PCM Parking fine - Heath Parade NW9

Dhudds · 26 June 2018 at 9:18PM

Thanks to all nice people on this forum. I was caught by Mrs sunglasses for briefly stopping my car in Heath Parade in August 2017. She saw me getting off my car and started taking photos. I then received PCM UK parking charge notice of £60 to pay in 28 days.I wrote to PCM UK and demanded some documents and information from their site in order to challenge the validity of their PCN however as expected they ignored my request. Then another PCM letter asking for £100 with 14 days to pay. Then Gladstone solicitors sent a letter asking for £160 with 14 days to pay. I wrote to Gladstones and explained my reasons why their ticket is not valid but as expected they are waste of time.
The last letter I had from Gladstone asked for £160 to be paid within 14 days otherwise they took me to court so I started panicking and spent sometime in preparing my defence report however I didn't hear from them for past 5 months until recently I received a letter before claim (LBC). I read the government website and they advised people to respond to this letter. I've now extracting some sentences from my defence report so i can reply to their LBC.
I don't get help from anywhere. I'm on my own with my own research and relying on good people on this website. I wonder if someone can send me the notice from Barnet council confirming that the site is under their control as well as a copy of the land registry. Also are you suggesting that I reply to their letter before claim or should I ignore them?

The_Slithy_Tove · 26 June 2018 at 9:24PM

Never ignore a Letter Before Claim.

Not sure when Barnet Council took over that land, but if it was after the date of your parking charge, then it's irrelevant to this matter.

I'm sure you're already aware that there are plenty of Heath Parade threads if you go back a bit. Suggest you find them and sift through them for the correct responses to Gladstones.

Dhudds · 26 June 2018 at 9:32PM

Thanks. How much details I need to put in LBC?

KeithP · 26 June 2018 at 9:36PM

Dhudds wrote: »

Thanks. How much details I need to put in LBC?

Read post #2 of the NEWBIES FAQ sticky thread where you will find links to sample robust LBC responses.

Maybe slightly adjust one of those to more precisely fit your circumstances.

Umkomaas · 26 June 2018 at 9:52PM

Respond to the LBC as per Keith's advice above.

Have they fully complied with the requirements of the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (PaP)? If not, go through the PaP and require them to provide (hard copies, not a link to their website portal) anything and everything to which you are entitled.

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/pdf/protocols/debt-pap.pdf

Umkomaas · 26 June 2018 at 10:01PM

I'm sure there are previous Heath Parade cases that have been successfully defended through the courts. Just need to do some digging here and PePiPoo @OP for them.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?act=SF&s=&f=60

Whilst not binding on any subsequent court case, they can be persuasive, and should be referred to in dealing with this claim.

Dhudds · 26 June 2018 at 10:09PM

Thanks. Gladstomes suggested using their online portal. If not they also offer paper version however they only give me until end of June to reply. As you suggested I don't want to use their portal system. Should I request a paper version or should I just use the link that you suggested.
and print off page 10 to 13 and Tick Box D and Box I only and request all details and documents I need.
Should I also use Loadsofchildren123's letter as an attachment for the required documents.
The letter is:
Dear Sirs,

Thank you for your letter of x.!!

When your client's debt collectors first started contacting me, I asked them for details of the basis upon which money was being claimed, including all photographs taken of the vehicle at the relevant time. Extraordinarily, I was told (in blunt terms) by [name of debt collectors] that no such evidence would be provided "until this gets to court" [try and reproduce the exact words used].!!

You have now sent a Letter Before Claim. However, your letter contains insufficient detail of the claim and, again, fails to provide the photographic evidence which I requested as long ago as [date - if you don't know exact date, put the month and year]. It does not even say what the cause of action is. Nor does it contain any mention of what evidence your client intends to rely on, or enclose copies of such evidence.!

This action on the part of your client is a clear breach of its pre-action obligations set out in the Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct, with which as solicitors you must surely be familiar (and with which your client, a serial litigator of small claims, must also be familiar). As you (and your client) must know, the Practice Direction binds all potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time.!!
Nobody, including your client, is immune from the requirements and obligations of the Practice Direction. Your client cannot simply refuse to provide the relevant information "until this gets to court" [or whatever they said].!
I require your client to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:

1. an explanation of the cause of action!
2. whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. what the details of the claim are (where it is claimed the car was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated, what contractual breach (if any) is being claimed)
5. a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim
6. a copy of any alleged contract with the driver
7. a plan showing where any signs were displayed
8. details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
9. If they have added anything on to the original charge, what that represents and how it has been calculated.
I am clearly entitled to this information under paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c) of the Practice Direction. I also need it in order to comply with my own obligations under paragraph 6(b).

If your client does not provide me with this information then I put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of!Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) !!!8211; Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855!in asking the court to impose sanctions on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant to paragraphs 13 ,15(b) and (c) and 16. I will draw to the court the fact that I have expressly requested this information since as early as [date or month/year of first request] yet your client has refused to provide it, saying that it will not do so until this matter reaches the court.!!

Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.

Yours faithfully etc.

KeithP · 26 June 2018 at 10:16PM

You don't need to return any forms.

As advised, just send a LBC robust response asking for all the things you are entitled to and which they have failed to provide.

Dhudds · 26 June 2018 at 11:32PM

OK, great. I will.Thank you again

Dhudds · 27 June 2018 at 10:24AM

Hi Keith,

I was reading the deb-pap.pdf from the link sent by UmKomaas above at page 4 section 4.1 it says that the debtor should use the Reply Form in Annex 1and request copies of any documents. Any suggestion on this please.

The_Deep · 27 June 2018 at 10:31AM

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, and another company have already been named and shamed, as has Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each year). They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

Hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned.

The problem has become so rampant that MPs have agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. Watch the video of the Second Reading in the HofC recently.

http://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/2f0384f2-eba5-4fff-ab07-cf24b6a22918?in=12:49:41

and complain in the most robust terms to your MP. With a fair wind they will be out of business by Christmas.

PCM Parking fine - Heath Parade NW9

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