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  • FIRST POST
    Polly Doodle
    Kensington Mortgages - PPI
    • #1
    • 24th Aug 11, 8:07 AM
    Kensington Mortgages - PPI 24th Aug 11 at 8:07 AM
    I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction. My Husband and I made an application for a mortgage with The Mortgage Lender (TML) who then arrange for us to have a mortgage with Kensington Mortgages. On top of what we wanted to borrow, they added £1800 for PPI. As the mortgage was repaid my husband and I wrote to Kensington to get a copy of our file as we were not sure whether it had been added or not. As it was, we then sent a form to reclaim the PPI. Kensington have now written back to us and said that as the mortgage was taken out with a broker it was not sold by Kensington Mortgages. Now this amount was added to our mortgage and the monthly payment made to Kensington so we were paying interest on it. They have told me to go back to TML or if they are no longer operating (as if they didnt know they had ceased trading,) to contact the Financial Services Compensation Scheme. Are they rightt o tell me to do this of are they fobbing me off.

    TML was I believe taken over by I think Resolve and guess what I tried phoning their number on the website and they no longer exist. Talk about take your money and run.

    Any info would be greatly appreciated as we do not know what to do next. Kensington have actually confirmed there was PPI on the mortgage.
Page 2
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 21st Sep 13, 11:19 AM
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    dunstonh
    I really thought if you were paying it together with your mortgage to that particular company, there would be proof you took this ppi out
    THere would be proof if you took it out. That is not the issue. The problem is that is pre-regulation.

    I think this is dreadful you can not claim just because you go through a broker even tho you pay this insurance together with your mortgage repayments to this company, so there is no way I can claim at all then?
    Its not a claim. It is a complaint. PPI is not a legal thing. It is an FSA issue. The broker was not regulated by the FSA at the point of sale. So, in effect, he didnt break any FSA rules as he wasnt regulated by the FSA.

    If you wanted to make any complaint then it would only be to the broker. No-one else. However, the broker has gone. If it was post regulation, then there is the FSCS. However, they only consider sales made after January 2005. If before then, its game over.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • societys child
    • By societys child 21st Sep 13, 11:59 AM
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    societys child
    Thank you dunstonh

    I really thought if you were paying it together with your mortgage to that particular company, there would be proof you took this ppi out!!! most of my friends at the time went through a broker and went to this cowboy compan,

    I think this is dreadful you can not claim just because you go through a broker even tho you pay this insurance together with your mortgage repayments to this company, so there is no way I can claim at all then?

    kind regards
    Originally posted by scruffyonion
    You appear to be under the impression that because you had PPI you can claim it back.
    Even if you had someone to complain to, you would still need to show why you believe it was mis-sold "just having it" is not a valid reason..

  • _Andy_
    Thank you dunstonh

    I really thought if you were paying it together with your mortgage to that particular company, there would be proof you took this ppi out!!!
    Originally posted by scruffyonion
    You're not paying it 'with' the mortgage as such. You borrowed a higher amount on the mortgage which paid in a lump sum for the policy. This premium went to the insurance company not the mortgage company.
  • HolidayMaker123
    I am also having issues with Kensington over my PPI payments.

    The policy was sold by a financial advisor who has since ceased trading.

    As the payments were taken alongside the mortgage I assumed, wrongly, that the policy was with Kensington. If I had needed to make a claim I would have called them and I am assuming they would have referred me to the correct company. If this is the case why are they unable/unwilling to give me the details now?

    I am beginning to think that the PPI company is a subsidiary of Kensington.
    • -taff
    • By -taff 26th Sep 13, 5:05 AM
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    -taff
    It doesn't really matter who they are, the broker sold it to you, and no one else has responsibility for the sale.
    Complaining to the underwriter is a last ditch attempt because they don't have to accept responsibility.
    They may have destroyed all your details, since it sounds like this was some time ago.
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 26th Sep 13, 7:50 AM
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    dunstonh
    As the payments were taken alongside the mortgage I assumed, wrongly, that the policy was with Kensington. If I had needed to make a claim I would have called them and I am assuming they would have referred me to the correct company. If this is the case why are they unable/unwilling to give me the details now?
    You wouldnt have called Kensington. You would have called the broker or the insurer. Kensington probably wouldnt even know you had PPI (or any other type of insurance) as they have no reason to know.

    I am beginning to think that the PPI company is a subsidiary of Kensington.
    That is not the case.

