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  • FIRST POST
    • davetherave11
    • By davetherave11 17th Jun 19, 12:24 AM
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    davetherave11
    CCTV in work place investigation
    • #1
    • 17th Jun 19, 12:24 AM
    CCTV in work place investigation 17th Jun 19 at 12:24 AM
    Hi

    Myself and 2 other work colleagues have been requested to individually attend a workplace investigation. We suspect that in the investigation we will be shown CCTV footage, of use loading a lorry incorrectly (breach of Health and Safety).

    Although we’re aware of CCTV in the work place we were never made aware it was for staff monitoring (nothing in staff handbook or our contracts) The signs say ‘Crime prevention and public safety’

    Can our employers still use this footage, although it’s being used not for the purpose it was intended for?
Page 1
    • Savvy_Sue
    • By Savvy_Sue 17th Jun 19, 1:05 AM
    • 39,907 Posts
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    Savvy_Sue
    • #2
    • 17th Jun 19, 1:05 AM
    • #2
    • 17th Jun 19, 1:05 AM
    If you're in a union, talk to them.

    I'm not sure how you'd argue that this doesn't fall under 'public safety'. You may say that how you loaded the lorry, while a breach of H&S, wouldn't have affected anyone else's safety.

    However, breaching H&S can be extremely serious, and any employer who doesn't take it seriously is risking a huge amount.

    and remember, in a workplace enquiry, an employer doesn't have to prove anything beyond reasonable doubt. It's enough for them to reasonably believe. Even without the CCTV, they can say "we have reason to believe that John, Paul and Ringo loaded a lorry in an unsafe manner, what have you got to say about the matter?" And you can all swear blind you didn't, you followed company policy etc etc, but if they still believe you didn't, or someone else says "I know they didn't" ... well, need I spell it out?

    So, even if the union are on board and say "you can't use the CCTV evidence", if you DID load the lorry incorrectly, you will still have a very large target on you from now on.
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    • Kentish Dave
    • By Kentish Dave 17th Jun 19, 6:29 AM
    • 427 Posts
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    Kentish Dave
    • #3
    • 17th Jun 19, 6:29 AM
    • #3
    • 17th Jun 19, 6:29 AM
    So you admit it, there’s proof, but you want to fight?

    Why not try apologizing instead? It may we’ll work out better for you anyway.
    • TBagpuss
    • By TBagpuss 18th Jun 19, 1:03 PM
    • 7,411 Posts
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    TBagpuss
    • #4
    • 18th Jun 19, 1:03 PM
    • #4
    • 18th Jun 19, 1:03 PM
    OK, I think you are probably confusing 2 things: Data Protection, and Staff policies.
    For Data Protection, organisations have to say what data they hold and for waht urposes. It would seem to me that checking whether or not there has been a breach of H&S would fall clearly under ' public safety' so I can't see that there would be any breach of data protection rules. (and you may well find that your organisation's data protection policies does cover this any way)

    Turning to the employment issue, not eveything is included in handbooks etc. I think assuming that the CTV cameras were not concaled then common sense would suggest that they are going to invclude recordigns of workers and that those may be accessed if relant to a complaint or dosciplinary issue.

    however, even if that were ot the case, in looking atdiciplinary issues, the employer simply as to follow a fair process. They are not bound by strict rules of evidence such as you would find in court proceedings.

    Here , t seem,s to me that there are 2 possible outcomes, if you were to object to the use of the CCTV footage:

    1. Your employer agreed not to use use it, but then draws the obvious conclusion from your reluctance to have it viewed.

    2. Your employer considers the objection, determines that there is no valid reason not to look at the footage and that it is likely to help in achieving a fair outcome. If the footage then shows that you were not following the proper process, they deal with that but also take into account the fact that you were trying to conceal it.


    Since it sounds as thouh you were breaking the rules, your best bet is likely to be to be open and honest about it, apologise and make clear that it won't happen again, and hope thatyour employer is willing to deal with it by way of a warning rather than anything more serious.
    • Les79
    • By Les79 18th Jun 19, 7:52 PM
    • 1,333 Posts
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    Les79
    • #5
    • 18th Jun 19, 7:52 PM
    • #5
    • 18th Jun 19, 7:52 PM
    They might be taking you all in individually in the hopes that their investigation will cause inconsistencies in your stories and you'll end up stitching up each other.
    • dickydonkin
    • By dickydonkin 19th Jun 19, 8:42 PM
    • 2,921 Posts
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    dickydonkin
    • #6
    • 19th Jun 19, 8:42 PM
    • #6
    • 19th Jun 19, 8:42 PM
    I am finding it difficult to comprehend as to why someone would work in an unsafe manner in front of CCTV.

    Come to think of it - I don't understand why anyone would work in an unsafe manner without cameras.

    No sympathy from me I'm afraid.
    • Sarahemm
    • By Sarahemm 21st Jun 19, 7:41 AM
    • 12 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Sarahemm
    • #7
    • 21st Jun 19, 7:41 AM
    • #7
    • 21st Jun 19, 7:41 AM
    My husband was pulled up for breach of H&S and it was only one person who had dobbed him in. No CCTV, just a snitch that told management. It was a genuine mistake on his part as he forgot to get the keys from the driver of the wagon, but it was against policy. He got a telling off and was told if he breached H&S again within 6 months it was instant dismissal.
    Safety in the workplace should be a number one priority, there are people who have died at my husband's work and it was due to lapses in the h&S that caused them. If you knowingly breached the rules, own up and take the punishment. It's a pain and we've all done things at work we shouldn't but when you get caught denying it can make it worse.
    • KatrinaWaves
    • By KatrinaWaves 21st Jun 19, 9:30 AM
    • 718 Posts
    • 1,352 Thanks
    KatrinaWaves
    • #8
    • 21st Jun 19, 9:30 AM
    • #8
    • 21st Jun 19, 9:30 AM
    My husband was pulled up for breach of H&S and it was only one person who had dobbed him in. No CCTV, just a snitch that told management. It was a genuine mistake on his part as he forgot to get the keys from the driver of the wagon, but it was against policy. He got a telling off and was told if he breached H&S again within 6 months it was instant dismissal.
    Safety in the workplace should be a number one priority, there are people who have died at my husband's work and it was due to lapses in the h&S that caused them. If you knowingly breached the rules, own up and take the punishment. It's a pain and we've all done things at work we shouldn't but when you get caught denying it can make it worse.
    Originally posted by Sarahemm
    People have died, thank god for the snitch that dobbed in your husband who can’t do his job properly eh!
    • Sarahemm
    • By Sarahemm 21st Jun 19, 10:39 AM
    • 12 Posts
    • 4 Thanks
    Sarahemm
    • #9
    • 21st Jun 19, 10:39 AM
    • #9
    • 21st Jun 19, 10:39 AM
    Indeed. You are totally right! In fact he decided not to do that job anymore and delegated it to another member of staff as he wasn't sure he could always remember to get the keys when it was very busy. They did him a bit of a favour if the truth be know. He didn't like stacking wagons as a lot of the wagon drivers don't always hand their keys over and he has to pester them. He's not the pestering type!
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