Parking Eye - Defence for County Court Claim help please

aybeebeewhy · 4 April 2017 at 5:02PM

Hi all

I've trawled this forum and many others for advice, and have had a phone call with one person with a similar issue at the same location (thank you Guy), in an effort to prepare my defence, but I have to say I'm going round in circles somewhat and would be grateful for your collective expert input!

On 12 July last year, I "parked" in a Parking Eye managed car park at the White Horse in Rottingdean - oh yes I have seen the many complaints about this car park now!

Essentially, I wasn't actually parked but I entered the "property" for a total of 11 minutes when I pulled off the highway to comfort my child who had been choking in his baby seat in the back of the car just moments before. It is a busy road and the first place I could swing in to get off the road to comfort him.

I appealed my ticket, and lost. And then did a POPLA appeal and again lost.

I didn't do a brilliantly written defence, quoted no legisation, etc etc as I basically I made the mistake of assuming my appeal would be read by a human with a heart who would understand my need to pull in quickly to deal with a distressed child, and not to pause to read in depth the Parking Notices and their terms and conditions, or indeed subseqently purchase a parking ticket "after the event".

Anyway, I have now received County Court Claim dated 27 March 2017, (after failing to respond quickly enough to the LBCCC dated 02 March) so need to prepared my defence.

I don't much feel like handing over £175 for 11 minutes (the pub have confirmed a ticket for this duration would have cost me £1.50) when I wasn't even occupying a parking space without a bit of a fight!

Anyway, accpeting that I made a hash of my initial appeal and my POPLA appeal (reading the posts of others I do know this so please go easy on me!) I am wondering if my case is at all salvagable and would be grateful for input.

TIA

Coupon-mad · 5 April 2017 at 12:34AM

Yes, a defence can start from scratch and cover the bases you missed at appeal. This is worth fighting.

The main point in your defence - apart from the sporadically placed signs which are far from obvious - seems to me to be the Grace Period requirement in the BPA Code of Practice which states that there must be a grace period for a driver to decide whether to stay or go and that grace period to leave, must be a MINIMUM of ten minutes (not a maximum).

It follows that 11 minutes cannot be unreasonable, where the bare minimum time allowable is ten minutes, even for a person with no mitigating circs like you do. Pulling off the road to quickly sort out a distressed child is a situation which can be dangerous on the busy coast road and around there it's not a place with lots of options, no lay bys or anything (I know the road in question).

Search the forum for 'Kelvin Reynolds observation period' and use his words, he speaks for the BPA on the subject and the BPA are the Trade Body for ParkingEye.

Finally, about 18 months ago I recall from the trusted poster called IamEmanresu, that there was a BPA/DVLA forum meeting where it was AGREED that the grace period would in fact be stated as a minimum of 11 minutes in future. You need the minutes of that meeting but it can wait till your evidence/Witness Statement in a couple of months, before the hearing.

You could email the DVLA under FOI and ask for the minutes of any meeting with the DVLA, and/or emails or any communications exchanged, regarding grace periods and in particular the agreement in 2015 to change private parking grace periods in the BPA Code, to not less than 11 minutes, in line with Council car parks.

aybeebeewhy · 5 April 2017 at 6:58AM

Brilliant. Thank you so much Coupon-mad. I was very much hoping you'd see this!
I thought 11 minutes seemed incredibly harsh as had assumed there would be a grace period - hence not even thinking a ticket would be necessary. I had stopped longer than I thought - I actually thought it was just couple of minutes but ANPR shows otherwise but I guess time flies when you have an inconsolable child!
Is my first step to just return the acknowledgement of service? Then do I not have just 14 days to submit my defence? Or can I add to it before the court date??
thanks again.

aybeebeewhy · 5 April 2017 at 4:12PM

Thank you

I found the minutes of the meeting. Sadly as a newbie i cant post the link for others but happy to provide if someone else wants to post it?

Also found a news article from Jan this year about a woman stung with a £100 parking eye fine, in which there is a quote from Parking Eye saying they adhere to the BPA guidance on grace periods. It mentions she overstayed their "11 minute grace period" so I wondered whether to include it as "evidence" of the fact they allow 11 minutes grace.

Guys_Dad · 5 April 2017 at 5:15PM

aybeebeewhy wrote: »

Thank you

I found the minutes of the meeting. Sadly as a newbie i cant post the link for others but happy to provide if someone else wants to post it?

Also found a news article from Jan this year about a woman stung with a £100 parking eye fine, in which there is a quote from Parking Eye saying they adhere to the BPA guidance on grace periods. It mentions she overstayed their "11 minute grace period" so I wondered whether to include it as "evidence" of the fact they allow 11 minutes grace.

I would. Can do no harm, but get a copy of the downloaded article, not just a transcript that you have done yourself.

guydorrell · 5 April 2017 at 6:35PM

Hi Aybeebeewhy, glad you're getting the advice you need, and nice to chat - Coupon-mad rocks!
So, I just had a call from the Brighton Argus, who I'd approached a while back after a local councillor suggested it. This case is so clear cut and simply a matter of a parent looking after their child that it is disgustingly amoral of the company to be prosecuting. Submit your acknowledgement and you can include a comment for consideration by them at that stage (I think, please correct if wrong!) but like I said, amazed that they're pursuing this. So, I'll give you a call tomorrow if that's ok but in the meantime does anyone else have horror story tickets from PE, particularly from this Rottingdean site but also elsewhere in the general Brighton area. If so, please drop me a line with a paragragh about your case and ALL your contact details and only do this if you're happy to have a journalist call you. They may well consider some anonymous contributions but will mostly want people happy to be identified (as I am). Come on, step up everyone, let's find out how many innocent people have been stiffed for £100 by this company and land-owner and let's put some pressure on this site to be clearer in their signage and fairer in their attitude.

Coupon-mad · 5 April 2017 at 7:49PM

I'm in the Argus circulation area so I would be interested to see what they say. I am glad you found the minutes of the meeting proving the BPA's decision in 2015 to make the minimum Grace Period eleven minutes. Great evidence for a claim and also a later claim by you, for their misuse and misappropriation of your data without 'reasonable cause'.

aybeebeewhy · 5 April 2017 at 9:43PM

Maybe you should upgrade from the Argus to the Daily Mai Guy?

"Grandmother-slapped-100-fine-despite-NOT-parking"

The parking firm claim she stayed over their 11-minute 'grace period' and issued her with the fine.

A spokesperson for ParkingEye said: 'ParkingEye adheres to the British Parking Association's guidelines on grace periods and as the driver overstayed beyond this period a parking charge was incurred.
'ParkingEye operates an audited appeals process and encourages people to appeal if they feel there are mitigating circumstances.
'If a motorist disagrees with our decision they have the option to appeal to the independent appeals service (POPLA).
'In this case the driver did appeal to POPLA, who upheld our original decision.'

gill33uk · 5 April 2017 at 9:55PM

This is great, my 10 min and 48 second stay without actually parking may stand a chance, love this forum

aybeebeewhy · 5 April 2017 at 10:09PM

FOI request submitted to DVLA...

@gill33uk - hope so for both of us!

Lamilad · 6 April 2017 at 2:20AM

I found the minutes of the meeting. Sadly as a newbie i cant post the link for others but happy to provide if someone else wants to post it?

Paste the link changing http to hxxp. Someone will correct it for you

Parking Eye - Defence for County Court Claim help please

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