don't want to tip the manager.
    Originally posted by Pollycat
    I want to tip the people who've had an active role in my enjoyment of my meal.
    So to me, that would be the waiter(s)/chef(s).

    FWIW, I tip the waiter specifically with cash (even though I almost always pay by card).
    I guess it's up to the individual restaurant how they split tips.
    And if part of that tip goes to the manager that's fine.

    But for places like this:
    indian night restaurant Chelmsford.essex:
    I am told by staff that the management keep all the tips so they can pay the wages of the staff. I would like to know why we even bother with tips to wait staff as they are just workers like any others ,but if In do tip then I tip the person who serves me not the owners.
    Originally posted by sinbinjack
    I wouldn't leave any tip at all.
    • Takmon
    • By Takmon 1st Oct 19, 3:10 PM
    • 912 Posts
    • 930 Thanks
    Takmon
    Tips? Ha ha ha...the joys of card machine payments mean less and less tips are being given

    I work 16 hours a week in a very busy pub waiting tables all day long, all tips get shared equally amongst front of house / kitchen staff on a weekly basis and I think this is great as we all work together as a team (including those paying my card). Being on the minimum wage, a whopping 8.21 an hour, tips are always gratefully received, no matter how small. It's the thought that counts. However, the thing that annoys me when it comes to tipping is that now more and more people are paying by card less and less actually leave a tip, even when the option is to do it on the machine. You see people all the time having the I don't have any cash on me conversation and then the person who pays doesn't give a tip as they have picked up the bill....I am now in favour of having a 10% discretionary charge added to all bills, something that used to wind me up but would love my employer to bring it in.
    Originally posted by vm72
    16 hours a week is barely 2 days work and your just taking orders and carrying plates of food which requires no skills and almost anymore can do. So I think minimum wage is a fair pay for this kind of job.

    I think tipping is an outdated concept and waiting staff should be expected to do a good job as default because that is what they are being paid to do. If they don't do a good job then disciplinary action should be taken.
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