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  • FIRST POST
    • danrv
    • By danrv 4th Jul 18, 11:59 AM
    • 38Posts
    • 5Thanks
    danrv
    Old Economy 10 system help
    • #1
    • 4th Jul 18, 11:59 AM
    Old Economy 10 system help 4th Jul 18 at 11:59 AM
    Hi
    I have just moved into a 3 bed semi detached property which has an electric warm air ducted heating system on Economy 10.
    Its from the 1970s and probably quite efficient but am thinking that NOBODY would be running anything like this these days.
    The Unidare 10Kw R10 unit is huge (H130cm W60cm) weighs 75kg, has its own cupboard and is wired into the E10 timer. The off peak times are 10.00pm-8.00am BST which makes sense for this type of storage heater as it doesnt need a top up in the evening.
    Water heating is seperate immersion tank which I could have timed to operate off peak.

    I would like to update to a more modern system but options are limited. No mains gas and quite a small garden for oil tank.
    Heat pump/wet system worth considering but not sure how hot it would heat the water in really cold weather.
    I dont need to heat the whole house, maybe one or two rooms at a time. Routine probably does suit storage heating more than electric rads but central storage units such as this are no longer made. Storage heaters/tariffs do seem to be gradually on the way out too.

    Theres no shortage of electric rads available and this would be an easy install. I have done extensive reading on these and they would be neat, individually controllable via WiFi with no maintenance costs. Would need to switch to standard tariff.
    Only downside I can see is high running cost.
    Sort of stuck really.
    Last edited by danrv; 04-07-2018 at 12:43 PM.
Page 2
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    E.ON Economy 10 Meter
    Yes. Had a call from Eon after enquiring and my off peak times are:
    10.00pm - 8am BST
    9.00pm - 7am GMT
    Originally posted by danrv
    Unfortunately the suppliers can't be trusted to give you the operating times. It would be best to confirm the Economy 10 times yourself from your meter. You need to be certain that the heating is running only during the cheap rate.

    Does the meter have an indicator light or similar to show you when it is on the cheap rate? If you could post photos here of your meter and any timer controls, that would help.
    Originally posted by coffeehound


    The meter alternates between low/normal/total. Theres also a red light that flashes occasionally.
    Im assuming the brass arrow on the mechanical timer should indicate current time. If so its several hours out.
    Originally posted by danrv
    Hello danrv and happy to double check the meter switching times. Please drop an email with your details to the address in my Profile if you would like me to do this. Don't worry if I don't reply straightaway. I'm out of the office now until next Tuesday but will pick it up when I'm back.

    If the time switch is more than 2 hours out, we'll need to visit to either reset the clock or change the meter. This is looked after by a specialist team. To start the ball rolling, please talk to our Appointment Booking team. Contact details are on our website or your bills under residential enquiries.

    Have a good weekend.

    Malc
    Official Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • danrv
    • By danrv 6th Jul 18, 8:00 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Thanks for the reply.
    • coffeehound
    • By coffeehound 6th Jul 18, 8:21 PM
    • 1,782 Posts
    • 2,732 Thanks
    coffeehound


    The meter alternates between low/normal/total. Theres also a red light that flashes occasionally.
    Im assuming the brass arrow on the mechanical timer should indicate current time. If so its several hours out.
    Originally posted by danrv
    Thanks for the photo.

    The digital bit will have its peak/off-peak rate changes controlled by radio signal. However, the time that the heating charges up may still be controlled separately by the mechanical side. If that is the case, there's the chance it would not be synchronised with the cheap rate, with the clocking being wrong as you identified. Hopefully an electrician or the supplier can confirm the situation with that if no-one here knows for sure.

    The rate that you are actually being billed for is indicated by the Rate 1 / 2 indication on the left side of the digital display. So you could note when that changes to get the changeover times.

    Your supplier may suggest you move to a smart meter. Views vary widely on whether this is a good idea, so you could check threads here on that.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 6th Jul 18, 11:01 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Thanks, that gives me a bit more idea.
    Hope to get the charging times back in sync with help from Eon.
    • matelodave
    • By matelodave 7th Jul 18, 7:57 AM
    • 3,717 Posts
    • 2,324 Thanks
    matelodave
    Do you really want the charging times back in sync. It may be to your advantage to leave it alone.

    You may find that the off-peak period is a bit more convenient allowing you to do your washing, drying and other stuff on cheaper leccy.

    How far out is it
    Love makes the world go round - beer make it go round even faster
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    • danrv
    • By danrv 8th Jul 18, 12:04 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Good point. About 8 1/4 hrs. At 11.45am, timer shows 3.30am.
    Cheap rate would be more useful during daytime.
    • coffeehound
    • By coffeehound 8th Jul 18, 1:26 PM
    • 1,782 Posts
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    coffeehound
    Danrv, have you been able to check when the digital display switches between rate 1 / rate 2?
    • danrv
    • By danrv 8th Jul 18, 5:01 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Danrv, have you been able to check when the digital display switches between rate 1 / rate 2?
    Originally posted by coffeehound
    Rate 2 is flashing so maybe that means that is the current rate. Not sure how I can tell when it switches though.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 9th Jul 18, 1:50 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Well, rate 1 is now flashing at 11.45am, 24hrs later so doesn't look like this shows what rate is currently being used.
    No way of telling when the meter switches so will have to go with Eon's stated times.

    As I see it, I have uncertain day/night rate times, a mechanical timer which is not set at the correct time and an old heating system that I can't update.
    I'll contact Eon representative as per message.
    Last edited by danrv; 10-07-2018 at 12:06 PM.
    • coffeehound
    • By coffeehound 9th Jul 18, 2:10 PM
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    coffeehound
    Hmm, so the meter says that Rate 1 is low and it's on at 11:45? That is odd, even for Economy 10 times. Does the rate 1 and 2 agree with low/high on the billing? Are you certain it is on E10 by the way?

