Architect issue with extension drawings

kasworld · 5 March 2018 at 10:31PM

Hello all!

I hope you can help with some much needed advice with some issues we are having with an architect.

So the story goes like this, we had a few architects come over to our property to give us quotes for drawing up our planning and building drawings. This one guy which I spoke with over the phone had given me an estimate for doing the drawings and confirmed the estimate by email. He came over to my property to discuss the extension further and we showed him a sketch that we had done of the planned extension. At this stage he verbally confirmed that he would be happy to stick to the prices given in the email and therefore we agreed to go ahead with his services.

The same guy then came back to our house to take measurements, during this visit he asked us how much he had quoted us to do the job and then made a remark that he normally charges more. However, he made a note of the quote and then said that the next stage would be for him to send us an invoice for which we would pay 40% as a deposit and he would then go ahead and send us an initial draft of the drawings within 2 weeks of payment.

Today, to my surprise , I have received the invoice but it is more expensive than the quote he verbally agreed to in his email by £100. I made him aware of this pricing error to which his reasoning was that the fact that we were removing the wall between the kitchen and diner and a chimney have accounted for these extra costs, even though we made him aware of this from the start and other quotes we had received from other architects included this in their price.

I feel this has been a bad way to start a relationship with the person I am trusting with the drawings for our extension and feel like I have lost confidence in this guy going forward with our project. I mean how do I know he is not going to keep on changing his word/ prices.

My question is would we be liable for any charges to this architect if were to decide to go with a different architect at this stage? He has not started any drawings, and at no stage has he mentioned there will be any charges to us for the 2 visits to our house he has made and I have not signed any agreements. All he has done is measure up the area of the extension.

Thanks in advance for your responses and sorry for the essay (I am slightly angry with the lack of professionalism from this guy and waste of our time)

System · 5 March 2018 at 10:44PM

seems like a very strange way to do business, is the person a registered architect? (my usual first question)
If they haven't undertaken any work and have changed their quote when asking for a deposit (another strange ask imo) - I can't see what you are liable for.
Obviously they have taken some time to take measurements which they might ask for payment for - but it's difficult to understand what's going on here! were they the cheapest per chance?

kasworld · 5 March 2018 at 10:59PM

If I am honest, I could not see him as registered on the RIBA and ARB sites and found him by checking our local boroughs planning site. He seemed to have submitted quite a few applications in the area so I thought he would be a good choice based on that. Rookie mistake from my part!

He was definitely not the cheapest by any means and in fact on par with the most expensive quotes I had received but his drawings looked detailed to me and he assured us that he could also design the structural beams for the extension. I just feel that I should have gone with someone who was registered which is what I am inclined to do now but I don't want to be liable for any costs as he has not delivered anything for us other than mess us around.

Furts · 6 March 2018 at 7:38AM

The Architect may be the innocent one here. You seem unsure on what happened . You say you phoned for a "quote", yet you received an "estimate". Then consider reality. How can anyone quote accurately for work without first seeing this work?

Perhaps there is more work involved than allowed for in the "quote/estimate"? you may have said this, you may not, the Architect may not have understood your intentions - who knows but it is just one person versus another here.

All round it does trivial to be arguing over £100. This is not a major rip off sum. I would be paying it and going ahead, but monitoring matters from now on.

kasworld · 6 March 2018 at 8:21AM

Hi Furts

To be clear. I totally appreciate and respect that you cannot price a job without seeing the work. Nor would I expect him to. As mentioned in my previous post, he has come over to my house twice and we have gone through the work involved in detail and confirmed the costs involved verbally on 2 occasions. Whilst I appreciate he probably deals with many clients and may have forgotten the agreed price once, but on his second visit he made a note of his agreed price on his notepad and said he would stick to it. I totally would have understood once viewing the work involved (very basic square kitchen extension by the way) if he would have explained that the quote would be more due to x y z reasons which would then have enabled me to make an informed decision and either stick with him or choose someone else.

Even in his email which he sent with the invoice he did not explain that he was now charging more as he probably thought I would just pay it.

Trust me it is not the case of me being difficult for the sake of £100. More so that I find his service has been very unprofessional so far and not what I expect especially for the amount he is charging in total (circa 2.5k planning and building drawings) which he could increase at his own will once again. I have lost faith in him providing me with the service I need and would like to now go with a registered architect before this guy starts any drawings.

theonlywayisup · 6 March 2018 at 8:46AM

kasworld wrote: »

I need and would like to now go with a registered architect before this guy starts any drawings.

