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  • FIRST POST
    • Lz?Kithra
    • By Lz?Kithra 15th Sep 18, 3:01 PM
    • 51Posts
    • 13Thanks
    Lz?Kithra
    Link Financial Outsourcing dispute
    • #1
    • 15th Sep 18, 3:01 PM
    Link Financial Outsourcing dispute 15th Sep 18 at 3:01 PM
    I have a credit card debt on which I have been making repayments to Link Financial Outsourcing for a number of years now. The debt is now 14 years old, and the CAB helped me to sort out the repayments, and stop the interest, way back in 2004.

    Back in February of this year I wrote to ask for a copy of the relevant CCA. Hearing nothing from them I chased it up in early April, but still heard nothing at all.

    I note that on the “Complaint and Conclusion” form, in paragraph 6, it states that:
    “I agree that the account is currently unenforceable.”
    But in the next paragraph it continues to say that they request I continue to pay. Would I therefore be correct in assuming that they might take me court to enforce payment because they don’t have a copy of the CCA?

    Finally, this morning I had another letter saying that my case had been referred to their Specialist Support Team and quoting the reason as being: “in order for us to find an appropriate solution for you.”

    They continued by saying that they would telephone me on the number they have for me, or that I could telephone them, which I shall not be doing. They will have trouble contacting me that way as, apart from having a Scam Blocker on my phone, they don’t have my number, I’ve never given it to them and won’t be doing so in future.

    So I don’t know if I should write to them pointing out that I’m still waiting for the CCA copy, or just wait until they contact me again.

    And, one other question: Is there a legal requirement to send them an income and expenditure form whenever they ask me to complete one?

    I’ll check back tomorrow so thanks for any advice anyone can give.
    Last edited by sourcrates; 15-09-2018 at 4:44 PM. Reason: Removal of personal information.
    Liz R
Page 2
    • sourcrates
    • By sourcrates 17th Sep 18, 4:47 PM
    • 16,702 Posts
    • 15,777 Thanks
    sourcrates
    If this was a Capital One credit card then they may have a problem with proving a Default Notice was issued/served (a common headache for the debt purchaser). Sometimes Link issue their own DN which is no remedy since an account must be defaulted (preceded by a S87(1) Default Notice) before it is terminated and assigned to the next entity.
    Di
    Originally posted by Just Di

    Di,


    This was always my understanding, that an account must default before a creditor can sell it on to a new company.

    However, we are increasingly seeing debts on this forum, which do not default, sold on to 3rd party collectors, who then continue to charge interest as per the original agreement.

    Are they taking advantage of different legislation, for example the right to sell on a debt at any time, if it is written into the terms and conditions of their original contracts ?
    I'm a Board Guide on the Debt-Free Wannabe, Credit File And Ratings, and
    Bankruptcy And Living With It, boards. "I volunteer to help get your forum questions answered and keep the forum running smoothly".

    Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an abusive or illegal post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com. Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com.

    For free debt advice, contact either : Stepchange, National Debtline, or, CAB.
    • Just Di
    • By Just Di 17th Sep 18, 5:00 PM
    • 343 Posts
    • 185 Thanks
    Just Di
    It may depend on who the original creditor is selling the debt to, and what they (debt purchaser) can do with the account afterwards.

    If the debt purchaser is not a "credit giver" then they can't continue with the account as per the Ts & Cs because the account holder is not able to remedy any Default Notice and continue with their line of credit (e.g. use the card in an ATM) or be issued with a new bit of plastic when the existing card reaches it's expiry date etc.

    If it's an acquisition such as Barclaycard buying Egg's credit card portfolio in May 2011 then that may be a different scenario if the debt purchased is a 'performing' account.

    The applicable legislation will be account specific so I'll keep my eyes open for any posts where this may be an issue.

