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Car Hire popla

Hello

I received a parking notice from Parking Eye for staying in a car park without paying,I truly did not see the signs, it was a hired car from Thrifty who passed my details on to parking eye and charged me £42 admin for their kind services.

So fast forward i have appealed and received a popla code using the template in the Newbies Thread and now i am drafting a popla appeal No 1 being The Operator failed to deliver a Notice to Hirer that was fully compliant with the requirements of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (“POFA”)


Im on No 2 ) The signs in this car park are not prominent and i need some help please,

1) Should i attach pictures of the car park and the signs which i went back and took, i cant upload here because im newbee but the sign has £100 in big letters the rest is arguable.
2 ) Should i put the appeal on pdf if so how do i attach the info in the links e.g.

In the Beavis case, the £85 charge itself was in the largest font size with a contrasting colour background and the terms were legible, fairly concise and unambiguous. There were 'large lettering' signs at the entrance and all around the car park, according to the Judges.

Here is the 'Beavis case' sign as a comparison to the signs under dispute in this case


[ LINK ]

i would appreciate the help.
«13456

Comments

  • Le_Kirk
    Le_Kirk Posts: 22,162
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    If you are wanting to show the pictures to POPLA, just embed them in your appeal and send it to them as a .pdf as you say.

    To post pictures on here, use an imaging site (imgur, tinypic etc.) and post the URL like this hxxps://........ and someone will fix it for you.
  • Fruitcake
    Fruitcake Posts: 58,155
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    edited 4 March 2019 at 2:00PM
    Parking scammers monitor this forum. You should edit your post to remove information about who did what. Only ever refer to The Driver and The Keeper, who are two different people.
    You can't rely on the PoFA if the scammers can work out the driver's identity form your posts here.

    The wording and the position of the signs is important, not just the mention of £100.

    Are they positioned so that a driver could not possibly miss them, or are they damaged, high up on poles, hidden behind bushes, facing away from the route a driver would take?
    Are they forbidding and thus incapable of forming a contract?
    I married my cousin. I had to...
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  • Dane19
    Dane19 Posts: 53
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    Thanks for that. Iv attached pics of sinage as Le_Kirk advised. First time for me so don't know how they will come out.

    [IMG]hxxps://i.postimg.cc/Ss71wTnz/20190303-164138.jpg[/IMG]

    [IMG]hxxps://i.postimg.cc/65Tz05fZ/20190303-164112.jpg[/IMG]
  • Dane19
    Dane19 Posts: 53
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    Update: i had a check on popla website to see how far my appeal had reached and parking eye have submitted 66 page evidence pack 2 days ago, I’ve been given 7 days for any comments, i thought they would email or send it in the post. Any case still have few days. They have submitted
    1. contract with the car hire company.
    2. Lots of images of signs which the small print is still unreadable.
    3. Landowner authorisation letter.
    And other rules and regulations of liability.

    So please advise how what to do now, so far i have followed the advise and templates on the newbies section but now i need help.

    Thank you
  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 37,430
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    Dane19 wrote: »
    Update: i had a check on popla website to see how far my appeal had reached and parking eye have submitted 66 page evidence pack 2 days ago, I’ve been given 7 days for any comments, i thought they would email or send it in the post. Any case still have few days. They have submitted
    1. contract with the car hire company.
    2. Lots of images of signs which the small print is still unreadable.
    3. Landowner authorisation letter.
    And other rules and regulations of liability.

    So please advise how what to do now, so far i have followed the advise and templates on the newbies section but now i need help.

    Thank you
    Read again the NEWBIES thread.

    The bit in post #3 of the NEWBIES thread following the heading:

    AFTER SUBMITTING YOUR POPLA APPEAL:
  • MistyZ
    MistyZ Posts: 1,820
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    edited 20 March 2019 at 3:01PM
    Dane19 wrote: »
    Update: i had a check on popla website to see how far my appeal had reached and parking eye have submitted 66 page evidence pack 2 days ago, I’ve been given 7 days for any comments, i thought they would email or send it in the post. Any case still have few days. They have submitted
    1. contract with the car hire company.
    2. Lots of images of signs which the small print is still unreadable.
    3. Landowner authorisation letter.
    And other rules and regulations of liability.

    So please advise how what to do now, so far i have followed the advise and templates on the newbies section but now i need help.

    Thank you

    Is the only hire company doc. they've enclosed the contract between hirer and lease company? If so, that falls short of the hire docs. listed in of POFA 4, para 13, section 2.

    Even if they show all the requisite hire docs., to comply with POFA they would have had to have 'given' them to the hirer within 21 days of receiving them from the hire company.

    I think, that's how it is, anyway! I'd be pouring over POFA Schedule 4, paras 13 & 14 looking for ways to succinctly scupper this bit of their 'evidence' in particular.
  • D_P_Dance
    D_P_Dance Posts: 11,493
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    I received a parking notice from Parking Eye for staying in a car park without paying,I truly did not see the signs,

    Was it a cloudy day?

    All the PE signs that I have come across fail imo to be able to form a contract. They are either too high, the font is too small, or they are too wordy, or all of the above, read this thread and complain to your MP.

    https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5972164&highlight=

    On 18th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these private parking companies. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, and persistent offenders denied access. Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers.

    Until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

    Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
  • Dane19
    Dane19 Posts: 53
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    Thanks Keith I’ve taken notes from there that are relevant for me but couldn’t see anything about hirer rebuts.
    So i wanted to know wether i should mention not complying to Pofa paragraph 13,14 because they have submitted it all in there evidence pack with a signed statement saying that it was sent. Liars

    Secondly if the so called contract is with the driver and i am not the driver but the hirer and they haven’t asked me for any details of the driver is that something i can use in my favour ? If so how would i word it.

    I know its probably covered somewhere but I’ve read so much in the threads my head feels like its going to take off.

    Appreciate any advise.
  • MistyZ
    MistyZ Posts: 1,820
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    edited 20 March 2019 at 5:35PM
    Surely the contract was between the Lease company and the hirer?

    Are you sure that all the docs. listed in POFA are in their evidence:

    (a)a statement signed by or on behalf of the vehicle-hire firm to the effect that at the material time the vehicle was hired to a named person under a hire agreement;

    (b)a copy of the hire agreement; and

    (c)a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement.

    They've lied about sending them?! The swine! Strongly refute that - it shouldn't take many words, just well-chosen ones. And the relevant POFA sections are not too challenging to read when searching for more non-compliance.

    One more thought .... I was under the impression that the hire companies did not send the docs. to PPCs. Yet obviously P.E. got hold of something somehow. Timing does matter so why not ask the hire co. when they sent the docs to P.E.? Do it by email so as to directly quote if their reply helps.
  • Edna_Basher
    Edna_Basher Posts: 782
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    edited 20 March 2019 at 7:08PM
    Dane19 wrote: »
    .......they have submitted it all in their evidence pack with a signed statement saying that it was sent. Liars.

    Gosh, did ParkingEye really say that? It would be helpful if you could set out word-for-word exactly what ParkingEye wrote about this in the Evidence Pack and where it was written (e.g. was it included in Section B (Case Summary)?).

    Having read scores of PE evidence packs for hire vehicles I've never seen them make such a claim.

    In cases where the lease company do provide ParkingEye with documents, copies of these are usually included in Section E of the Evidence Pack (Original Representation / Notice of Rejection) rather than in Section C (Parking Charge Notice / Notice of the Operative). If the hire documents had been sent with the PCN then the logical place for them would be under Section C not Section E.
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