Green, ethical, energy issues in the news

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  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    More info on earlier discussions about coal burning peaks in the UK currently:-

    Polluting UK coal plants export power to France as cold weather bites
    Polluting coal power stations in Britain have been profiting from the woes of the low-carbon French nuclear industry this month, according to analysis of energy generation data for the Guardian.

    Tricastin, one of France’s biggest nuclear power stations, was closed by the French regulator in September so that works could be undertaken to address a flood risk.

    The plant’s reactors make up four of the 39 currently offline in the French nuclear power industry, which experienced even worse outages last winter due to regulatory safety checks.

    The operators of Britain’s eight remaining coal power stations appear to have stepped in to exploit higher French prices, exporting power across the channel as temperatures have plunged. UK coal power generation has declined rapidly in recent years under the carbon tax.

    Most of the time, France sends electricity to the UK through 43-mile-long cables between Folkestone and a site near Calais, but in November there have been more hours when power has flowed in the other direction.

    OK, who's gonna be first to post '24/7?' :doh:
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • zeupater wrote: »
    I'm really starting to have worries about a company starting to operate beyond it's reach & losing focus on key products .... with Tesla it's batteries, everything they're doing relies on ramping-up battery supply and quickly reducing costs through economies of scale

    I was just about to come on here to say that batteries seem to be the principal stumbling block at the moment (view other car manufacturers' issues with volumes too), but I see the point has already been made.

    On the cornering the market side there is still BYD (?) from China who are major in electric buses, and other makers too. Fleet managers know what they need from costs and range as well, to a lot more accurate level than consumers!

    The situation seems promising but worrying from an implementation point of view, like most complicated projects... Most of the objections really aren't valid when you look at them. For example on one web site somebody was saying a lorry with the maximum speed of 56mph was a no-goer for the highway, so I had to point out that that was the maximum legal speed in the UK and EU, often controlled by speed governors etc.

    Anyway, interesting times, and if it stops even one person from parroting "but what about deliveries and good's vehicles?" the launch will have achieved something.
  • michaels
    michaels Posts: 28,003 Forumite
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    Martyn1981 wrote: »
    More info on earlier discussions about coal burning peaks in the UK currently:-

    Polluting UK coal plants export power to France as cold weather bites



    OK, who's gonna be first to post '24/7?' :doh:
    It would amuse me if it turns out the french sell us leccy for virtually nothing cos supply exceeds demand and we sell to them at peak spot when their reactors go down :)
    I think....
  • ed110220
    ed110220 Posts: 1,475 Forumite
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    michaels wrote: »
    It would amuse me if it turns out the french sell us leccy for virtually nothing cos supply exceeds demand and we sell to them at peak spot when their reactors go down :)

    Yeah, I would expect so given that when France has "spare" nuclear electricity it must sell it for whatever it can get for it, while Britain's dirty fossil fuel power stations can be fired up on demand (or down and save fuel) and therefore generate when prices are high.

    It's not actually that unusual for Britain to export electricity to France, it's just the recent scale that is a bit unusual. What many people don't realise is that although France's electricity generating capacity is above its average demand and is therefore a net exporter, it is below its peak demand. Therefore when electricity demand is very high, France needs to import power from its neighbours. This also means that we tend to export power to France in winter when demand is high, and import from France in summer when France has spare (and on a smaller scale export during the day/early evening and import overnight). Doesn't help with the fabled British peak demand, but it does from an emissions point of view.
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  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    ed110220 wrote: »
    What many people don't realise is that although France's electricity generating capacity is above its average demand and is therefore a net exporter, it is below its peak demand. Therefore when electricity demand is very high, France needs to import power from its neighbours.

    Yep, and to make it worse, a lot of Germany's lignite generation is only viable due to exports, and a lot of that goes to France. So whilst Germany does burn a lot of coal and lignite still, it could reduce it considerably if demand/need for the export was reduced.

    Germany Could Shutter 20 Oldest Brown Coal Plants Without Creating Energy Shortages

    And one of the comments:-
    In germany a power plant cannot simply shut down because it is out of money. They need to get permission from the grid manager to insure the shutdown would not be harmful to the grid. This requires a study that can take some time to do. Which would increase the financial losses.

    Apparently many plants that are barely profitable decided it was easier to sell the power in different markets. So for about the last 15 years every increase in renewable generation resulted in an increase in Energy exports to another country (France, poland, Denmark and others). So today Germany exports more power than anyone else in Europe.

    If other European countries decided to stop accepting power from germany those 20 plants would have to shut down. If those power plant were allowed to shut down whenever they wanted they would have shut down years ago.

    A couple of years ago some about 8 power pants applied for permission to shut down. Apparently the export power lines were maxed out and they couldn't export any more power. Some of the 8 were shut down. The Others were put in reserve. The reserve power plants are are maintained and not used unless a power shortage occurs. So most of the time the reserve power plants don't burn any coal.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    A couple of articles on Australia from yesterday which I think link nicely.