    Di
    • Lz?Kithra
    • By Lz?Kithra 18th Sep 18, 11:50 AM
    • 51 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    Lz?Kithra
    Thanks. In the past I've always sent them an Income & Expenditure Form whenever they've asked for one. But they tend to ask at least every 6 months and my income doesn't change as I'm only on State Benefits. And, those only change once a year. So I get fed up completing the form twice a year.
    Liz R
    • Lz?Kithra
    • By Lz?Kithra 4th Nov 18, 2:22 PM
    • 51 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    Lz?Kithra
    I had a document from Link Financial in the middle of August re my monthly payment being overdue. Attached was a bank giro slip but, although the documents stated 3 the giro slip was only made out for 2. I didn’t pay but replied pointing out my CCA request from back in February is still outstanding and not complied with. Up until then I had been paying regularly. I’d been paying it since 2004 via various debt collection agencies. But I stopped without having a copy of the CCA, even though they’d written to say they could still enforce the debt, which I ignored. So I wrote back telling them I was still waiting for it and to desist from contacting me until such time that it is supplied.

    I’ve heard nothing further and was wondering what my response should be if I hear from them again. I’m aware that after 6 years of no contact the debt will no longer be enforceable, and I was wondering if they are contacting me now in an ongoing attempt to keep it alive. Should I hear from them again perhaps I should reply saying that until I receive the CCA documents I will have no further contact with them unless they comply. If that’s the best way forward I will then simply ignore any further letters from them.
    Liz R
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 4th Nov 18, 4:05 PM
    • 13,476 Posts
    • 10,533 Thanks
    fatbelly
    So I’ll take your advice and write to them saying that they are in breach of my request until they supply the CCA copy and I will not be paying anything until they can do so. In that letter I’ll also point out the sentence from their reply saying that it is currently unenforceable. And if, after that, they continue to hassle me I’ll get some legal advice
    .

    So you've done that and there seems little point in you writing to them until they either comply or send a pre-court action letter - you would respond to that.

    I suspect they'll give up.
    • Lz?Kithra
    • By Lz?Kithra 5th Nov 18, 11:31 AM
    • 51 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    Lz?Kithra
    Thanks fatbelly. I wasn't going to write to them again but wondered how to in case I did hear from them again. So I'll wait to see if I hear anything more from them. If I should get a pre-court letter I'll consult a solicitor before responding.
    Liz R
    • fatbelly
    • By fatbelly 5th Nov 18, 6:13 PM
    • 13,476 Posts
    • 10,533 Thanks
    fatbelly
    Thanks fatbelly. I wasn't going to write to them again but wondered how to in case I did hear from them again. So I'll wait to see if I hear anything more from them. If I should get a pre-court letter I'll consult a solicitor before responding.
    Originally posted by Lz?Kithra
    No need for a solicitor unless you know one who understands consumer credit and will help you for free!
    • Just Di
    • By Just Di 5th Nov 18, 8:54 PM
    • 343 Posts
    • 185 Thanks
    Just Di
    No need for a solicitor unless you know one who understands consumer credit and will help you for free!
    Originally posted by fatbelly
    Such law firms do exist.

    If the OP does receive a Letter Before Claim then this website link has suggestions as to how they might be able to manage the situation > https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/

    In my experience every debt situation is different so legal advice may be necessary. The CAB provides free debt/legal advice.

