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    • k2150
    • By k2150 12th Mar 18, 8:21 AM
    • 62Posts
    • 4Thanks
    k2150
    Lloyds block account over Bitcoins
    • #1
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:21 AM
    Lloyds block account over Bitcoins 12th Mar 18 at 8:21 AM
    My account has been blocked by Lloyds bank shortly after transferring £300 (GBP) to Uphold.com. Uphold converted the £300 into bitcoin for me, before doing so I had to supply them with my photo ID (UK passport) and proof of residence (UK driver's license). When I phoned Lloyds about the block the only information they gave out was that my account had been flagged by their security/ fraud dept. I checked my account there are no signs of any fraudulent transactions taking place. I would appreciate some advice. I freely admit to purchasing £300 of cryptocurrency. I'm not a drug dealer nor money launderer. Frankly, I now want to close this Lloyds account, but I'm unable to transfer funds out. What can Lloyds bank do with the remaining funds in my account ?
Page 1
    • zx81
    • By zx81 12th Mar 18, 8:46 AM
    • 17,239 Posts
    • 18,326 Thanks
    zx81
    • #2
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:46 AM
    • #2
    • 12th Mar 18, 8:46 AM
    They'll be frozen until the investigation is complete.
    • AstroTurtle
    • By AstroTurtle 12th Mar 18, 9:00 AM
    • 152 Posts
    • 533 Thanks
    AstroTurtle
    • #3
    • 12th Mar 18, 9:00 AM
    • #3
    • 12th Mar 18, 9:00 AM
    My account has been blocked by Lloyds bank shortly after transferring £300 (GBP) to Uphold.com. Uphold converted the £300 into bitcoin for me, before doing so I had to supply them with my photo ID (UK passport) and proof of residence (UK driver's license). When I phoned Lloyds about the block the only information they gave out was that my account had been flagged by their security/ fraud dept. I checked my account there are no signs of any fraudulent transactions taking place. I would appreciate some advice. I freely admit to purchasing £300 of cryptocurrency. I'm not a drug dealer nor money launderer. Frankly, I now want to close this Lloyds account, but I'm unable to transfer funds out. What can Lloyds bank do with the remaining funds in my account ?
    Originally posted by k2150

    Close the account all you want, Most major banks carry out these checks on high risk transactions (Unusual account activity) so you will likely have the same problem again elsewhere.


    Bitcoin fraud & Purchasing on stolen/cloned cards has increased massively due to it's traceability and worth at the moment.


    It's a temporary block.. Just wait.. They are doing it to protect you against fraud. Occasionally they'll get it wrong and block a genuine transaction..
    • tenchy
    • By tenchy 12th Mar 18, 12:44 PM
    • 360 Posts
    • 113 Thanks
    tenchy
    • #4
    • 12th Mar 18, 12:44 PM
    • #4
    • 12th Mar 18, 12:44 PM
    Close the account all you want, Most major banks carry out these checks on high risk transactions (Unusual account activity) so you will likely have the same problem again elsewhere.


    Bitcoin fraud & Purchasing on stolen/cloned cards has increased massively due to it's traceability and worth at the moment.


    It's a temporary block.. Just wait.. They are doing it to protect you against fraud. Occasionally they'll get it wrong and block a genuine transaction..
    Originally posted by AstroTurtle

    They are actually doing it to protect themselves against regulatory sanctions. Banks are not interested in protecting you. I would replace 'occasionally' with 'often'. As it happens, a couple of weeks ago I had occasion to lend my son £15k. I transferred the money from my HSBC account into his HSBC account, and his account was blocked within the hour. This caused him quite a bit of difficulty. Eventually HSBC rang him up to ask about what he wanted the money for (cheeky bas***ds) and could he let them know the value of a transaction paid to Next (shop) some time in January (stupid bas***ds). Of course he couldn't do this, since he couldn't log on to online banking due to their disabling his account.


