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  • FIRST POST
    • kpwll
    • By kpwll 18th Jul 14, 10:06 PM
    • 3,820Posts
    • 12,035Thanks
    kpwll
    stop/start
    • #1
    • 18th Jul 14, 10:06 PM
    stop/start 18th Jul 14 at 10:06 PM
    Can you please tell me if you can turn off or over-ride a stop/start facility on any/all cars with this function? Thank you.
Page 28
  • topdaddy
    I've no idea.

    You said it.

    Post #517 - you said an ST and a 1.6 TDCI werent comparable because one was more expensive than the other?
    Originally posted by motorguy
    Theyre not. A X5 AND a X6 are similar prices and are comparable. Agreed?
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 26th Jul 14, 6:47 PM
    • 19,696 Posts
    • 12,361 Thanks
    motorguy
    Theyre not. A X5 AND a X6 are similar prices and are comparable. Agreed?
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    Your stance of "you cant compare cars that arent the same price" seems to go against what you said earlier today?

    a base model isnt as good as the top of the range model regardless of marques or model.
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    By deciding if one is "better" than the other, then you're comparing them - yet you just said you cant compare cars of different prices?

    So on one hand you said the ST was better than a 1.6TDI Zetec, but then subsequently you said you couldnt compare the two because they werent the same price?

    Which is it?
    Life has never given me lemons.

    It has given me anger issues, anxiety, a love for alcohol and a serious dislike for stupid people, but not lemons.
  • topdaddy
    Your stance of "you cant compare cars that arent the same price" seems to go against what you said earlier today?



    By deciding if one is "better" than the other, then you're comparing them - yet you just said you cant compare cars of different prices?

    So on one hand you said the ST was better than a 1.6TDI Zetec, but then subsequently you said you couldnt compare the two because they werent the same price?

    Which is it?
    Originally posted by motorguy
    *sighs*
    A little bit if everyones lif is gone that'll never come back whilst im explain this bone stuff.
    Here goes. The st is better than the studio as it is the range topper and has specification that is exclusive to it. Ford sort of promote this as the "top of the range" but if not the st, which is performance based, the the titainium will be as it has the gadgets, and so also could be considered a range topper too. Bith these spefs are held in higher regard than the zetec spec. Ie they are better and priced accordingly. Now the base model (or the zetec as per your post) is considerably cheaper(base starting from 13995, st starting from 22295-a difference in price of approx 59%) and so for this difference you would expect a better car right? So you cannot compare the vehicles as they stand based on price but one would expect the dearer one to be better? Or not whatever, nothing would surpise me on this forum. So this leads us on to the similarly priced x's from bmw. Now they can be of the (virtually) same spec which would mean the spec wouldnt be the difference between the two cars(how could it be?) But the underlying car its self is the varible.
    This then in turn leads us on to your very earlier example of a 911. Its price (73 odd K) compared to 62 ish for the x6(according to parkers, the bimmer website is shocking, much worse than that what you would expect from typically germanic, well, germans) anyhoo, one would expect the x6 not to as good as a 911 but a comparison would be a little moot as they are completely different car types. As a generalisation, I would hazard a guess the 911 is percieved to be better but again, who knows how that will go on here.
    Finally, taking all that into account we have the comparison of the 1.4 mundane focus and the engineering benchmark that is the veyron. Again not directly comparable due to vehicle type cost etc. "This 1.4 focus is the best thing on four wheels and its much better than that veyron over there which I have also driven" said no one, ever.


    The veyron is betterif no one guessed, but disagree all you want with that.



    Got it?
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 26th Jul 14, 9:21 PM
    • 19,696 Posts
    • 12,361 Thanks
    motorguy

    so for this difference you would expect a better car right? So you cannot compare the vehicles as they stand based on price but one would expect the dearer one to be better?
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    Again you missed mine and everyone elses point who contributeds point - more expensive doesnt necessarily mean "better", but you seem to think it does. If your requirements are not to have a performance engine and bucket seats, but are to have an economical car that is comfy for all the family then an ST isnt "better"

    Because "better" is subjective - its about your own needs, not someone elses.

