CCJ from BE Legal/Excel relating to incident in 2012

TobyZ · 19 August 2017 at 12:07PM

Hi all,

So, yesterday was fun...Had what I have now discovered is the familiar shock of discovering a CCJ on my credit record about which I had no knowledge prior to a CCJ. Have spent a day reading all the amazing material on here, peppipoo and the Parking Prankster, which has made me realise I'm far from alone in this. Less anxious, but now more angry!

The situation, based on the info I've been able to gather, is this - I am the registered keeper of a vehicle which they allege committed an offence in Chorlton Square car park in March 2012. It seems from the forums that this location is a pretty notorious one as it has a road running through it which is treated as part of the car park but is not properly marked as such.

I honestly have no idea who was driving the car then or what happened (and I have no paperwork to go on either at present). I moved house in July 2012, and then again in July 2013. The CCJ was served to my old (nearly 5 yrs out of date) address in March 2017. Obviously, I never found out anything until yesterday when the check on Experian started a long day of panicky phone calls and reading on this forum. In addition, I sold the car the incident relates to in February 2016, so I wasn't even the registered keeper any more when the CCJ was issued.

My initial intention was to apply for set aside without consent. Indeed, I have already paid the £255 court fee for a set aside without consent application as I was super-worried about all the stuff saying that an application had to be made quickly, and the Court advised over the phone that paying the fee would be treated as notice of an intention to make an application.

I do think, based on my reading here, that I would have a strong case to get the set aside and to dispute the ticket, in particular as it relates to an alleged offense which dates to before the FOPA 2012 legislation.However, there are a couple complications regarding my case (which I'd be keen to discuss in PMs if someone is willing but don't want to mention here at present) which I am anxious could impact on my ability to get the contested set aside granted. The main concern for me (as with many) is the impact this would have on my credit record - paying the fine is not an issue financially, though I do hate to reward bottom feeding behaviour.

I am wondering if my best course of action might be to lodge the contested set aside paperwork, to demonstrate that I'm serious and know how to contest, while also contacting BW Legal or Excel to see if they will agree to an uncontested set aside. It seems from what I've read on here that this is the "play it safe" and "low time cost" option - if you can get them to agree to it (which appears not to be too hard), then you pay up, the CCJ gets wiped off and you can go on with your life. I'm also tempted by this option because I'm going to be very busy with work and family stuff in the next couple of months so I could do without having to set aside lots of time to prepare for and attend court hearings etc.

What do you guys think? Is this a viable strategy? What's the best way to go about getting BW Legal or Excel to agree to the uncontested set-aside if so? How do I make sure that everyone follows through and wipes the CCJ off my credit record (which is my primary concern here)? Is it possible to withdraw my contested set aside application if I get the Claimants to agree to an uncontested set aside, and if so do I get some of the money back?

I've also prepared a draft Witness Statement based on successful contested set asides I've read on here and peppipoo - if it is worth at least starting the contested set aside process then I'd be really keen to get advice/feedback from you guys on this.

Thanks in advance for all your help - these forums have been a godsend for me already. So much information, and its amazing to know that there are smart hard working people who have your back when the cowboys ride into town!

[Deleted User] · 19 August 2017 at 1:07PM

You could do what I do. Send the defendant a copy of your application....

Tell them why you're going to win (i.e. that proceedings were never received and with a 5 y.o. address they had no reasonable basis upon which to rely on that as a last known address)

Then invite them to consent with "no order for costs" for the order to be set aside. This means you lose £255 but get the judgment set aside. As you note, you may also have to agree to pay them £100 or some other sum for the PCN if they are to simply agree by return.

No one here can tell you whether you should fight or take the quickest & easiest route to cleaning up your credit record, which is a serious business.

Just how angry are you? Obviously, if you fight, you get the opportunity to claim costs if you win.

Having already paid for the application notice no additional fee is needed if a consent order is agreed, because it relates to the same application.

The sealed order then needs to be provided to the appropriate reference agencies to clean up your record.

peter_the_piper · 19 August 2017 at 1:11PM

Most of these problems stem from delays in changing DVLA records for car and driver (both) I hope you are now up to date.

TobyZ · 19 August 2017 at 1:13PM

Thanks Johnersh,

Couple of quick follow-ups:
So I send off my application, and then send a copy to the defendant? Who's the defendant I should send a copy of my application to? Is it BW Legal or Excel? If they agree to consent on the grounds you mention, how do I make sure they follow through with it properly? I've read stories on the forums of people going down this route then the parking firm not actually sending off their paperwork to remove the CCJ - requiring weeks of pestering to sort out.

If they agree, what's the process from there. I've seen mention to exchanges of letters drafted by solicitors - is that how you did it?

I'm pretty angry about the abusive practice, and will be writing to my MP about it, but to be honest I could do without all the hassle and stress of court hearings if I can get my credit record cleaned up this way.