    To summarise; banks are only interested in protecting themselves and they are quite happy to grossly inconvenience their customers if it means they can avoid sanctions. In the case of HSBC it's all the more galling, since as one of the world's biggest money launderers themselves, you'd think they'd be more clued up than most on spotting a dodgy transaction - but no. They just take a scatter gun approach. Bitcoin is not illegal!!
    • AstroTurtle
    • By AstroTurtle 12th Mar 18, 2:16 PM
    • 152 Posts
    • 533 Thanks
    AstroTurtle
    • #5
    • 12th Mar 18, 2:16 PM
    • #5
    • 12th Mar 18, 2:16 PM
    They are actually doing it to protect themselves against regulatory sanctions. Banks are not interested in protecting you. I would replace 'occasionally' with 'often'. As it happens, a couple of weeks ago I had occasion to lend my son £15k. I transferred the money from my HSBC account into his HSBC account, and his account was blocked within the hour. This caused him quite a bit of difficulty. Eventually HSBC rang him up to ask about what he wanted the money for (cheeky bas***ds) and could he let them know the value of a transaction paid to Next (shop) some time in January (stupid bas***ds). Of course he couldn't do this, since he couldn't log on to online banking due to their disabling his account.


    To summarise; banks are only interested in protecting themselves and they are quite happy to grossly inconvenience their customers if it means they can avoid sanctions. In the case of HSBC it's all the more galling, since as one of the world's biggest money launderers themselves, you'd think they'd be more clued up than most on spotting a dodgy transaction - but no. They just take a scatter gun approach. Bitcoin is not illegal!!
    Originally posted by tenchy

    Someone's touched a nerve there...


    If banks were only interested in protecting themselves they wouldn't block flight bookings or car purchases or holiday deposits or broker deposits(like OP).


    Believe it or not fraud in those style of transactions occurs at an alarming rate. If someone ripped 15k out of your account fraudulently would you be happy if your bank didn't bother to check?


    As for asking questions about what it's for (Cheeky B) as you called it. That's called KYC - Know your customer and any suspected money laundering has to be well documented as to where, what and why a transaction under suspicion occurs and they can face all kinds of fine's without this.


    If they really didn't care they would happily take all the money, do no checks, but no refunds for fraud victims if that's the case.


    If you hate them so much withdraw all your money and just use cash or trade items.


    And no bitcoin is not illegal. No-one said it was captain obvious.
    • tenchy
    • By tenchy 12th Mar 18, 2:57 PM
    • 360 Posts
    • 113 Thanks
    tenchy
    • #6
    • 12th Mar 18, 2:57 PM
    • #6
    • 12th Mar 18, 2:57 PM
    Someone's touched a nerve there...


    If banks were only interested in protecting themselves they wouldn't block flight bookings or car purchases or holiday deposits or broker deposits(like OP).


    Believe it or not fraud in those style of transactions occurs at an alarming rate. If someone ripped 15k out of your account fraudulently would you be happy if your bank didn't bother to check? It wouldn't bother me too much, because if I'd done nothing wrong, they would be liable. In any case, they blocked may lad's account because of money going in, not coming out


    As for asking questions about what it's for (Cheeky B) as you called it. That's called KYC - Know your customer and any suspected money laundering has to be well documented as to where, what and why a transaction under suspicion occurs and they can face all kinds of fine's without this. They've already collected a vast amount of information from him under the guise of KYC. And, yes, as you point out they are doing this to avoid facing fines - looking after themselves rather than the customer, in other words.


    If they really didn't care they would happily take all the money, do no checks, but no refunds for fraud victims if that's the case.


    If you hate them so much withdraw all your money and just use cash or trade items. Interesting you should say that: my son had talked about the not insignificant problems HSBC caused him by blocking his account (you know - out shopping and the debit card doesn't work) to his colleagues. A number of them had faced similar disruption on occasion, and a couple of them have now done just what you suggest. They keep a bank account for salary in and vital SO/DDs out, then on payday take out the balance and keep in in a safe at home, accumulating substantial funds in the process. Cash is king for them. If this catches on, the whole idea of KYC and paranoid money laundering protocols will have the exact opposite effect to that intended.