    If that still doesnt make sense, ask a grown up.


    This then in turn leads us on to your very earlier example of a 911. Its price (73 odd K) compared to 62 ish for the x6(according to parkers, the bimmer website is shocking, much worse than that what you would expect from typically germanic, well, germans) anyhoo, one would expect the x6 not to as good as a 911 but a comparison would be a little moot as they are completely different car types. As a generalisation, I would hazard a guess the 911 is percieved to be better but again, who knows how that will go on here.
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    Again, than penny didnt drop there either did it?

    I wasnt comparing a 911 to an X6, i was saying - had you read it - that your objection to the X6 was based on practicality - its not practical, therefore its not a good car. I asked was a 911 not a good car because according to your "rule of thumb" its not practical, therefore must be a bad car? Should people not buy a 911 but buy a Panamera instead for example, because it can seat more people?

    So according to your logic the Panamera is the "better" car than a 911 because its more practical?

    Now, if that penny has finally dropped maybe you can see why dissing an X6 for not being practical is not really a good argument - people dont buy an X6 because its practical. They buy it because they like it and it does what they want of it.


    Finally, taking all that into account we have the comparison of the 1.4 mundane focus and the engineering benchmark that is the veyron. Again not directly comparable due to vehicle type cost etc. "This 1.4 focus is the best thing on four wheels and its much better than that veyron over there which I have also driven" said no one, ever.


    The veyron is betterif no one guessed, but disagree all you want with that.



    Got it?
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    Again, you havent grasped the subjectiveness of "better". If you wanted to carry 4 people which would be better a Veyron or a 1.4 litre Focus?
    Last edited by motorguy; 26-07-2014 at 9:23 PM.
    Life has never given me lemons.

    It has given me anger issues, anxiety, a love for alcohol and a serious dislike for stupid people, but not lemons.
  • topdaddy
    Again you missed mine and everyone elses point who contributeds point - more expensive doesnt necessarily mean "better", but you seem to think it does. If your requirements are not to have a performance engine and bucket seats, but are to have an economical car that is comfy for all the family then an ST isnt "better"it is. The familu fit in it but you comprimise on economy

    Because "better" is subjective - its about your own needs, not someone elses.
    if you say so, reveiwers must then, by that reasoning, reveiw cars on an individuals needs and assess them as such
    If that still doesnt make sense, ask a grown up.
    I will when I find one
    Again, than penny didnt drop there either did it?