    If your sale was before January 2005 then its game over. If your sale was after January 2005 you can complain to the FSCS. However, be aware that the uphold rate for the FSCS against mortgage brokers is just 5%. MPPI has a low success rate and advisers have an even lower success rate.
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • Michaels nanny
    • By Michaels nanny 1st Mar 16, 11:21 AM
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    Michaels nanny
    I'm lost & very confused
    Hi, having read all these posts about Kensington I'm really confused. Like many on this thread, we took out a remortgage with TML later transferred to Kensington. Although we already had a payment protection with our original mortgage with Coventry, we were told we Couldn't have the remortgage without taking out TML's ppi. I contacted the company the ppi was with, Provident, & they named the person who sold us the PPI & said that he was employed by the mortgage company.
    Have we any rights to claim against Kensington?
    TIA Lesley
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 1st Mar 16, 12:16 PM
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    dunstonh
    Hi, having read all these posts about Kensington I'm really confused. Like many on this thread, we took out a remortgage with TML later transferred to Kensington. Although we already had a payment protection with our original mortgage with Coventry, we were told we Couldn't have the remortgage without taking out TML's ppi. I contacted the company the ppi was with, Provident, & they named the person who sold us the PPI & said that he was employed by the mortgage company.
    Have we any rights to claim against Kensington?
    TIA Lesley
    Originally posted by Michaels nanny
    No. The lender has no liability for the sale of third party products unless it was an agent/employee of the lender.

    The broker carries the liability for the sale as they are the ones that made the sale. Brokers became regulated on 14th Jan 2005. Was yours before or after this?
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • magpiecottage
    • By magpiecottage 3rd Mar 16, 6:19 AM
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    magpiecottage
    No. The lender has no liability for the sale of third party products unless it was an agent/employee of the lender.
    Originally posted by dunstonh
    I believe Kensington has only ever sold mortgages through third parties so it would be the broker.

    It is also worth noting that PPI for a mortgage is generally considered worth having - because your home would have been at risk if you lost your income and could not keep up repayments.

    So you would have to show either that you would not have been eligible for a payout or that the cost of the cover outweighed the potential benefits. The latter is normally only able to be shown if it was a single premium policy and the premium was added to the loan.
    • kayn123
    • By kayn123 3rd Aug 17, 3:35 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    kayn123
    disbursements column
    where is this I too an getting a ppi specialist to look at my mortgage
    • dunstonh
    • By dunstonh 3rd Aug 17, 4:28 PM
    • 98,597 Posts
    • 67,050 Thanks
    dunstonh
    where is this I too an getting a ppi specialist to look at my mortgage
    Originally posted by kayn123
    Kensington never sold PPI. So, why employ a company to look at it?
    I am an Independent Financial Adviser (IFA). Comments are for discussion purposes only. They are not financial advice. If you feel an area discussed may be relevant to you, then please seek advice from an Independent Financial Adviser local to you.
    • andyinlondon
    • By andyinlondon 17th Aug 19, 9:54 AM
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    andyinlondon
    TML did sell ppi
    it was a tml who sold me the ppi and told me it was a condition of the mortgage and that tml would not grant the loan without it, they did know about the ppi, they sold it.
    if at first you don't succeed then sky diving is not for you.
    • -taff
    • By -taff 17th Aug 19, 10:01 AM
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    -taff
    Then it was a condition and not missold.
    • andyinlondon
    • By andyinlondon 17th Aug 19, 10:40 AM
    • 70 Posts
    • 24 Thanks
    andyinlondon
    not according to mse

    There are now grounds to make a complaint about a PPI policy based on the Plevin case. Technically, this isn't mis-selling Ė it's a breach of rules regarding fairness relating to the Consumer Credit Act Ė but the effect is the same.

    The Plevin case suggests almost anyone who has simply had a PPI policy was likely mis-sold, and could be due money back. Financial Conduct Authority rules say firms should generally consider a complaint on the grounds of an unfair relationship between lender and borrower if commission was above 50%. With PPI sales, typical commission stood at 67% so most people who took out PPI are likely owed.
    if at first you don't succeed then sky diving is not for you.
    • andyinlondon
    • By andyinlondon 17th Aug 19, 10:41 AM
    • 70 Posts
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    andyinlondon
    A. Were you told it was compulsory?