    Di
    • Lz?Kithra
    • By Lz?Kithra 6th Nov 18, 2:39 PM
    • 51 Posts
    • 13 Thanks
    Lz?Kithra
    There is a local firm of solicitors a couple of roads away from me who do deal with debt issues, and they also do home visits. So, should I need one I'll use them. But thanks for the link to the debtcamel site, which I'll keep in case of need. As for the CAB they are difficult to get hold of by phone these days now that you have to go through a central number; although somewhere in my files I think I have a CAB phone number that's dedicated to just debt problems. I'll look it up if I need it.
    Liz R
    • gillyo66
    • By gillyo66 9th Nov 18, 4:56 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    gillyo66
    Ford car debt bought by Link Financial
    My son had a PCP car from Ford credit, he defaulted on the payments and the debt was passed to Link Financial Outsourcing. Since they they have contacted him once to ask if they could repossess the car. He said no to that and offered a repayment scheme. since then he has heard nothing despite several letters and emails.
    He has received a fine because the car is not registered and it seems the car is not taxed since May 2018. There is no way he can do that as he doesn't have the log book. Any advice would be gratefully received
    • Ozcot
    • By Ozcot 8th Feb 19, 7:12 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Ozcot
    LinkFinancialOutsourcing
    Do Not Pay 1 penny to this organisation. They stopped me selling my house saying it had a charge, of 219:00 on it . This only appeared when rearches were carried out by my buyer . Link failed to respond to suppy any factual information to my legal team or myself . In panic and oh so stupid, i was bulllied into paying the 216 plus 50 i paid it so i would not lose my buyer. Link didnt lift the charge or have any further contact with my legal rep. I lost my buyer .on 30 october 18 i got a further demand on the advice of their solicitors kearns saying 4 other accounts were linked and now i owe 1300 . I forwarded the said amount to my solucitor to hold ,and only pay on my say so . I was disgusted to find the alledged debt wAs not mine, not recoverable, it wasnt a charge as stated, and none of the legaly required worked had been done. Their lies were backed up by managers, and i repeatedly got random
    Phone calls to speak to someome who had taken hs life, partly due to their initimidation,
    I almost lost my second sale , i had to reduce my house sale by 3000, i lost the house i was buying Now the next one wont be ready until may 19 and they still have not returned my 219::00 plus 50 admin.
    They lie and no- one appears to be able to challenge them or hold them to account. I was at my lowest and ready to take my life , im not far from that point now . I have had to stay in 17 different temporary accommodations . All for 216:00 i didnt owe in the first place.
    I dont have the energy to go on .
    They have emailed me to say they got it wrong and offered to pay me 350 compensation for my distress and if i accept that , i can also have the 216 + 50 repaid.
    I know i have an excellent case with the ombudsman which should help others .but i dont have the energy. Please ,if Anyone can help , please let me know , or if you need any of my imformation , you are more than wrlcome to it

    Ozcot
    • Ozcot
    • By Ozcot 8th Feb 19, 7:24 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Ozcot
    Thank you for your email
    I am finding in extremely difficult to revisit the past year to try and explain just how physically and emotionally ill the process, your process caused.


    I am aware that during my contact with LINK up to and including your investigation. No-on has ever contacted me to ask specifically how all this effected me.

    I appreciate that You acknowledged the fact that LINK failed me and could/ should have been better.
    Rather than simply make a fiscal list of demands from LINK, I want to address the way I feel about this vile process, and ask that you re visit your initial offer of 350

    I doing this because of real effect it has had in my life, and is continuing to have. Yet also in the hope that your organisation will do the right thing and make a substantially better offer that reflects the effects of what I have gone through , and also , to stop make me feeling like i do because i feel like I am begging to be heard and treated fairly

    I honestly and truthfully feel violated from the initial contact with your organisation’s call center contact , and the non acceptance that even though they needed to speak to an account holder who was dead , whilst refusing to discuss the personal business matter with me, i was left struggling to know the right thing to do.

    Even the information and death certificate weren't processed and administered properly.

    From continually getting random phone calls wanting to speak to someone who was dead as a result of suicide, your call Center staff didn't record the correct information to stop the process, i became increasingly agitated, concerned about answering with-held number, often through the evening, and starting those negative experiences, at night, when I was alone. Sometimes I would call national helplines at night to help me feel more sane and less distressed.

    I had to complain and again , send death certificates to stop contact, still being unaware of the factual history of the /any alleged debt.

    The complaints process seemed to have worked. I received an apology stating that the organisations precesses had not been followed as they should.

    The Restriction

    It was me who contacted Link about the initial restriction my solicitor found during standard searches when i was selling my property.

    It was me who was proactive about contacting Link, and it was your organisation who then either couldn't or failed to trace the account , yet demanded 216 plus 50 admin , without giving me actual details of the debt, or if it was legally recoverable. Or was in fact mine. To date , no one has explained this properly to me.

    In fear of losing my sale I paid the said amount.

    I felt degraded when family, friends , professionals and indeed the first buyers hinted at either me being stupid for paying something i knew nothing about , or asking if there was more to this than i was making them aware of , and/or was I “ playing things down”

    When I told people the honest truth, I really felt they didn't believe that the problem was as big as it was, because nothing made sense. Especially as I never had anything in writing to show them.