    I wasnt comparing a 911 to an X6I was, i was saying - had you read it - that your objection to the X6 was based on practicality - its not practical, therefore its not a good car. I asked was a 911 not a good car because according to your "rule of thumb" its not practical, thats not a rule, is it?therefore must be a bad carwho said that?? Should people not buy a 911 but buy a Panamera instead for example, because it can seat more people?no, id suggest the aston
    So according to your logic the Panamera is the "better" car than a 911 because its more practical?
    a panamera is more practical. Not sure why that would be better, comparing apples with pears
    Now, if that penny has finally dropped maybe you can see why dissing an X6 for not being practical is not really a good argument - people dont buy an X6 because its practical. why would they buy one? I cant think of a good reasonThey buy it because they like it and it does what they want of it.
    Again, you havent grasped the subjectiveness of "better". If you wanted to carry 4 people which would be better a Veyron or a 1.4 litre Focus?
    Originally posted by motorguy
    The veyron cos it you couod afford one then you would pay for a s class to transport the additional two people or even better than that you would transport each passeneger and make three trips. Then everyone gets to experience the engineering excellance that is VAGs masterpiece.
    • colino
    • By colino 26th Jul 14, 10:11 PM
    • 4,936 Posts
    • 2,514 Thanks
    colino
    TD, your still spouting rubbish, well done. Can I order one of those Veyron betterif that you speak of?
  • topdaddy
    TD, your still spouting rubbish, well done. Can I order one of those Veyron betterif that you speak of?
    Originally posted by colino
    Thats the best you could come up with? Hangyourheadinshame.
    Im not angry, just dissapointed.
    • DUTR
    • By DUTR 26th Jul 14, 10:21 PM
    • 12,286 Posts
    • 6,968 Thanks
    DUTR
    The veyron cos it you couod afford one then you would pay for a s class to transport the additional two people or even better than that you would transport each passeneger and make three trips. Then everyone gets to experience the engineering excellance that is VAGs masterpiece.
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    The Veyron is a nice car, but more so a feat of engineering for many reasons (you can read up on that elsewhere).
    Some cars are not avoided just because of cost.
    EG closer to home (for me) I ordered a MK7 with lots of options that takes it into R territory, the R would have been little more than a base model, it wasn't purchased on finance and an AMG A45 was possible too.
    To summarise, the car was purchased to satisfy what I wanted , not to please any observer, in fact the car it replaced was still mighty fine.
    • F1F93
    • By F1F93 27th Jul 14, 12:11 AM
    • 356 Posts
    • 201 Thanks
    F1F93
    I understand that people diasagree. And it has been answered.
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    Really? I don't see an end to the argument. Have you just decided that it's been answered?

    "This 1.4 focus is the best thing on four wheels and its much better than that veyron over there which I have also driven" said no one, ever.
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    Actually, said the organisers of European Car of the Year, which the Focus has won once and got two extra third places, and which the Veyron has won... oh yeah. Never.
    • F1F93
    • By F1F93 27th Jul 14, 12:11 AM
    • 356 Posts
    • 201 Thanks
    F1F93
    "it is. The familu fit in it but you comprimise on economy"

    So you have to compromise on something. How then is it better? That is illogical.
  • topdaddy
    Really? I don't see an end to the argument. Have you just decided that it's been answered?


    do you want to discuss it? Sounds like you do.
    Actually, said the organisers of European Car of the Year, which the Focus has won once and got two extra third places, and which the Veyron has won... oh yeah. Never.
    Originally posted by F1F93
    They didnt say that and also the veron won car of the year and the decade from top gear. But i dont listen to awards because the 308 is this years winner meqning anyone with a focus should consider getting a pug.
    But good luck conivncing anyone of that.
  • topdaddy
    "it is. The familu fit in it but you comprimise on economy"

    So you have to compromise on something. How then is it better? That is illogical.
    Originally posted by F1F93
    Because you are compensated with the characteristics of the st. You cant have everything, but if you did build an economic sporty comfortable environmentally friendly cheap to run affordable practical reliable desireable car then you would probbably be very rich.
  • topdaddy
    The Veyron is a nice car, but more so a feat of engineering for many reasons (you can read up on that elsewhere).
    Some cars are not avoided just because of cost.
    EG closer to home (for me) I ordered a MK7 with lots of options that takes it into R territory, the R would have been little more than a base model, it wasn't purchased on finance and an AMG A45 was possible too.
    To summarise, the car was purchased to satisfy what I wanted , not to please any observer, in fact the car it replaced was still mighty fine.
    Originally posted by DUTR
    Mk7 golf? But by not having the r model you dont get the r's USP: Fastest acclerating golf ever. Thats saying something following on from the r32.
    Do you rather than an observer not muss out then? After all an observer might mistake it for an r.
    • DUTR
    • By DUTR 27th Jul 14, 11:58 AM
    • 12,286 Posts
    • 6,968 Thanks
    DUTR
    Mk7 golf? But by not having the r model you dont get the r's USP: Fastest acclerating golf ever. Thats saying something following on from the r32.
    Do you rather than an observer not muss out then? After all an observer might mistake it for an r.
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    By having the R, I miss out on the soundpack option, power folding mirrors ADC, luggage space and having to pay a premium for it. That's the beauty of choice.
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 27th Jul 14, 12:08 PM
    • 19,696 Posts
    • 12,361 Thanks
    motorguy
    Mk7 golf? But by not having the r model you dont get the r's USP: Fastest acclerating golf ever. Thats saying something following on from the r32.
    Do you rather than an observer not muss out then? After all an observer might mistake it for an r.
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    Only if outright acceleration is more important to you than spec.