    It's a common complaint that consumers are told they must buy a policy from the same provider as the loan to be accepted for the product. This is mis-selling.

    If this applies to you, read the full 'I was told to have it' briefing
    Any company that subscribes to the voluntary Lending Code (see subscriber list) agrees it won't insist you buy an insurance product from it. Therefore if the salesperson...

    Didn't make it clear the policy was optional or tell you about any cooling off period.

    Implied or stated it would be more expensive if you didn't take the insurance.

    Implied or insisted you take out their policy to qualify for the product or help with your application.

    Was very pushy when selling the product, so you felt you could not say no.

    Would not let you continue with the application if you did not sign the insurance agreement as wel
    if at first you don't succeed then sky diving is not for you.
    • societys child
    • By societys child 17th Aug 19, 11:17 AM
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    societys child
    The Plevin case suggests almost anyone who has simply had a PPI policy was likely mis-sold,
    No it doesn't.

    • -taff
    • By -taff 17th Aug 19, 11:37 AM
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    -taff
    Plevin is based on excessive commission charges. You're not likely to have been charged excessive commission on a mortgage.


    it was a tml who sold me the ppi and told me it was a condition of the mortgage and that tml would not grant the loan without it, they did know about the ppi, they sold it.
    Originally posted by andyinlondon

    You have said it was a condition. Therefore not missold. Kensington mortgages are for those who are borrowing above the norm or those with bad credit or circumstances that mean they are unable to borrow from mainstream lenders. They usually came with additional requirements to protect the mortgage. You were free not to borrow from TML.

    Just having PPI does not mean it was missold or that you can complain it was missold and be successful.
    Last edited by -taff; 17-08-2019 at 11:47 AM.
    • CarlosP
    • By CarlosP 22nd Aug 19, 4:50 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    CarlosP
    Why donít we start a Class Action against Kensington
    I had a mortgage with Kensington and their salesman lied about just about every aspect of the product. I’m a former government fraud officer and I have no doubt that Kensington (through their sister company TML) engaged in Fraud: Obtaining Money By Deception, which is a Criminal Offence.

    Here’s the thing....being a former fraud officer, I electronically recorded the whole 2 to 3 hour meeting with the salesman from Kensington/ TML, in which the mortgage was sold and the forms were completed. In the recording of the meeting, you can clearly hear me repeatedly telling the salesman ([Name removed by Forum Team] of TML/ Kensington) that I don’t want nor need the PPI and each time he insists that it’s not possible to have the mortgage without it. This was an untruth and FRAUD.

    Later, I enquire about the interest rate and he goes on to tell another lie. The interest rate I was charged was not arrived at the way he said it would and was mich higher than he suggested it would be.

    If dealt with as a private criminal prosecution, it may be possible to use my recording along with your stories to support a case that they had a policy of routinely lying to customers about PPI and interest rates in orderto Obtain Money By Deception from customers and that this was a conspiracy between Kensington and it’s sister company, TML.

    Also I have a great deal of paperwork to support my case, but need to join forces with lots of former customers who have had the same experience.

    Let me know your thoughts....
    Last edited by MSE ForumTeam2; 22-08-2019 at 7:02 PM.
    • Moneyineptitude
    • By Moneyineptitude 22nd Aug 19, 5:06 PM
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    Moneyineptitude
    Let me know your thoughts....
    Originally posted by CarlosP
    My thoughts are that you may have illegally recorded this meeting and that any attempt to introduce it into court proceedings will therefore fail. I also doubt you'll get much support for an American-style "class action lawsuit".

    If you genuinely believe this lender has committed the crime of fraud, I suggest you simply call the police.
    • antrobus
    • By antrobus 22nd Aug 19, 10:38 PM
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    antrobus
    ....

    Iíve used many recording made with devices in public and in my home as evidence in court in the past, so your amateur lawyering wonít cut it with me, thank you.
    Originally posted by CarlosP
    Under RIPA 2000 it is not illegal for a private individual to record a conversation; however,

    Recording or monitoring is only prohibited where some of the contents of the communication are made available to a third party. If a person intends to make the conversation available, they must get the consent of the person being recorded.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4801072.stm

    What you did or did not do as a 'fraud investigator' would be neither here nor there, unless you were acting as one.

    P.S. Yes, 'amateur lawyering' and advice is what you get here in MSEland. Professional advice needs to be paid for. If you wish to take legal action of any kind against Kensington that is where I suggest you start.
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