    Were it me, I'd confirm the exact changeover times first, though appreciate that depends on being around at the right time. Perhaps a laptop with the webcam watching it for 24 hours? Anyway, if not, hopefully the supplier or an electrician can confirm the situation.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 9th Jul 18, 3:04 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Hmm, so the meter says that Rate 1 is low and it's on at 11:45? That is odd, even for Economy 10 times. Does the rate 1 and 2 agree with low/high on the billing? Are you certain it is on E10 by the way?
    Originally posted by coffeehound
    Haven't been here long so no full bill yet.
    Eon said my electricity is Economy 10 which does make sense with my heating system.
    The email states that cheap rate is 10pm-8am GMT spread over three blocks.
    A bit confused, I asked for clarification and after a while they got back and confirmed it was 10.00pm - 8.00am.
    Ideally I'd like my E10 hours similar to how the oil fired system timer was set up in my previous house.
    7.00am - 10am
    3pm - 10pm
    Then electric rads on cheap rate plus hot water, washing, oven etc...








    .
    Last edited by danrv; 09-07-2018 at 4:16 PM.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 11th Jul 18, 3:40 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Were it me, I'd confirm the exact changeover times first, though appreciate that depends on being around at the right time.
    Originally posted by coffeehound
    I've checked and the digital meter switches from rate 1 to rate 2 at approx. 3.10pm.
    If the off peak rate is in one 10 hour block then the cheap rate possibly starts at 5.10am.

    At least I can heat water and use washing machine off peak during the day.
    As for the heating, I'll check with the neighbours as they've replaced the same system with electric heating.
    • coffeehound
    • By coffeehound 11th Jul 18, 3:53 PM
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    coffeehound
    Economy 10 normally has one hour mid afternoon so you could see if it changes again around 4.10
    • danrv
    • By danrv 11th Jul 18, 4:47 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Doesn't seem to have changed. Will probably be on normal rate 2 now until 5.10am.
    Will keep checking though.
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    E.ON Economy 10 Meter
    Well, rate 1 is now flashing at 11.45am, 24hrs later so doesn't look like this shows what rate is currently being used.
    No way of telling when the meter switches so will have to go with Eon's stated times.

    As I see it, I have uncertain day/night rate times, a mechanical timer which is not set at the correct time and an old heating system that I can't update.
    I'll contact Eon representative as per message.
    Originally posted by danrv
    Haven't been here long so no full bill yet.
    Eon said my electricity is Economy 10 which does make sense with my heating system.
    The email states that cheap rate is 10pm-8am GMT spread over three blocks.
    A bit confused, I asked for clarification and after a while they got back and confirmed it was 10.00pm - 8.00am.
    Ideally I'd like my E10 hours similar to how the oil fired system timer was set up in my previous house.
    7.00am - 10am
    3pm - 10pm
    Then electric rads on cheap rate plus hot water, washing, oven etc.
    .
    Originally posted by danrv
    Afternoon danrv.

    Meter switching times are set by the regional electricity distributor and rarely change. As such, it looks like there's a fault with your time switch.

    Economy 10 meters give 10 hours off-peak electricity in every 24 hours. As others have said, this is usually split into three periods at night, during the afternoon and in the evening. This, though, isn't set in stone as there are some hybrid versions around and the advisor you spoke to could well be right. As above, happy to check.

    Malc
    Official Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • danrv
    • By danrv 13th Jul 18, 1:46 PM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Thanks for the reply. As Im not using the heating at the moment, the current off peak time works well with my routine.
    Im assuming the mechanical timer communicates with the digital meter and switches it over.
    What Im not sure about is when the storage heater charges. Maybe its wired in to the timer.
  • E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    E.ON Economy 10 Meter
    Thanks for the reply. As Im not using the heating at the moment, the current off peak time works well with my routine.
    Im assuming the mechanical timer communicates with the digital meter and switches it over.
    What Im not sure about is when the storage heater charges. Maybe its wired in to the timer.
    Originally posted by danrv
    You're welcome danrv. Happy to help.

    What usually happens with storage heaters is they're wired directly into the heating circuits at properties. This allows them to be automatically activated at the off-peak times by the time switch. The problem here is your time switch is out meaning, if you were using them, they would be coming on when maybe you weren't expecting. As this currently suits you, probably best to leave alone and then re-visit it once you need to use the storage heaters.

    Have a good weekend danrv.

    Malc
    Official Company Representative
    I am an official company representative of E.ON. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • coffeehound
    • By coffeehound 13th Jul 18, 9:45 PM
    • 1,782 Posts
    • 2,732 Thanks
    coffeehound
    Danrv, worth ensuring that your immersion heater is only operated when the digital meter indicates the off-peak rate too.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 15th Jul 18, 11:43 AM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    The problem here is your time switch is out meaning, if you were using them, they would be coming on when maybe you weren't expecting.
    Originally posted by E.ON Company Representative: Malc
    The central storage unit is off at the mains now but when on it stays warm all the time. Being a large storage heater, it holds the heat very well between charges.
    I suppose it doesnt matter when it charges as long as it does so automatically at the off peak time.
    Thanks for the help.
    • danrv
    • By danrv 15th Jul 18, 11:44 AM
    • 38 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    danrv
    Danrv, worth ensuring that your immersion heater is only operated when the digital meter indicates the off-peak rate too.
    Originally posted by coffeehound
    Yes, thanks. Doing that at the moment.
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