Do it then. Let the current contractor know asap and ask for his final invoice.

Furts · 6 March 2018 at 9:25AM

kasworld wrote: »

Hi Furts

To be clear. I totally appreciate and respect that you cannot price a job without seeing the work. Nor would I expect him to. As mentioned in my previous post, he has come over to my house twice and we have gone through the work involved in detail and confirmed the costs involved verbally on 2 occasions. Whilst I appreciate he probably deals with many clients and may have forgotten the agreed price once, but on his second visit he made a note of his agreed price on his notepad and said he would stick to it. I totally would have understood once viewing the work involved (very basic square kitchen extension by the way) if he would have explained that the quote would be more due to x y z reasons which would then have enabled me to make an informed decision and either stick with him or choose someone else.

Even in his email which he sent with the invoice he did not explain that he was now charging more as he probably thought I would just pay it.

Trust me it is not the case of me being difficult for the sake of £100. More so that I find his service has been very unprofessional so far and not what I expect especially for the amount he is charging in total (circa 2.5k planning and building drawings) which he could increase at his own will once again. I have lost faith in him providing me with the service I need and would like to now go with a registered architect before this guy starts any drawings.

I think you are stuck between a rock and a hard place. You have a bad feeling over £100. However you have engaged this person. If you cancel this engagement then it is reasonable for you to be billed for one, or both, visits plus thinking and preparation. The Architect could put any reasonable sum against these occasions then invoice you for this. Of course, whether you pay and what sum, is up to you.

If you are being this uncertain before ever leaving the starting line with your extension, then I wonder if you have the mindset to progress all the way through the building works - there will be issues and problems. There will be money issues to discuss, variations, extras and stress.

It is your decision over your architect. However, rather than argue over £100 you could, and perhaps should, be managing and controlling this individual. By doing so there will be no more additional costs, or doubts, because you are in control. Plus being in control is a vital mindset - if it does not exist now then it is worrying on how your building works may turn out.

kasworld · 6 March 2018 at 9:29AM

Thanks, will be contacting him today.

Do you think he can charge me for anything as he has not provided me with any service whatsoever. This invoice he sent me was to go ahead and start drafting the drawings for which he measured up for. He did not have any input on our design as we done that and at no point has he advised he charges for visiting my property.

fezster · 6 March 2018 at 9:32AM

kasworld wrote: »

Hi Furts

To be clear. I totally appreciate and respect that you cannot price a job without seeing the work. Nor would I expect him to. As mentioned in my previous post, he has come over to my house twice and we have gone through the work involved in detail and confirmed the costs involved verbally on 2 occasions. Whilst I appreciate he probably deals with many clients and may have forgotten the agreed price once, but on his second visit he made a note of his agreed price on his notepad and said he would stick to it. I totally would have understood once viewing the work involved (very basic square kitchen extension by the way) if he would have explained that the quote would be more due to x y z reasons which would then have enabled me to make an informed decision and either stick with him or choose someone else.

Even in his email which he sent with the invoice he did not explain that he was now charging more as he probably thought I would just pay it.

Given your description of events, I'd say he is chancing his arm that you will just pay the extra without questioning it. A poor way to do business IMO, and I would use somebody else just on principle. It's also an indication of his honesty and you need to decide if you can trust a person like this going forwards.

In my experience, you need to be on good terms with your architect and have complete confidence in them, as there may be many more conversations and meetings going forwards, depending on the complexity of the build. You should also discuss up front any charges associated with these additional consultations.

fezster · 6 March 2018 at 9:37AM

kasworld wrote: »

Do you think he can charge me for anything as he has not provided me with any service whatsoever. This invoice he sent me was to go ahead and start drafting the drawings for which he measured up for. He did not have any input on our design as we done that and at no point has he advised he charges for visiting my property.

From a legal standpoint, this is determined by any contract which exists between you (written or verbal).

From an ethical standpoint, it would be incredibly unfair to take up someone's time without recompense if you had simply changed your mind. But referring to my previous post, in this case, I'd be annoyed at his shameless attempt to increase the cost without discussion first and make him realise that he cannot conduct business in this way.

kasworld · 6 March 2018 at 9:37AM

Hi fezster - That is exactly the way I am feeling. He certainly did not fill me with much confidence going forward with him as he broke that trust.

Architect issue with extension drawings

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