    One is about the government's support to keep an old coal generation plant going, despite it looking like renewables would be far cheaper, and the second is about renewables being able to provide 50% of generation without significant storage deployment.

    These articles are important because the amount of generation RE can supply 'before problems occur' tends to be 'just' above the level of RE any country already has, according to critics. So we've seen 20%, 25%, 30% etc but the number keeps going up.

    Also, and with reference to a recent thread on network costs for PV'ers, Australian domestic PV is a problem for the leccy generators and suppliers as PV reduces import by about 40%, or with storage, about 95%.

    If Aus puts up network charges much more (they are already around Aus$400 pa) then they simply encourage people to go off-grid, and effectively contribute $4,000 over 10 years to the cost of transistion.

    So Aus is working with PV households and buying battery leccy off them to reduce peak leccy prices.

    I think it's fair to say that Aus will be the leaders in storage going forward, helping to test and reduce the cost of domestic, commercial and grid scale storage for all of us.

    Renewables could reliably contribute 50% to power grid, says Finkel report
    Australia’s power grid can reach penetrations of 50% renewable energy without a significant requirement for storage to support reliability, according to a new report commissioned by Australia’s chief scientist, Alan Finkel.

    While the Turnbull government has made much of the need for storage to increase security and reliability in the national power grid, the new report from the Australian Council of Learned Academies (Acola) says at an aggregated national level, 50% renewables is possible without major investments in storage for reliability purposes.

    But the report also points out that the requirement to shore-up network security as power systems decarbonise in accordance with international climate policy commitments is an ongoing task, and that transition means energy storage is now a major global growth industry.

    Replacing Liddell coal plant with clean energy $1.3bn cheaper – analysis
    Replacing the Liddell coal power station with clean energy technologies would slash pollution and be at least $1.3bn cheaper than the Turnbull government’s plan to extend the life of the New South Wales plant by five years, a new analysis has found.

    A second report released on Monday also found Australia has the potential to lead the world in developing large and home-scale energy storage systems if public uncertainty can be overcome.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    A tidal barrage scheme is progressing, perhaps this will help with the tidal lagoons, or even the Severn Tidal barrage?

    Atlantis agrees Wyre tidal terms
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    California is just showing off now:-

    California To Meet 2030 Renewable Energy Targets By 2020
    A new report from the California Public Utilities Commission has concluded that the state’s major utilities have already met or will all soon exceed the state’s 2020 renewable energy target of 33%, and will likely meet the 2030 target of 50% by 2020.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • gefnew
    gefnew Posts: 876 Forumite
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    A bit from the house of commons audit committee.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42065837
    The poorest will be hit the hardest from hinkley point.
    regards
    gefnew
  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    edited 22 November 2017 at 8:59AM
    gefnew wrote: »
    A bit from the house of commons audit committee.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42065837
    The poorest will be hit the hardest from hinkley point.
    regards
    gefnew

    Interesting.

    Just a few clarifications from the article.

    1. It states that the top up payments are about £30bn, but that's the figure from the 2016 NAO report. Since then future wholesale leccy prices have been revised down further, lifting the subsidy element to around £46bn.

    2. EDF state:
    "The agreed price is lower than 80% of other low carbon capacity contracted so far and the project has restarted UK nuclear construction after a quarter century.

    The 80% figure is probably true, but relates to the fact that off-shore wind contracts so far have been very high. But those contracts prices have fallen in every auction and the latest is £57.50/MWh v's £92.50/MWh for HPC (2012 prices).

    And, as always needs stating, the renewables subsidies are their first, dating back about 10yrs, whilst nuclear has been subsidised for 60yrs already.

    CfD rates can be compared here: CfD Register

    3. For anyone interested, when the HPC deal was being made, the NAO state:-
    2.8 The HPC strike price appears cost-competitive with other technologies in part because of the way it is structured. At the outset of negotiations, the Department set its negotiating team a firm mandate that a fixed strike price should lie in the range £78-£85/MWh (in 2012 prices). This was to ensure broad comparability with onshore wind costs, the cheapest renewable technology at the time, and new gas power stations delivering in 2020. To achieve this strike price, the Department agreed to a CfD longer than the standard 15-year term to spread the costs, and with the strike price indexed to inflation. Our!analysis shows to achieve the same investor return a 15-year CfD would have required a headline strike prices of around £113/MWh (in 2012 prices). The Department also considered that having a CfD with a longer duration would have helped EDF secure debt finance for the project, although it subsequently financed HPC using equity along with the investment from CGN.

    Firm mandate for £78-£85, giving a deal of £92.50!

    £78 v's £92.50 works out at £13bn in additional subsidies.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
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