    A 13 year old boy, son of a friend listened to a conversation i was having with his parents about paying the alleged debt, without proof, just to get the restriction removed , and suddenly said “ you must be stupid, you only have to watch Judge Rinder to realise this company are taking you for a mug, because they wont tell you anything, yet are demanding your money, because judge Rinder always insists on getting things in writing”

    I wanted the earth to open up and swallow me, because he was right.

    I lost the sale as a direct result of not getting the restriction removed, and was no further forward.

    Telling people that the sale had fallen through even though I had paid the sum over made me feel and appeared stupid. I honestly and truthfully felt no one believed me

    I felt ashamed , stupid , isolated and at risk of never ever making sense of what was happening Because your agents failed to communicate or even take any appropriate action at all.

    I felt trapped in the mess of the sale and bombarded by solicitors and estate agents with their questions about the alleged debt. A rumour started that it wasn't 216 but was actually 216, 000 and thats what caused the original buyers because the restriction had no sign of being removed. You cant imagine how that made me feel.

    Everyone repeatedly asked me if i was exaggerating , catastrophesizing, making things up, having second thoughts about selling, genuine about selling. Lying about not having contact with Link, Link not lifting the restriction or even updating my solicitor. This was so oppressive, i could never escape from it.

    My plans/life was on hold with no hint at how it would change. This was totally down to LINK. Maladministration.

    It really made me ill. I became isolated, withdrawn , irregular sleep and eating patterns. Avoided contact with family and friends to stop the questions ect. As well as re living the situation. Even my eyebrows dropped out and i lost patches of beard and head hair

    I started having passive thoughts of escape, planning the easiest ways to commit suicide.

    During this time , the only thing that stopped me was the effect it could on whoever found me, or the family and friends who i felt were giving up on me because i was keeping them and their questions and judgements away.

    I missed regular health appointment And got a referral to an out of authority mental health service. I was also prescribed metrazapam.

    The despair resulted in me starting to organise my funeral and i travelled 60 miles to secure my natural burial plot .

    After fighting those passive thoughts of escape, i suddenly hit rock bottom.

    What tipped me over the edge and caused me to break down, was an out of the , blue demand for another 1300+ to release the restriction i had already paid to have lifted .

    No one had ever supplied me with the history of the debt spread ofer 5 linked accounts and how it related to me.

    It was the day Before halloween and i paid the requested money to my solicitor , then, reading the copy of the letter she forwarded me, which didnt give any clear information about the debt history or if it was legally recoverable, i felt trapped and more vulnerable,

    I was of the opinion i was being bullied into submission, at a time when I was at my most vulnerable, and so very low, and in fear of what i was planning to do to myself.

    I then googled the named solicitor on the letter , in order to contact them to ask if they could tell me how long it would take to lift the restriction once the payment was made .

    I was horrified when all the bad/negative listings identified the solicitors bad practice, and also that of LINK.

    I was physically sick , and found myself Shaking violently on my kitchen floor.

    I then made numerous phone calls and sent multiple emails to anyone i could find to within your company AskIng/begging them to intervene. I also sent the same to any santander email I could find, because the letter referred to 5 Santander Cards.

    I am not proud of what I did and how I did it, or the content of the conversations or emails , but it saved my life.

    That experience was worse than finding someone dead as a result of suicide, and the overwhelming feeling of disgust I had for myself is still with me. That feeling comes from being violated in my own home by your organisation over a period of time which gradually left me demoralised, isolated and at serious risk of harm because you failed in your duty of care to me.

    Its seems strange , but the acknowledgement that i should have not been put through all this , because LINK staff operated outside the boundaries of acceptability reinforced just how pathetic and worthless I was, for allowing your organisation put me in this situation and treat me this way for such a long time.

    I can only think this must be the same emotional dread, a victim of domestic violence could feel. This corporate bullying and systematic abuse of power was horrendous.

    Im really not sure I will ever get over this vile experience.

    This poor practice was evidenced, and reinforced too, by the lack of professionalism LINK showed towards my solicitor .

    You are more than aware of the time and effort myself and my solicitor have put into all this.