    And no bitcoin is not illegal. No-one said it was captain obvious.
    Who? But it seems the banks think it is. They need educating.
    Originally posted by AstroTurtle

    My comments above.
    • AstroTurtle
    • By AstroTurtle 12th Mar 18, 3:46 PM
    • 152 Posts
    • 533 Thanks
    AstroTurtle
    • #7
    • 12th Mar 18, 3:46 PM
    • #7
    • 12th Mar 18, 3:46 PM
    My comments above.
    Originally posted by tenchy



    Come on.. You really think the Big Banks aren't actively trading in Bitcoin? Bank of America & JP Morgan had been advising on investment opportunities for the last 4 years in Bitcoin.


    The difference here is we have had a lot of people using Credit Cards to pay money across to these Social Trading companies, Which then lock trading prices, Disable withdrawals and hike up min deposits in recent months following the major surge in Bitcoin interest.


    Credit card companies already dislike people withdrawing cash from credit which is why it has negative impacts on credit score & high APR's.


    Add into that equation that for example Mike. Puts £5,000 from his credit card into Etoro to trade bitcoin at £18,000 back in December 1 month later his £5,000 investment is now worth £2,300 and he cant sell his position because the broker has locked withdrawals. So now he has £2,700 lost and a debt to repay with less capital.


    Whose money is really being gambled? The banks. hence why they are trying to discourage credit card use (Like Lloyds have) and extra checks on money being sent to these companies.


    A High rate in fraud has occurred since Bitcoin evolved. If someone clones your card details online now. Quickly spends a medium sized amount to appear genuine and then buys Bitcoin (An Untraceable easily resold Crypto) and then bam untraceable money in exchange and an easy crime committed.




    I'm not saying banks are saints, but I'm also saying that a simple card transaction being blocked is not highly out the ordinary.




    Banks and card companies prevented £475.7 million of card fraud in the first half of 2016, equivalent to £6 in every £10 of attempted fraud being prevented before a loss happens. Within the overall amount, losses on purchases made using a card remotely - those made online, over the phone or by mail order - rose 31 per cent to £224.1 million.1


    The number of remote purchase fraud incidents rose 53 per cent. As part of that figure, e-commerce card fraud totalled an estimated £156.0 million, a rise of 46 per cent since the same time in 2015
    :http://uk.creditcards.com/credit-card-news/uk-britain-credit-debit-card-statistics-international.php
    • takman
    • By takman 13th Mar 18, 2:53 PM
    • 3,387 Posts
    • 2,987 Thanks
    takman
    • #8
    • 13th Mar 18, 2:53 PM
    • #8
    • 13th Mar 18, 2:53 PM
    Bitcoin is not illegal!!
    Originally posted by tenchy
    It's worth pointing out this has little to do with Bitcoin. The OP paid money to a company called "Uphold.com" and this is all the bank knows; they do not know what the money was for. A quick visit to the website shows you can many different crypto currencies and not just Bitcoin. So i would say this is more to do with a transaction to Uphold.com specifically which may have a high rate of fraud.

    Interesting you should say that: my son had talked about the not insignificant problems HSBC caused him by blocking his account (you know - out shopping and the debit card doesn't work) to his colleagues. A number of them had faced similar disruption on occasion, and a couple of them have now done just what you suggest. They keep a bank account for salary in and vital SO/DDs out, then on payday take out the balance and keep in in a safe at home, accumulating substantial funds in the process. Cash is king for them. If this catches on, the whole idea of KYC and paranoid money laundering protocols will have the exact opposite effect to that intended.
    Originally posted by tenchy
    That seems a pretty silly solution to simply withdraw and keep loads of cash at home. Any sensible person will go shopping with more than 1 card to pay for items. It's pretty simple to open another current account with a separate bank or at least a credit card to use.
    • 18cc
    • By 18cc 13th Mar 18, 4:14 PM
    • 528 Posts
    • 314 Thanks
    18cc
    • #9
    • 13th Mar 18, 4:14 PM
    • #9
    • 13th Mar 18, 4:14 PM
    i too had problems with lloyds blocking my account - back then it was my 'main' current account.

    In response i now have several accounts - one for salary in only, one for essential direct debits only (council tax etc), a third account for spending (includes a credit card) and a 4th for use when transferring savings around as accounts mature.
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