TobyZ · 19 August 2017 at 1:15PM

I was tardy in updating DVLA records (not sure how tardy, haven't looked into it yet) - the year when this happened was a chaotic one for me with 2nd child born and two house moves. But the car in question was sold in early 2016, and the guy I sold it to runs a second hand car business so I definitely know all the paperwork was up to date with correct details at that point *at the latest*, more than a year before the CCJ was issued.

[Deleted User] · 19 August 2017 at 1:39PM

Sorry. I misread. I thought you'd already made and paid for the application.

If you've not, you can write and ask them to agree to a consent order to set aside. They will likely agree if you pay. Explain the circumstances as there is a reasonable chance you could get this set aside without their permission. A recent forum post covered exactly this. The PPC were going to do all the paperwork, too.

My concern with that is that you don't know if they will do it properly. If you lodge the application etc, you know it's done. However you do it, I think you need to prepare for time spent notifying the court and Experian etc. Others may be able to better steer you through that process. I'm strictly about the litigation

The more robust approach is to write with your draft application, say that they'll lose and invite them to agree to the set aside. This latter approach makes a fight more likely, but leaves the door open to you defending it wholly or reducing payment to a lower sum as a commercial settlement. If you're on the electoral roll and easily searchable, there is no reason why the claim should have been issued to an incorrect address.

The parties are the same - the PPC (not the lawyer) is the claimant, you are the defendant, but it is your application to set aside.

TobyZ · 19 August 2017 at 3:01PM

Thanks Johnersh,

The current situation is sort of a halfway house I think. I have paid the Court fee of £255 to make a set aside application, and I've written a draft Witness Statement based on my research on these and other forums, but I haven't actually deposited the paperwork yet. I did that in a bit of a panic yesterday before I'd really looked fully into the options.

So I guess I have three options:
1. Approach Excel about agreeing to a consent order without lodging or mentioning the draft application for set aside without consent, and see if they'll agree to that
2. Approach Excel but include my (unsent) draft Witness Statement, pointing out that I believe if I contest then I will win
3. Send off the set aside application, then approach Excel with a copy of it and say I'm willing to do uncontested if they consent

I guess my concern with 1 & 2 is that I don't know how quickly Excel will respond. Many people on the forums have emphasised the importance of making an application for set aside quickly, so I'm worried that delaying sending it off will damage my prospects if I need to go down that route.

I was also a bit surprised when you said sending my draft application "will make a fight more likely". I had thought the opposite - that if I show I mean business and could win, they'd be more likely to just consent and take the money. Is that wrong?

I'm genuinely unsure what to do now. My primary concern is to maximise my chances of getting the damn CCJ off my credit record. So I'd like to keep both options (set aside with consent and without) open if at all possible - but is that trying to have my cake and eat it? I guess one other thing I'm concerned about is whether approaching Excel about a consent order to set aside would harm my prospects if I had to go down the contested route. Could they use it against me somehow?

Sorry about all the questions - I've reading dozens of these cases on the forums but I still feel very out of my depth on all this!

[Deleted User] · 19 August 2017 at 6:37PM

No problems - get the application and statement across to them with this. If you've spent the money may as well press on. When is the hearing? Has the court confirmed?

The below draft order provided for the judgment to be set aside without you recouping the application costs or paying anything. If you decide to reach agreement regarding a payment, that can be done by a separate letter or with a schedule to the order (known as a Tomlin order)

CONSENT ORDER

UPON the application of the defendant dated xxxx
AND UPON agreement between the parties AND BY CONSENT

IT IS ORDERED THAT:

1. The judgment of District judge dated xxxx be set aside.
2. No order for costs

The parties agree to an order in the above terms

Signed (claimant). Signed (defendant)

Dated xxxx

Umkomaas · 19 August 2017 at 6:59PM

As I understand things ....... The consent order will cost you £100. Excel will likely want their PCN charge, plus the court costs they've expended, so you're probably looking at having to pay them £150+. Which means there's very little difference in the cost of a with or without consent approach.

The latter could be recovered from Excel, but they may reopen a fresh (but highly defendable) claim against you; the former provides no prospect of recovering your outlay, but means they won't press a new claim.

[Deleted User] · 19 August 2017 at 7:29PM

If the application is lodged £255 has already been spent. There will be no further fee for a consent order. The issue is now to fight for nil payment or spend more (probably) to get the PPC to agree without a hearing.

Coupon-mad · 19 August 2017 at 10:04PM

Might be just me, but with a pre-POFA PCN and no proof of who was driving, and (maybe) Manchester being the local court (it being a good court which understands the PPC scam), I would recommend seeing through the already paid-for set aside and then (probably) win at a full hearing, and get the £255 repaid among your costs.

This is the sort of case that I would stick my neck out and say, you would never have lost at a hearing, had you known about the claim. So, I may be missing something in my usual skim-reading, but I am unsure why you would skirt around the idea of a hearing now.

CCJ from BE Legal/Excel relating to incident in 2012

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