Ryanair refused Brazilian family from flying - any rights for compensation?
Comments
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In accordance with Article 2(j) of the Regulation, "denied boarding" does not cover a situation where there are reasonable grounds for refusing to carry passengers on a flight even though they presented themselves on time for the flight, such as for reasons of health, safety or security, or inadequate travel documentation.
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:52016XC0615%2801%290 -
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I don't follow that logic. There can be many reasons why luggage would be accepted and boarding subsequently denied. I doubt this case would fall under EU regulations.
I agree.
Whilst baggage is accepted (or at least deposited as it can later be "off-loaded") at bag-drop, the passenger is only accepted for travel when they report (with the correct documentation to travel) at the boarding gate within the stipulated gate closure times.Which bit of this story aren!!!8217;t you getting. Regardless if they required a stamp (it actually says on the boarding card you need your passport checked, no mention of a stamp) there was no one there to do it as there are no checkin staff at EDI, just one member of staff to supervise you use the self bag drop without any problems.
And it!!!8217;s not a matter of insurance, it!!!8217;s a claim under eu261/2004 that wants to be done.
I think this is a red herring as well. It is just speculation that there was no one to check the passengers passports and documentation. It is just that the passengers did not understand the check was necessary or where to have this done.
This check is not conducted at bag-drop but by the airline handling staff at their ticket desk/information desk/customer service desk (call it what you like). I suspect at EDI this is a 3rd party handling agent Swissport and the desk was open but not seen by the passengers. I have not flown FR ex EDI but have from a hand full of other airports. There has always been a handling agents desk, with Ryanair signage, open when the flights are checking in.
It is unfortunate but Ryanair make this checking of travel documentation clear on their website. I believe it is also printed on boarding passes where advance API is collected on non EU/UK passports.
I feel sorry that the passengers did not understand this and if they are non-English speakers can see why. I do not however believe there is a case for EU261 denied boarding or a travel insurance claim.0 -
What makes it a little more complicated is that my wife booked it on their behalf under her RA account since they saved a few £'s due to currency transaction fees and rates if they booked it in Brazil. So could my wife phone her travel insurance company and enquire or would it have to be our family when they're back in Brazil and they contact their travel insurance despite it being booked under wife's name?
Thanks for all the replies btw. I'll have a good read into over the w/end when I have a bit more time.0 -
There won't be any refund probably, and an offer to fly on the Saturday was very generous.
Lucky they only had to buy new flights to Lisbon, could have been worse.0 -
I agree.
Whilst baggage is accepted (or at least deposited as it can later be "off-loaded") at bag-drop, the passenger is only accepted for travel when they report (with the correct documentation to travel) at the boarding gate within the stipulated gate closure times.
I think this is a red herring as well. It is just speculation that there was no one to check the passengers passports and documentation. It is just that the passengers did not understand the check was necessary or where to have this done.
This check is not conducted at bag-drop but by the airline handling staff at their ticket desk/information desk/customer service desk (call it what you like). I suspect at EDI this is a 3rd party handling agent Swissport and the desk was open but not seen by the passengers. I have not flown FR ex EDI but have from a hand full of other airports. There has always been a handling agents desk, with Ryanair signage, open when the flights are checking in.
It is unfortunate but Ryanair make this checking of travel documentation clear on their website. I believe it is also printed on boarding passes where advance API is collected on non EU/UK passports.
I feel sorry that the passengers did not understand this and if they are non-English speakers can see why. I do not however believe there is a case for EU261 denied boarding or a travel insurance claim.
Speculation it maybe, but my own experience of BHX is worth considering. There is no checkin staff there, and no Ryanair desk. Swissport have a desk but there is no signage saying that they are the agents for RA. (In fact I only ever thought they dealt with luggage queries)
The boarding pass states you have to present yourself for passport check, well the RA agent, in RA uniform looked at my passport when I loaded my bags, but said nothing. It was only because in the past that I was advised by the then checkin staff where I had to go that o knew what to do.
Now anyone with the simplest intelligence would consider that a passport check.
And this had always had to be done BEFORE they would check your bags in.
Edit: just spoke to a non U.K. friend who uses EDI and there are no RA checkin staff, it!!!8217;s all self loading bagdrop. Swissport deal with the stampingThe common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run, and if you do that you will have enough to pay for something better.0 -
Edit: just spoke to a non U.K. friend who uses EDI and there are no RA checkin staff, it!!!8217;s all self loading bagdrop. Swissport deal with the stamping
Thank you for confirming my point.
Unfortunate error that neither the OP’s wife picked up the passport check requirement upon booking, or the travellers seeing any requirement about the passport check on their travel documents. After bag drop the passengers needed to report to the Swissport desk (agents for Ryanair) to have their passports checked.
Could perhaps the process be improved? Sure. Clearer warnings in multiple languages on boarding cards, maybe. How many languages? More staff at bag drop to look out for these issues, maybe, but that costs money and potentially increases fares.
I still do not believe this is a case for EU261 denied boarding.0 -
Thank you for confirming my point.
Unfortunate error that neither the OP’s wife picked up the passport check requirement upon booking, or the travellers seeing any requirement about the passport check on their travel documents. After bag drop the passengers needed to report to the Swissport desk (agents for Ryanair) to have their passports checked.
Could perhaps the process be improved? Sure. Clearer warnings in multiple languages on boarding cards, maybe. How many languages? More staff at bag drop to look out for these issues, maybe, but that costs money and potentially increases fares.
I still do not believe this is a case for EU261 denied boarding.
Indeed.....perhaps if you have bags to check in it should come up with a warning at self service baggage drop that a stamp is required.
A few years back my wife flew with her Brazilian passport and upon checking in our bags it came up with an error on the screen. The person at baggage said it's a Visa issue as she was flying within 6 months of the pp expiring and hence she couldn't board for our flight to Croatia (another costly lesson). Something like that would be helpful to avoid not obtaining a stamp if you're aware you required one when flying with RA.
I'll let you know how they get on with their travel insurance company though it's dependent on their policy, as always with these things.0 -
Indeed.....perhaps if you have bags to check in it should come up with a warning at self service baggage drop that a stamp is required.
A few years back my wife flew with her Brazilian passport and upon checking in our bags it came up with an error on the screen. The person at baggage said it's a Visa issue as she was flying within 6 months of the pp expiring and hence she couldn't board for our flight to Croatia (another costly lesson). Something like that would be helpful to avoid not obtaining a stamp if you're aware you required one when flying with RA.
I'll let you know how they get on with their travel insurance company though it's dependent on their policy, as always with these things.
Travel insurance is unlikley to cover it, stoneman suggested a no win no fee claim, thats probably your best route but dont get hopes up0 -
Travel insurance is unlikley to cover it, stoneman suggested a no win no fee claim, thats probably your best route but dont get hopes up
Absolutely not - they aren't expecting anything but you never know. I'll update once I hear back from them once they've contacted their travel insurance. Thanks again for all the help.0
This discussion has been closed.
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