    But thats a subjective opinion.
    Last edited by motorguy; 27-07-2014 at 12:10 PM.
    Life has never given me lemons.

    It has given me anger issues, anxiety, a love for alcohol and a serious dislike for stupid people, but not lemons.
  • topdaddy
    Only if outright acceleration is more important to you than spec.

    But thats a subjective opinion.
    Originally posted by motorguy
    But its spec and the performance
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 27th Jul 14, 1:09 PM
    • 19,696 Posts
    • 12,361 Thanks
    motorguy
    But its spec and the performance
    Originally posted by topdaddy
    If you're not wanting the enhanced mechanic spec, what has a standard R got that a GTI doesnt?

    Genuine question, havent checked.
    Life has never given me lemons.

    It has given me anger issues, anxiety, a love for alcohol and a serious dislike for stupid people, but not lemons.
    • almillar
    • By almillar 28th Jul 14, 2:35 PM
    • 8,208 Posts
    • 3,410 Thanks
    almillar
    topdaddy, you didn't really reply to the main part of my post, just the X6 part (let's drop that!), so I'll repost it. I think it would be really useful for you to read and respond...

    They're trying to stay warm - they've got the heating on. I can't be any more clear. A direct quote of the OP saying 'I have the heating on' is not relevant to your argument. Richard1970 seems to have put that one to bed in post#260 in a nice big font. Does that satisfy you?

    There are no heaters. I put it in caps last time. As you say, you WILL need the engine back on. agreed, heaters dont work that way.Skadooosh!
    No running engine no heat, correct. You've chosen PART of an argument to suit you. But when the engine has been running, the heat hangs around. I repeat yet again, there are no heaters. Direct question from me to you - are there heaters? If so, please describe them.

    But we're talking about that bit IN BETWEEN the engine being on. THERE IS STILL HEAT
    based on a heater being on in the first instance.
    - YES! From page 1, everyone else had established this! You seem to want it written in stone from the OP!
    THAT is what everyone else is arguing with you about. Warm engine switches off, blowers still blow, warm(cooling air)
    - ABSOLUTELY! - it's warm, it's getting cooler. No-one ever argued otherwise!
    air is blown, for a while, because it's still hanging around in the system.


    Seriously, have a read at that last para topdaddy, it's a mixture of your words and mine. It all says the same thing. Where's the disagreement?
  • topdaddy
    topdaddy, you didn't really reply to the main part of my post, just the X6 part (let's drop that!), so I'll repost it. I think it would be really useful for you to read and respond...

    They're trying to stay warm - they've got the heating on. I can't be any more clear. A direct quote of the OP saying 'I have the heating on' is not relevant to your argument. Richard1970 seems to have put that one to bed in post#260 in a nice big font. Does that satisfy you?
    No running engine no heat, correct. You've chosen PART of an argument to suit you. But when the engine has been running, the heat hangs around. I repeat yet again, there are no heaters. Direct question from me to you - are there heaters? If so, please describe them.



    - YES! From page 1, everyone else had established this! You seem to want it written in stone from the OP!


    - ABSOLUTELY! - it's warm, it's getting cooler. No-one ever argued otherwise!




    Seriously, have a read at that last para topdaddy, it's a mixture of your words and mine. It all says the same thing. Where's the disagreement?
    Originally posted by almillar
    The main disagreement i have is that it would be useful
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