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PCN Premier Park POPLA Appeal

12346

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  • Redx
    Redx Posts: 38,084
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    you need to add the above into your original thread and let this one die

    one topic , one thread

    alternatively, pm soolin or crabman and ask them to merge the 2 threads into 1
  • Crabman
    Crabman Posts: 9,943
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    Threads have been merged :)
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 130,572
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    edited 10 May 2018 at 12:22AM
    Breaking it into paragraphs so we can read it:

    'The vehicle was first observed at XX:XX not parked wholly within a bay. No grace period was required as the vehicle was not parked in accordance with the terms and conditions.

    The Appellant's vehicle is not parked in a bay. The area he is parked has one clear line to the left of his vehicle which is clearly defining the space next to where he parked. As can be seen in all of our images, the bays are very clearly marked white with three lines. One at the front and two on the sides.

    There are no lines defining a space where the Appellant has parked. The spaces in the car park are clearly marked with white lines. The area the Appellant parked in, is not a clearly defined bay and is in fact an access route in the car park. There are no white lines defining a space around the Appellant's vehicle.

    Please note, the signage has been in place since 16th May 2017.

    Within the appeal to POPLA, the Appellant has questioned the date the PCN was received. The date of the contravention was 29th January 2018. The Notice to Keeper was issued 31st January 2018. We then received a transfer of liability from the Registered Keeper naming the Appellant as the owner of the vehicle on 12th February 2018.

    We then reissued the PCN into the Appellant's name on 13th February 2018.


    We then issued the Final Reminder to the Appellant on 15th March 2018. We have therefore issued the PCNs in the relevant timescales.

    We cannot be held liable for the Driver believing he can park anywhere when the signage clearly states 'Park only within marked bays.' When entering onto a managed private car park, a motorist might enter into a contract by remaining on the land for a reasonable period.

    The signage at the site sets out the terms and conditions of this contract. Therefore, upon entry to the car park, the driver should have reviewed the terms and conditions before deciding to park. If he felt, for any reason, that he was not able to adhere to the terms and conditions, then he would have had sufficient opportunity to choose not to park and depart the site.

    The Driver remained on site and therefore agreed to the terms and conditions. If the Driver was in any doubt as to whether he could park in that area, he could have spoken to a member of staff in the gym, telephoned Premier Park, our number is on the signage, or alternatively left site within a reasonable grace period without a PCN being issued.

    With regards to the appellant's remarks that the parking charge notice is punitive (snip the b@wl@cks about the Beavis case, load of codswallop and nothing like this case)...

    The Driver did not comply with the terms of the site; therefore, the Parking Charge Notice was issued. It is the responsibility of the motorist to ensure that they have read and parked in compliance with the terms and conditions. On this occasion, the Appellant did not. We request that the Appellant's appeal be refused.'

    Where do I now stand as in their evidence it shows they issued a PCN on the 31st January 2018 when the incident was on the 29th January 2018, this PCN went to the new keeper who actually bought the vehicle on the evening of the incident (obviously I never received this copy).

    They then re-issued it as a PCN to myself dated 13th February 2018. The First Reminder dated 15th March 2018 was then issued.

    What are my next steps, what can I add to my appeal as it says I have 7 days from today (9th January 2018) to add more evidence? Originally I was told a few days previously (possibly by the attendant responsible for this ticket) that the location in which the vehicle was parked was fine and that as long as it wasn't parked in a disabled bay I was ok, although I fear this will hold no water as evidence.
    It's MAY!

    You stand exactly where you were, and must send POPLA a few comments on the Portal like everyone else does. If you lose, so what?

    No-one here pays when PP win at POPLA, which they fairly often do.

    Did they include evidence of landowner authority and is that contract dated, with readable signatories of the landowner (not a random agent) and does the contract have an expiry date? Is it clear whether the contract is a rolling one continuing into perpetuity? If not, comment on that!

    Are the signage pictures clear, is the £sum of the parking charge in large letters and are there terms that mean parking on the roadway results in a charge? No? Comment on that...

    I am amazed that your sold the car on 29th January and PP reckon they got the new keeper's data within a day...but maybe the V5 change reporting that you'd sold the vehicle was done online immediately by you?
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • topcarp
    topcarp Posts: 39 Forumite
    Coupon-mad wrote: »
    Breaking it into paragraphs so we can read it:






    It's MAY!

    You stand exactly where you were, and must send POPLA a few comments on the Portal like everyone else does. If you lose, so what?

    No-one here pays when PP win at POPLA, which they fairly often do.

    Did they include evidence of landowner authority and is that contract dated, with readable signatories of the landowner (not a random agent) and does the contract have an expiry date? Is it clear whether the contract is a rolling one continuing into perpetuity? If not, comment on that!

    Are the signage pictures clear, is the £sum of the parking charge in large letters and are there terms that mean parking on the roadway results in a charge? No? Comment on that...

    I am amazed that your sold the car on 29th January and PP reckon they got the new keeper's data within a day...but maybe the V5 change reporting that you'd sold the vehicle was done online immediately by you?

    Thankyou very much for your advice Coupon-mad, i shall add some comments to my appeal as instructed.

    They have included evidence of landowner authority along with a document signed by/act on behalf of the landowner, but non of this is readable as names and signatures for both parties have been blanked out. Unfortunately it would seem the contract is a rolling one every 12 months.

    Yes I am amazed as well, unfortunately I did transfer the V5 online pretty quickly, I can't remember whether it was that evening or not and can't find the e-mail from the DVLA, either it was deleted or it went into junk.

    One thing I would like to run past everyone is a google earth image I have edited with some evidence which I may be helpful to my case, how do I go about adding it to the forum as it asks for a web link for the image?
  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 37,426
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    topcarp wrote: »
    One thing I would like to run past everyone is a google earth image I have edited with some evidence which I may be helpful to my case, how do I go about adding it to the forum as it asks for a web link for the image?
    Upload your image to a webhosting site and post the link to that uploaded image here.
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 130,572
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    But you can't add new evidence, attachments or images, at POPLA comments stage anyway.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • topcarp
    topcarp Posts: 39 Forumite
    Coupon-mad wrote: »
    But you can't add new evidence, attachments or images, at POPLA comments stage anyway.

    Ohh dear!!
  • topcarp
    topcarp Posts: 39 Forumite
    edited 11 May 2018 at 2:30PM
    This is an image of the car park below, the blue rectangle in the centre is the location which the vehicle was parked when I received the PCN, the green rectangle is an unmarked parking space next to the entrance that according to the gym management is a legal parking space even though it is not marked as such and is next to disabled bays, the orange marked areas on the left of the carpark are legal parking spaces that are unmarked and without white lines to indicate them as such. What are peoples interpretations of this layout, I believe it is very misleading and makes drivers an easy target be being so vauge?

    X4L1_zps90fnajqt.jpg
  • topcarp
    topcarp Posts: 39 Forumite
    A penny for peoples thoughts?
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 130,572
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    PPCs pretty much always make their layout vague, lines unclear, signs and PDT machines hidden. Trouble is you can't add this at POPLA.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
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