    Even the dozens of messages that i have left and not had responses to has been degrading. Even the admin problem sending written mail to a dead man , 18 months after his suicide. And knowing that i had left that address , was degrading , upsetting and time consuming .

    I was in a position where i had to put some items in storage, gave lots of furniture and personal belongs away , due to not knowing if or when i would get to move.

    I pestered my solicitor.

    I went away on a 3 week vacation that had been planned and paid for 2 years previously. Although i had to wait till as late as i could to book the flights, which were more expensive. I spent 13 days in my cabin, then in resort , stayed in my room. I shouldn't have gone

    As detailed above, you really cant appreciate the emotional damage you have caused.

    Even now , writing this, explaining and illustrating what i have been put through is humiliating, degrading and although I'm sure you feel it is necessary. I really don't think how actually doing it, reinforces just what i have been though.

    I feel I am begging to have my voice heard.

    Post Traumatic Distress from what you have put me through has left me fearful of never ever being affective as an adult , and a valuable member of society.

    My family don't know half of what i am telling you in this, because i am so ashamed of how it broke me. I was choosing a way out of it all, but by no means was it an easy option.

    You may or may not appreciate this , and I dont know how this can be measured effectively, but explaining away this history with friends, family and professionals like doctors, my solicitor, and the housing company for my new house, i feel totally embarrassed, humiliated, and degraded.

    I was simply trying to keep them in the loop at the beginning of this process, it ended in me feeling pathetic.

    I know find myself making a statements and justifying them and elaborating, and explaining the same information in different ways , then checking out they believe me, and apologise for doing so, and leaving that contact/interaction feeling stupid ashamed and vulnerable.

    I have no doubt that most of the professionals and some friends cant believe whats happened, and think of me as a village idiot.

    I feel LINK have taken away my dignity
    Your initial offer of 350 for all my distress compounds your organisations failure to be open , honest and transparent in assessing the impact of its actions on people adversely effected by poor practice, bad management and their lack of care and professionalism.

    I struggle to even contemplate how this amount was arrived at. Is 350 what Dignity costs these days ?

    Again, taking the maximum time allowed to respond to my complaint, almost to the minute, demonstrated “ I Don't Matter”

    I really do hope you have enough information to enable you to make a fair, open and honest decision about appropriate compensation. I have been asked to but down in writing what my experiences have been and apart from the factual losses are concerned, I can evidence this and enclose it with this document

    o As for the “trouble and upset” how do I put a figure on that. This is a degrading act in itself.

    Although my own self-worth has been at rock bottom and I feel worthless. That doesn't make me worthless. So i put it to you to do the right thing . Someone who was made aware of this situation commented that 15000 to 20000 would be appropriate, but the more I think about it , I am finding I am trying to put a price on my Dignity and to me , which this to me is priceless.

    I would appreciate you coming back to me with an appropriate fair offer.

    If you are unable to do this, I am prepared to take my complaint to the ombudsman.

    I have repeatedly stated I NEED this over with at the earliest possible opportunity.

    Please do the right thing. We cant go back to the beginning and start again, but we can start now and achieve an appropriate outcome. You owe me that.

    In re examining this history , i really am not sure what i could have done differently. Other than stop everything in its tracks until this matter was sorted. However , too much investments on part and the failures by LINK, meant I was at the mercy of practitioners , who , for whatever reason, operated outside the boundaries of acceptability.I tried constantly tried to minimise the effect of all this on my life.

    I am at a financial loss, i lost the house i was going to buy with my son, the new house has now been delayed until May , and since 27 November 2018 i have had to live in temporary B&B accommodation, often not knowing which accommodation i will be staying in that night, what it will be like, or even how much it will cost. I am paying on average 900 per month for this.

    All this is a knock on effect of not being able to have the informed choices and make appropriate plans/ arrangements to live in safe affordable accommodation

    Even my son had to withdraw from selling his house, because of the uncertainty of all this, snd losing the house we were buying together. He lost 1000 estate agent fees.

    The storage cost for the personal belongs i have had to sore has reached 1800, and continuing

    I can produce invoices for any transactions I have needed to make

    I want to know how you need to physical and emotional effects on my health.

    Please confirm what I need to do


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